Newquay - Plymouth - Gatwick
Thread Starter
Newquay - Plymouth - Gatwick
Anyone know the latest situation re the BA routes that are under review and who if anyone mught take them over? They were certainly well loaded this week so surely someone will do it when the Dash 8's go?
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Earth
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Groundhog,
Current situation is this. BACX are trying to offload all turboprops, and the Dash8 is hopefully going to be aquired by Sutton Harbour Holdings. This is the company which owns Plymouth City Airport, and wishes to reform Brymon (or a new airline). Many ex Brymon staff have been approached / approached Sutton Harbour Holdings, which should mean they have a lot of staff available to them that are familier with route network that I'm sure the new airline would pick up.
As for any further info, that is unlikely to happen as any staff being interviewed/employeed are to sign a confidentiallity agreement.
I would like to see Brymon return, without BA, and see them become a quality regional outfit. Just hope for all that gain employment, that the job will be as fun as Brymon was.
Fosters Expat going back to sleep!
Current situation is this. BACX are trying to offload all turboprops, and the Dash8 is hopefully going to be aquired by Sutton Harbour Holdings. This is the company which owns Plymouth City Airport, and wishes to reform Brymon (or a new airline). Many ex Brymon staff have been approached / approached Sutton Harbour Holdings, which should mean they have a lot of staff available to them that are familier with route network that I'm sure the new airline would pick up.
As for any further info, that is unlikely to happen as any staff being interviewed/employeed are to sign a confidentiallity agreement.
I would like to see Brymon return, without BA, and see them become a quality regional outfit. Just hope for all that gain employment, that the job will be as fun as Brymon was.
Fosters Expat going back to sleep!
Brunel to Concorde
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Virtute et Industria, et Sumorsaete Ealle
Posts: 2,283
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
On the theme of west country to London, does anyone know how well the Ryanair Stansted-Newquay service has done since inception? Must be the first anniversary in a month or two.
Also, why does Exeter struggle to get a London service?
Also, why does Exeter struggle to get a London service?
Too mean to buy a long personal title
MerchantVenturer: Also, why does Exeter struggle to get a London service?
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 677
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Judging by the checkin queues during the summer Newquay seemed to be doing ok, not so sure how it's doing now, but there seem to be some good fares. It would attractive for those in London who want a quick break in Cornwall, but don't fancy the drive, mind you you still need to get to Stansted and get from St Mawgan to your destination.
From CAA stats for Nov 2002:
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/80/airport...e_Analysis.pdf
7576 passengers were carried on FR's STN-NQY service which would indicate a 67% load factor - not as high as FR's average, but still possibly above break even.
By contrast on LGW-NQY only 3376 passengers were carried a fall of 24% on the same month in Nov 2001. I don't have the frequency/capacity info to hand to work out load factors, but I guess lower than FR's but with a much higher yield.
From CAA stats for Nov 2002:
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/80/airport...e_Analysis.pdf
7576 passengers were carried on FR's STN-NQY service which would indicate a 67% load factor - not as high as FR's average, but still possibly above break even.
By contrast on LGW-NQY only 3376 passengers were carried a fall of 24% on the same month in Nov 2001. I don't have the frequency/capacity info to hand to work out load factors, but I guess lower than FR's but with a much higher yield.
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London
Posts: 389
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If a new Brymon does emerge, then I wish all concerned the best of luck.
However, as to the title of this thread, I can see BA getting rid of the turboprops (as planned), but would the LGW slots be available as well. It's only a matter of time before 50 seat operations into LGW become totally uneconomic in comparison to the value of peak-time slots, and any "new Brymon" would be hard-pressed to maintain these slots with this style of operation.
However, as to the title of this thread, I can see BA getting rid of the turboprops (as planned), but would the LGW slots be available as well. It's only a matter of time before 50 seat operations into LGW become totally uneconomic in comparison to the value of peak-time slots, and any "new Brymon" would be hard-pressed to maintain these slots with this style of operation.
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Jersey
Posts: 169
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Have it on good authority that flight deck bidding requests by PLH crews have been turned down. Only one request granted to BHX.
Perhaps all other crews are to be seconded to new airline!!!!
Perhaps all other crews are to be seconded to new airline!!!!
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Earth
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In Trim,
A very good point raised with regard to how available the slots would be into LGW. It will obviously depend on costs. LGW must have some slots after BA's mass exodus, but of course the Big Orange Machine came behind and snapped them all up. Currently BACX have four slots into LGW which they use for the PLH/NQY flights.
I can't see BA being that bothered about keeping them, because they seem to be reducing services at LGW, so they would more than likely sell them to Stellios.
The other question is how cost effective would a service from PLH/NQY to LGW be without the sales distribution of BA. Brymon by itself would have to market themselves, offering no onward connections, and obviuosly the cost of a ticket would be considerable. Currently PLH/NQY pax are offered free connecting flights if connecting to BA Longhaul services. It's just a thought?
Back to the Bunker!
A very good point raised with regard to how available the slots would be into LGW. It will obviously depend on costs. LGW must have some slots after BA's mass exodus, but of course the Big Orange Machine came behind and snapped them all up. Currently BACX have four slots into LGW which they use for the PLH/NQY flights.
I can't see BA being that bothered about keeping them, because they seem to be reducing services at LGW, so they would more than likely sell them to Stellios.
The other question is how cost effective would a service from PLH/NQY to LGW be without the sales distribution of BA. Brymon by itself would have to market themselves, offering no onward connections, and obviuosly the cost of a ticket would be considerable. Currently PLH/NQY pax are offered free connecting flights if connecting to BA Longhaul services. It's just a thought?
Back to the Bunker!
Brunel to Concorde
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Virtute et Industria, et Sumorsaete Ealle
Posts: 2,283
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks everyone for the replies to my FR STN-NQY and EXT-LON questions.
I am surprised that FR has a 67% load factor on that route in November, even with rock bottom prices. I thought it would struggle in the winter.
Off topic I am afraid, but brabazon asked about bmibaby's load factors in the 'bmibaby Routes from MAN thread'. I did a bit of calculating on their CWL operation and put in some figures in the bmibaby MAN thread. Don't know if you saw it.
I am surprised that FR has a 67% load factor on that route in November, even with rock bottom prices. I thought it would struggle in the winter.
Off topic I am afraid, but brabazon asked about bmibaby's load factors in the 'bmibaby Routes from MAN thread'. I did a bit of calculating on their CWL operation and put in some figures in the bmibaby MAN thread. Don't know if you saw it.
Thread Starter
Out of imterest I was at the airport when FR loaded last week and it certainly wasn't full, whilst I didn't count the pax I reckon about 50/60 boarded which isn't at all bad for a February departure. Interestingly the BA Gatwick flights were almost full in both directions.
Re Exeter - London the point made is correct, on a good day I can drive from home between Falmouth/Truro ( Newquay) to London in about 5 hours, from Exeter it takes about 3. The train is worse because as stated everything falls apart after Exeter.
I wish Brymon 2 or whoever all the best and why the hell doesn't someone do Newquay - Swansea/Cardiff, again a four hour drive but a very short flight. I did suggest it to Air Wales but they did not seem interested with other expansion plans they have underway.
THERE IS A MARKET FOR IT and if anyone doubts it I have the proof - for a fee!
Re Exeter - London the point made is correct, on a good day I can drive from home between Falmouth/Truro ( Newquay) to London in about 5 hours, from Exeter it takes about 3. The train is worse because as stated everything falls apart after Exeter.
I wish Brymon 2 or whoever all the best and why the hell doesn't someone do Newquay - Swansea/Cardiff, again a four hour drive but a very short flight. I did suggest it to Air Wales but they did not seem interested with other expansion plans they have underway.
THERE IS A MARKET FOR IT and if anyone doubts it I have the proof - for a fee!
Brunel to Concorde
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Virtute et Industria, et Sumorsaete Ealle
Posts: 2,283
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
GROUNDHOG,
Nice to get some first hand local south west reporting.
Is FR using 738s or 732s on the NQY service?
For the past few summers there has been daily (possibly not Sundays) Isles of Scilly Airbus DH6 flight from Scilly to BRS and back. Does it go via NQY? If so can tickets be purchased for the NQY-BRS legs and back?
I know NQY is an RAF base but I believe Sutton Holdings operates the civil side there. Is there any possibility of NQY being developed into an airport for Plymouth or is it too far away?
I understand their South Hams proposal has as much chance as the oft-suggested Severnside airport - none.
Nice to get some first hand local south west reporting.
Is FR using 738s or 732s on the NQY service?
For the past few summers there has been daily (possibly not Sundays) Isles of Scilly Airbus DH6 flight from Scilly to BRS and back. Does it go via NQY? If so can tickets be purchased for the NQY-BRS legs and back?
I know NQY is an RAF base but I believe Sutton Holdings operates the civil side there. Is there any possibility of NQY being developed into an airport for Plymouth or is it too far away?
I understand their South Hams proposal has as much chance as the oft-suggested Severnside airport - none.
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Earth
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Merchant,
I have heard that Sutton Harbour Holdings may have recently sold their interest in NQY? Not sure how corect this info is, as I have been unable to find any confirmation in the media.
Newquay to Plymouth by road is approx 1hr-1hr30mins depending on traffic....... And the roads are not the best for certain parts of the drive. I don't think tht NQY would have the catchment area to be honest, but then again I can't believe that South Hams International has the catchment area either.
Exeter is in direct competition with BRS, not PLH, and the drive between the two is only say 20mins, give or take a bit either way.
Bristol is already established, and South Hams is just a pipe dream....... Likely to stay that way as well, unless Plymouth City Council can sell some traffic lights, you won't ever see it.
(PLH City Council like traffic lights by the way........)
Back To The Bunker!
I have heard that Sutton Harbour Holdings may have recently sold their interest in NQY? Not sure how corect this info is, as I have been unable to find any confirmation in the media.
Newquay to Plymouth by road is approx 1hr-1hr30mins depending on traffic....... And the roads are not the best for certain parts of the drive. I don't think tht NQY would have the catchment area to be honest, but then again I can't believe that South Hams International has the catchment area either.
Exeter is in direct competition with BRS, not PLH, and the drive between the two is only say 20mins, give or take a bit either way.
Bristol is already established, and South Hams is just a pipe dream....... Likely to stay that way as well, unless Plymouth City Council can sell some traffic lights, you won't ever see it.
(PLH City Council like traffic lights by the way........)
Back To The Bunker!
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: EGJJ
Posts: 224
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I dont know what sort of car FE has but he will have to break the legal speed limit by a long way if he thinks you can drive from Exeter to Bristol in 20mins!!! It is 50nm+ direct track. It wil take between 1 to 1hr30mins. to drive.
Brunel to Concorde
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Virtute et Industria, et Sumorsaete Ealle
Posts: 2,283
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks everyone for the updates.
BTW I took it that Fosters Expat meant 20 mins for the drive between Plymouth and Exeter - even that is going some, I grant you.
Unless the M 5 is suffering one of its frequent blockages it is usually possible to drive from EXT to BRS in about an hour - the worst bit is the last 15 miles or so to BRS up the A 38 with over-the-top speed restrictions for most of the way on that piece of road.
BTW I took it that Fosters Expat meant 20 mins for the drive between Plymouth and Exeter - even that is going some, I grant you.
Unless the M 5 is suffering one of its frequent blockages it is usually possible to drive from EXT to BRS in about an hour - the worst bit is the last 15 miles or so to BRS up the A 38 with over-the-top speed restrictions for most of the way on that piece of road.
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Ireland
Posts: 1,621
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What's in a name?
I was thinking about possible names for this new "Brymon Mk II" carrier and stuck a few permutations into the whois search engine. The Brymon domain name is still registered to BA (though maybe they'd give it up as part of the deal). Westcountryair.com and aircornwall.com are still available. But - here's the interesting one - airsouthwest.com is already registered (since January 2003)...to someone mentioned on the Sutton Harbour Holdings website! Maybe this is old news to folks in the area, but I haven't seen it mentioned elsewhere. So it's to be Air Southwest then if it's not Brymon? Best of luck, anyway, whatever the name!
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: IOM & GLA
Posts: 116
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm planning to move down to Cornwall sometime in the summer & "commute" on my ID90s NQY-LGW-NQY.....
Any info on car parking at NQY, which flights to avoid, etc etc would be greatly appreciated
Any info on car parking at NQY, which flights to avoid, etc etc would be greatly appreciated
Last edited by CandyBender; 6th Mar 2003 at 16:52.
Thread Starter
MV...
Recent FR flights I have seen have been with the -800...
I am not aware you can fly NQY - BRS but could easily be wrong about that.... as CF reports SERCO are taking over trhe running of NQY from 01st April. NQY also covers the City of Truro, Penzance and Falmouth. From Truro it should take 1 to 1.5 hours to reach Plymouth but this can be 3 to 4 hours when the caravans arrive from 'up country' and on some trips I have even turned round and given up - I cannot comment on South Hams as it is too far away!
Cyrano ... interesting about the name will keep an ear to the ground and report it anything heard.
Recent FR flights I have seen have been with the -800...
I am not aware you can fly NQY - BRS but could easily be wrong about that.... as CF reports SERCO are taking over trhe running of NQY from 01st April. NQY also covers the City of Truro, Penzance and Falmouth. From Truro it should take 1 to 1.5 hours to reach Plymouth but this can be 3 to 4 hours when the caravans arrive from 'up country' and on some trips I have even turned round and given up - I cannot comment on South Hams as it is too far away!
Cyrano ... interesting about the name will keep an ear to the ground and report it anything heard.
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: E London and Plymouth
Posts: 83
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Cyrano, so instead of a new Brymon Airways, maybe SHH are trying to re-start Air South West 
who started at Newquay as Newquay Air before moving to Exeter and Belfast as Air South West and then moving down the Devon Expressway to operate Bandits and a chieftain from Plymouth to Cork, Dublin and Manchester. The airline only survived about a year in Plymouth before ending all operations at about 1997.
I only ever saw one advert for Air South West's services in the local paper, the Evening Herald and I doubt that many people even new the airline operated from Plymouth. ASW once planned Stansted and Amsterdam routes using a shed. BA rarely advertise their services. This is unlike Air Wales who put adverts every day in the local paper and have offers such as £29 one way from Plymouth to Cork or Dublin which is one reason why the services should turn out to be a success and the ATR's should take over the routes from the current Avanti 1900's from the Summer schedules.
who started at Newquay as Newquay Air before moving to Exeter and Belfast as Air South West and then moving down the Devon Expressway to operate Bandits and a chieftain from Plymouth to Cork, Dublin and Manchester. The airline only survived about a year in Plymouth before ending all operations at about 1997.I only ever saw one advert for Air South West's services in the local paper, the Evening Herald and I doubt that many people even new the airline operated from Plymouth. ASW once planned Stansted and Amsterdam routes using a shed. BA rarely advertise their services. This is unlike Air Wales who put adverts every day in the local paper and have offers such as £29 one way from Plymouth to Cork or Dublin which is one reason why the services should turn out to be a success and the ATR's should take over the routes from the current Avanti 1900's from the Summer schedules.
A few questions:
1) Does anyone know where Malcolm Naylor, former MD of Brymon and deputy MD of FlyBe is at the moment? He is apparently still at FlyBe but has disappeared off the face of the earth.
2) Does anyone know what the "major project" which FlyBe have been working on for several months is?
3) Is it any coincidence that the fleet to be spun off from BA is the Dash Eight, already operated by FlyBe and maintained by BEAS Exeter?
4) Is it any coincidence that some of the BA routes from Southampton are operated by Dash Eight, where FlyBe is starting a new hub?
5) FlyBe's core fleet appears to be concentrating around the 146 and Dash Q400. It also would not appear to be a coincidence that passenger volumes on the Exeter routes are the least likely to be able to withstand an upgrade from the Dash Eight 200 to the Q400. What are FlyBe's long term plans for those routes?
Answers on a postcard to Blue Peter, BBC Television Centre, London.
If one surmises that the answers to questions 1,2,3,4,5 are linked, then it doesn't take a huge leap of faith to think about a new regional airline based in the southwest picking up all of FlyBe and BA CitiExpress' Dash Eight 200/300s plus routes and combining them under management of Monsieur Naylor.
1) Does anyone know where Malcolm Naylor, former MD of Brymon and deputy MD of FlyBe is at the moment? He is apparently still at FlyBe but has disappeared off the face of the earth.
2) Does anyone know what the "major project" which FlyBe have been working on for several months is?
3) Is it any coincidence that the fleet to be spun off from BA is the Dash Eight, already operated by FlyBe and maintained by BEAS Exeter?
4) Is it any coincidence that some of the BA routes from Southampton are operated by Dash Eight, where FlyBe is starting a new hub?
5) FlyBe's core fleet appears to be concentrating around the 146 and Dash Q400. It also would not appear to be a coincidence that passenger volumes on the Exeter routes are the least likely to be able to withstand an upgrade from the Dash Eight 200 to the Q400. What are FlyBe's long term plans for those routes?
Answers on a postcard to Blue Peter, BBC Television Centre, London.
If one surmises that the answers to questions 1,2,3,4,5 are linked, then it doesn't take a huge leap of faith to think about a new regional airline based in the southwest picking up all of FlyBe and BA CitiExpress' Dash Eight 200/300s plus routes and combining them under management of Monsieur Naylor.