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Old 20th Sep 2018, 10:02
  #701 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by heading 125 View Post


well it's seems APD is firmly back on the Welsh Assemblies agenda and being raised by Andrew RT Davies as well as other AMs. As the airport is one of the major employers in Alun Cairnes constituency and as he is the Secretary of Estate for Wales I expect he'll support it for the airport and their employees through Westminster.
Alun Cairns has never supported APD being devolved to Wales and unless it suits him politically is never likely to.
I'd be surprised if any Westminster government devolved APD to Wales especially this one.
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Old 20th Sep 2018, 14:45
  #702 (permalink)  
 
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Surely he must support it as it is the biggest employer in his constituency and as secretary of estate of Wales he would be fighting to get it for Wales. It would be very surprising if he wasnít. Thatís what he is in post as the Vale MP and Welsh Secretary to do. The Northern Ireland and Scottish Secretaries have been successful for their regions why would Wales be any different.
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Old 20th Sep 2018, 14:53
  #703 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by heading 125 View Post
Surely he must support it as it is the biggest employer in his constituency and as secretary of estate of Wales he would be fighting to get it for Wales. It would be very surprising if he wasnít. Thatís what he is in post as the Vale MP and Welsh Secretary to do. The Northern Ireland and Scottish Secretaries have been successful for their regions why would Wales be any different.
He's a member of the UK government and the UK government doesn't support devolution of APD to Wales. As the local MP I'm sure he's supportive of the airport itself just not devolving APD.
I believe his reason is because the airport is in the South and North Wales won't benefit
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Old 24th Sep 2018, 21:06
  #704 (permalink)  
 
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CAA stats August 2018
202,405 passengers used the airport up 11.1%. The rolling year was 1,548,474 up 8% on 2017.
Atms were 1794 up 4.6%.
Freight was 219 tonnes. 211 tonnes set down and 8 tonnes picked up.
Top 10 routes for August 2018
1. Palma de Mallorca 21,308
2. Amsterdam 12,851
3. Doha 11,568
4. Dublin 10,540
5. Malaga 10,516
6. Alicante 10,413
7. Edinburgh 9973
8. Faro 9489
9. Paris CDG 8390
10. Dalaman 7974
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Old 24th Sep 2018, 21:20
  #705 (permalink)  
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Pretty impressive figures on the DOH route considering it is month 3 of the route and after all the initial negative press it had. That load is not far off the BHX-DOH which has been operating a few years and it has to be around 75% load factor for CWL so obviously the route is proving itself rather well.
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Old 24th Sep 2018, 21:31
  #706 (permalink)  
 
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You simply can't tell. 73% loadfactor isn't especially high for a long-haul service and there is every prospect that the yield isn't high as Cardiff has been included in every Qatar Airways low fare promotion going. You can easily fly services at 100% loadfactor and still lose money. What you can tell is that the service is not doing well from a cargo perspective. 8 tonnes uplifted from the entire airport in the month of August is dire. Given that cargo accounts for a good proportion of long-haul income, the absence of it certainly won't be helping the economics of the QR service but whether they're good, bad or indifferent to begin with would be pure guesswork.

Far far too early to be hanging out the bunting yet.
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Old 25th Sep 2018, 06:40
  #707 (permalink)  
 
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The numbers for Doha are very good especially as many people doubted the service should even exist. As for the yield we don't know what that is like for any airport Qatar Airways fly too. What is great is that Amsterdam is doing so well and not being effected passenger numbers wise.
As for cargo 8 tonnes sounds dire but we actually don't know what is being exported. The goods may well be lightweight and high volume
Also it's good to see Dublin back over 10,000 again!
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Old 25th Sep 2018, 07:54
  #708 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Flightrider View Post
You simply can't tell. 73% loadfactor isn't especially high for a long-haul service and there is every prospect that the yield isn't high as Cardiff has been included in every Qatar Airways low fare promotion going. You can easily fly services at 100% loadfactor and still lose money. What you can tell is that the service is not doing well from a cargo perspective. 8 tonnes uplifted from the entire airport in the month of August is dire. Given that cargo accounts for a good proportion of long-haul income, the absence of it certainly won't be helping the economics of the QR service but whether they're good, bad or indifferent to begin with would be pure guesswork.

Far far too early to be hanging out the bunting yet.
211 tonnes brought in though so not like thereís not a cargo operation there. Edi for comparison only dropped 10 tonnes and picked up 4 so Iím sure the route isnít performing too badly.

Yes yield is the main factor we all know that and itís been talked to death several times on here but the fares are comparible to the London airports so theyíre not heavily discounted. Of course CWL and Iím sure many other airports feature in the low fares promotions, itís a new route and is going to take time to bed in. The passenger figures show thereís a market. What do they say? Loss in 1st year, break even in 2nd and profit in 3rd?
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Old 25th Sep 2018, 08:33
  #709 (permalink)  
 
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That used to be the old CAA route licensing hearing principle and it no longer applies. Most airlines now are seeking a break even at worst in year one, profit by year two. Margins are so thin that you canít take short term losses in any magnitude.
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Old 25th Sep 2018, 10:50
  #710 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Flightrider View Post
That used to be the old CAA route licensing hearing principle and it no longer applies. Most airlines now are seeking a break even at worst in year one, profit by year two. Margins are so thin that you canít take short term losses in any magnitude.
So given that the figures have increased to 73% LF within 4 months there's still another 8 months to grow before it needs to break even. There has been some good deals from CWL, but also similar pricing with other carriers at other Airports. Various reports that the front end is also doing well and there's some cargo being carrier through which will certainly help yield. It wouldn't be a surprise if the operating costs are initially quite low at CWL in comparison to other Airports.
I do think this is a much longer term project though for QR and the Welsh Government. Things won't instantly change with the economy after a few months of a new route, but if it helps boost the Welsh economy, whether that be in additional business travel, more money to spend on holidays or increase in industry leading to more cargo, then eventually the results will be seen.
I was sceptical over this route, especially seeing as QR in general don't seem to have high LF's at other airports. But I must say I'm impressed on the results in such a short time. Hopefully it's sustainable through the winter and further beyond.
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Old 3rd Oct 2018, 06:50
  #711 (permalink)  
 
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Cardiff Airport posts first profit in 8 years of £7000.
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/business/business-news/cardiff-airport-profit-first-time-15228561
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Old 3rd Oct 2018, 18:57
  #712 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by PDXCWL45 View Post
Cardiff Airport posts first profit in 8 years of £7000.<br />
<br /> That's hardly something to boast about, they are still in the red, however next year will be even better.
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Old 3rd Oct 2018, 19:46
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Originally Posted by ensiferum23 View Post
<br /> That's hardly something to boast about, they are still in the red, however next year will be even better.
Who's boasting? It's news.
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Old 3rd Oct 2018, 19:58
  #714 (permalink)  
 
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however next year will be even better
I suspect that all depends on from whose budget the support for the Qatar Airways Doha service is coming. If it's from Cardiff Airport's coffers then I doubt the airport will show a profit.

A vanity project if ever I saw one.
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Old 3rd Oct 2018, 20:20
  #715 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Flightrider View Post
I suspect that all depends on from whose budget the support for the Qatar Airways Doha service is coming. If it's from Cardiff Airport's coffers then I doubt the airport will show a profit.

A vanity project if ever I saw one.
The only sort of 'support' is the marketing deal between the Welsh government and Qatar Airways. As for it being a vanity project would you say that if Qatar had gone to BRS or BFS or EXT?
It seems many people sadly seem quite bitter that Qatar choose Wales and Cardiff and are helping to boost inbound tourism into Wales and help the profile of the country and give it's people an opportunity to fly from Wales and not another country.
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Old 3rd Oct 2018, 21:20
  #716 (permalink)  
 
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I think that's exactly the point. Qatar would not have chosen BRS, BFS or EXT as none of the local funding authorities in those locations would have offered the magnitude of support required to secure the service. Had they done so, I would indeed have classed it as a vanity project. The fact remains that only CWL and the Welsh Government did. An increasing proportion of services at Cardiff only exist because of the terms offered which a commercial enterprise could not, in my view, afford to do. How this continues to escape state aid considerations is beyond belief.
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Old 4th Oct 2018, 03:48
  #717 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Flightrider View Post
I think that's exactly the point. Qatar would not have chosen BRS, BFS or EXT as none of the local funding authorities in those locations would have offered the magnitude of support required to secure the service. Had they done so, I would indeed have classed it as a vanity project. The fact remains that only CWL and the Welsh Government did. An increasing proportion of services at Cardiff only exist because of the terms offered which a commercial enterprise could not, in my view, afford to do. How this continues to escape state aid considerations is beyond belief.
Yes god forbid the Welsh government should be able to promote Wales and attract airlines to fly directly into Wales to the benefit of Wales.
All airports generally offer incentives to airlines to operate from them through various means so how is Cardiff any different from anywhere else the world over?
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Old 4th Oct 2018, 05:00
  #718 (permalink)  
 
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Because it's the government doing it - and offering advantages that aren't available to comptetitors.
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Old 4th Oct 2018, 05:02
  #719 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Flightrider View Post
I think that's exactly the point. Qatar would not have chosen BRS, BFS or EXT as none of the local funding authorities in those locations would have offered the magnitude of support required to secure the service. Had they done so, I would indeed have classed it as a vanity project. The fact remains that only CWL and the Welsh Government did. An increasing proportion of services at Cardiff only exist because of the terms offered which a commercial enterprise could not, in my view, afford to do. How this continues to escape state aid considerations is beyond belief.
rather than whinging in here why not contact the EU and put a complaint in? They can investigate it for you as youíre so sure about state aid. A simple google search will bring up the state aid complaint form. If you prefer I can post the link for you too.
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Old 4th Oct 2018, 05:15
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Originally Posted by SWBKCB View Post
Because it's the government doing it - and offering advantages that aren't available to comptetitors.
Yet none of those competitors have put in a complaint as far as anyone knows so they can't be that bothered about it or see Cardiff as competition or a threat.
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