Airlines, Airports & Routes Topics about airports, routes and airline business.

Thomas Cook-2

Old 19th Sep 2019, 09:06
  #701 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: STANSTED & MANCHESTER
Posts: 1,740
Let’s keep it Friendly please, we are all entitled to our own opinion and views.

daz211 is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 11:45
  #702 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 103
Originally Posted by davidjohnson6 View Post
I am somewhat dubious that the Chapter 15 bankruptcy filing in the USA will be sufficient for the CDDC to decide that a credit event has occurred and thus rule that credit default swaps owned by the hedge funds (who also own bonds) will be triggered. A court filing in Europe would be rather more convincing of a genuine bankruptcy credit event. The CDDC got a bad rap for the way it handled Sears in 2018 - they will presumably want to show greater transparency to the financial markets this time round - although sadly they won't care a bit about the 20,000 TC employees whose jobs are on the line

Thomas Cook has relatively few assets in the USA - all traffic there is inbound tourism, and its hotels are in a mix of Africa, Asia and Europe. Furthermore, the filing with the court makes no mention of the word 'insolvent'. Thomas Cook does not have a registered office in the USA. I think the CDDC might view this as a sham bankruptcy and thus decide that the CDS protection should *not* be triggered which would then make the hedge funds holding the bonds potentially inclined to vote against any restructuring unless Fosun sweetend the deal for the bond holders. 5 year CDS rates on Thomas Cook have not substantially changed in the last 48 hours based on quotes on Bloomberg - although bid/ask spreads are admittedly very wide

I am inclined to think that the survival of TC beyond 1st October will be decided substantially by last minute horse-trading that goes on during the very last few days of September
Interesting. TC are in a weird place were being declared insolvent in one area but not another is to their benefit. I know they will be keeping the CAA abreast of all the ups and downs of the proceedings. However, since the ATOL license expires at midnight 30/09-01/10 there is a danger that things may slip too late for all the bits to line-up. Further, the CAA will be none to happy about the expenditure of preparing for a shut-down, which will rise rapidly as 01/10 approaches. I seem to recall the Monarch preparations in 2016 costing millions. Will definitely stay tuned.

pholling is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 12:50
  #703 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Northumberland
Posts: 4,457
Thomas Cook has relatively few assets in the USA - all traffic there is inbound tourism,
Really? My recently flights have been pretty cosmopolitan, plenty of our cousins on board.
SWBKCB is online now  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 14:23
  #704 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: The Midlands
Age: 35
Posts: 145
CDDC have adjourned their meeting until Monday at the earliest according to Reuters.

CDDC didn't give anything away, nor give any indication of what happened, only saying; "The EMEA DC met today to consider the DC question and agreed to meet again at 12.00pm London time on Monday 23 September to consider the DC question further."

Looks like next week is going to be pivotal then, with the CDDC ruling quickly followed by creditors discussing and voting on the Fosun takeover bid.
diffident is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 15:12
  #705 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: U.K
Posts: 504
There's been at least one aircraft handling request to operate flights from MAN-TFS on an A380 for 2 weeks, so it appears the CAA are already putting the wheels in motion.
The96er is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 16:55
  #706 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: london
Posts: 65
Originally Posted by The96er View Post
There's been at least one aircraft handling request to operate flights from MAN-TFS on an A380 for 2 weeks, so it appears the CAA are already putting the wheels in motion.
Lots of unusual handling requests for early morning arrivals on October 1st at LGW.
HiFly A380 ex BYJ
Titan B752 ex STN
BA Cityflyer E190 ex SEN
Atlas Air B744 ex SNN
Turkish A330 ex IST (with an irregular flight number)
National B752 ex YQX
Grand Cru A320 ex VNO

Hope it’s all egg on the face stuff for the CAA much like Monarch in 2016

nowhereasfiled is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 17:16
  #707 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: The Midlands
Age: 35
Posts: 145
Sky News are now reporting as breaking news that Thomas Cook is trying to fire-sale its Nordic operations in a bid to raise capital - Sky News

I can see that as being a logical move to replenish much needed capital, but surely that will considerably drop the valuation of the company where Fosun's purchase is concerned??

It gets more complicated by the hour.
diffident is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 19:08
  #708 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Derbyshire
Posts: 17
I just hope the proverbial 'rabbit' can be pulled out of the hat, and it's just going to have to go to the wire. The industry has lost too many big names, over the years, a lot of people are employed by the Thomas Cook Group of companies, just hope that it all finally works out.
Mr Airtours is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 21:07
  #709 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: STANSTED & MANCHESTER
Posts: 1,740
I hope it all gets sorted but how many time can we get to autumn and have yet another Groundhog Day.
If Thomas Cook gets through yet another tough winter things have to change in a big way or this time next year we will be having the same conversation.
daz211 is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 21:34
  #710 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Oban, Scotland
Posts: 1,183
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49761464

Not looking good. The banks want another £200million.
inOban is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 22:40
  #711 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Newcastle
Posts: 244
Originally Posted by inOban View Post
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49761464

Not looking good. The banks want another £200million.
Also reports coming out that they could be in administration by the weekend if some emergency funding is not received. Hopefully not true.
JonnyH is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 22:49
  #712 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: london
Posts: 65
“Parkway Holdco” set up by Thomas Cook management and registered with Companies House.

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/c...08064/officers

EDIT:
There 2 companies. Parkway Holdco 1 & 2 unsurprisingly.
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/c...05789/officers
Wonder what’s happening.
nowhereasfiled is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 23:06
  #713 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: The Midlands
Age: 35
Posts: 145
Originally Posted by nowhereasfiled View Post
“Parkway Holdco” set up by Thomas Cook management and registered with Companies House.

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/c...08064/officers

EDIT:
There 2 companies. Parkway Holdco 1 & 2 unsurprisingly.
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/c...05789/officers
Wonder what’s happening.
Standard procedure for breaking up a company. Viable stuff that can be sold on into one, non-viable stuff that is 'toxic' into the other.
diffident is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 23:36
  #714 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Bristol,
Posts: 15
Originally Posted by nowhereasfiled View Post
“Parkway Holdco” set up by Thomas Cook management and registered with Companies House.

Wonder what’s happening.
Remember something similar happening with monarch, really hope it isn't near the end.
louelle100 is offline  
Old 19th Sep 2019, 23:38
  #715 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: South of MAN, North of BHX, and well clear of Stoke ;-)
Posts: 487
Originally Posted by nowhereasfiled View Post


Lots of unusual handling requests for early morning arrivals on October 1st at LGW.
HiFly A380 ex BYJ
Titan B752 ex STN
BA Cityflyer E190 ex SEN
Atlas Air B744 ex SNN
Turkish A330 ex IST (with an irregular flight number)
National B752 ex YQX
Grand Cru A320 ex VNO

Hope it’s all egg on the face stuff for the CAA much like Monarch in 2016

‘it would only be egg on the face if the CAA were not prepared for all opportunities and situations; the Operation Yellow Hammer of aviation...
StoneyBridge Radar is offline  
Old 20th Sep 2019, 02:22
  #716 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Blighty
Posts: 3,663
Originally Posted by nowhereasfiled View Post
Lots of unusual handling requests for early morning arrivals on October 1st at LGW.
HiFly A380 ex BYJ
Titan B752 ex STN
BA Cityflyer E190 ex SEN
Atlas Air B744 ex SNN
Turkish A330 ex IST (with an irregular flight number)
National B752 ex YQX
Grand Cru A320 ex VNO


When Monarch went bust 2 years ago, it became clear after the event that meetings had been held at a high level with the CAA and Dept of Transport (possibly even involving the Prime Minister) weeks before the bankruptcy took place. It seemed very much as if this was a well co-ordinated plan to bring about a reasonably orderly closure and ensure repatratiion of Brits back to the UK

The handling requests for 1st October do indeed seem very unusual. Given the origins of the aircraft (e.g. A380 from HiFly's operations base at Beja in southern Portugal which has little or no passenger traffic) it seems as if the CAA and maybe also the German Bundesamt is planning on TC continuing to function until late on the evening of Monday 30 September, and then, if no deal can be found to keep TC going, in the very early hours (e.g. 3 am UK time) of 1st October when all aircraft are either on the ground or in the air flying back to their UK/German home base, declaring bankruptcy with the UK and maybe also German or Scandinavian courts

One might also note that the Conservative party conference (the political party currently in power in the UK if people reading this are not from the UK) is from 29 Sept to 2 October this year. Boris Johnson will be very keen that journalists will be focussing on what he has to say and pay minimal attention to Thomas Cook - thus necessitating ample planning / co-ordination around Thomas Cook

Last edited by davidjohnson6; 20th Sep 2019 at 02:38.
davidjohnson6 is online now  
Old 20th Sep 2019, 04:31
  #717 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 94
Surely they should stop flying people outbound immediately if they are only going to have to be rescued by the CAA next week.
GMEDX is offline  
Old 20th Sep 2019, 05:08
  #718 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: BHX
Posts: 276
Brigantee is offline  
Old 20th Sep 2019, 05:31
  #719 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Crawley
Posts: 333
Originally Posted by Brigantee View Post
wait until a decent newspaper reports it. Still waiting for that snow bomb that’s coming every year....
bycrewlgw is offline  
Old 20th Sep 2019, 05:39
  #720 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: BHX
Posts: 276
Originally Posted by bycrewlgw View Post


wait until a decent newspaper reports it. Still waiting for that snow bomb that’s coming every year....

How about the times ?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/t...200m-h52f0983n
Brigantee is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.