BMI
Join Date: Apr 2004
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Wouldn't all those bmi staff be a lot happier if the UK could make the same decisions without foreign interference?
Yes they would, but the UK OFT have dodged the issue by referring it to the EU competition authority. Presumably so they can say' it wasn't us gov' it was them pesky Europeans.
Yes they would, but the UK OFT have dodged the issue by referring it to the EU competition authority. Presumably so they can say' it wasn't us gov' it was them pesky Europeans.
Join Date: Aug 2009
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I have to say that having been a BD employee for well over a decade I am not surprised that the takeover has been / is being handled in such a farcical manner.
The damage to the brand is not relevant because that will be lost anyway, but many loyal staff are being left in limbo, the company line has been "more information in the coming weeks" since the airline went up for sale nearly 6 months ago and although we know who the mainline buyer is we have absolutely no clue as to what will become of us, hardly worthy of their "investors in people" award!
I for one will be glad when the Eurocrats get their respective fingers out and make a decision.
The damage to the brand is not relevant because that will be lost anyway, but many loyal staff are being left in limbo, the company line has been "more information in the coming weeks" since the airline went up for sale nearly 6 months ago and although we know who the mainline buyer is we have absolutely no clue as to what will become of us, hardly worthy of their "investors in people" award!
I for one will be glad when the Eurocrats get their respective fingers out and make a decision.
So.... The BMI Regional thread has been merged into the mainline one???thanks for letting us know! Do the mods know something we don't???? Or have they lost all hope of BMIR being bought???? The mystery continues.....
Join Date: Aug 2011
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European Commission and BMI Purchase
Thanks Granite City Express you beat me to the EEA point, I was amazed how this wasn't taken into account in all those Swiss references. In the days of Swissair they lobbied furiously to their Governement worried about being outside the single market in aviation, and to enter an agreement with the EU, QED they are members of EEA, and have to implement all EU directives etc but have no representation or input whatsoever over these matters with the EU.
Trossie, foreign interference. As a UK natonal you are also a EU citizen, as stated on your passport, and the UK comissioners sit alongside all the other member states, except of course the EEA ones. So that's not a correct analysis.
As far as slots and feeds to LHR, it seems to me that DLH are doing very well feeding FRA, MUC and DUS from the UK regions. Big increase in pax last year for them from BHX & MAN. I do feel sorry however for all those at BMI, it really does seem very agonisng. I'll also miss BMI.
Trossie, foreign interference. As a UK natonal you are also a EU citizen, as stated on your passport, and the UK comissioners sit alongside all the other member states, except of course the EEA ones. So that's not a correct analysis.
As far as slots and feeds to LHR, it seems to me that DLH are doing very well feeding FRA, MUC and DUS from the UK regions. Big increase in pax last year for them from BHX & MAN. I do feel sorry however for all those at BMI, it really does seem very agonisng. I'll also miss BMI.
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It is in fact very silly, considering we have known for some time that they are to be split up as two different companies (unless BA takes on Regional, which everything points towards being very unlikely indeed).
Join Date: Dec 2011
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As for the actions of the regulatory authorities, it's called "passing the buck". Too difficult a decision? shuffle it off to Brussels.
The EU Parliament (or talking shop) is irrelevant for these purposes, most EU activity is determined by intergovernmental agreement: meetings of the prime ministers/presidents of EU countries.
There's always an excuse difficult decisions - or implementing a manifesto promise. For example:
"Nick Clegg won't let me have an EU referendum"
"The European Court won't let me deport alleged terrorists"
"The EU won't let me bail out BD, but I can bail out the banks"
Notice a trend?
The EU Parliament (or talking shop) is irrelevant for these purposes, most EU activity is determined by intergovernmental agreement: meetings of the prime ministers/presidents of EU countries.
There's always an excuse difficult decisions - or implementing a manifesto promise. For example:
"Nick Clegg won't let me have an EU referendum"
"The European Court won't let me deport alleged terrorists"
"The EU won't let me bail out BD, but I can bail out the banks"
Notice a trend?
Yes, another irrational europhobe
So we have 6 days to go before a final answer to all this speculation and an answer will be given? I really do hope so for the sake of the poor souls in BMI. This farce has dragged on for long enough and wasted so much money.
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They are causing enough problems with trade with China and the US with these so called emission taxes
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Oh dear, these irrational europhiles...!!
"Emissions trading" must be the biggest bureaucratic farce that exists: trading something that has disappeared into thin air!! (And the 'quantities' being determined by a new army of eurocrats....) And what good is it going to do? It'll chase all the transfer trade away from Europe: Why connect from North America to the East via any European hub and pay silly euro-pricing when you can go via the middle east and not pay that silly euro-pricing!! What-oh, kill off European busniness and sit there smugly saying "Look at how good and 'euro-green' we are!". In the mean time, jobs at bmi...? Oh, we'll get around to them sometime, may be a bit late by then, but -- hey -- look at these good euro-taxpayer funded jobs the we've got here at the Commission!! (And name a Commissionser that has the term 'democratic' spring to mind in connection with their jobs...?)
Good luck to the bmi staff, despite the EU!
"Emissions trading" must be the biggest bureaucratic farce that exists: trading something that has disappeared into thin air!! (And the 'quantities' being determined by a new army of eurocrats....) And what good is it going to do? It'll chase all the transfer trade away from Europe: Why connect from North America to the East via any European hub and pay silly euro-pricing when you can go via the middle east and not pay that silly euro-pricing!! What-oh, kill off European busniness and sit there smugly saying "Look at how good and 'euro-green' we are!". In the mean time, jobs at bmi...? Oh, we'll get around to them sometime, may be a bit late by then, but -- hey -- look at these good euro-taxpayer funded jobs the we've got here at the Commission!! (And name a Commissionser that has the term 'democratic' spring to mind in connection with their jobs...?)
Good luck to the bmi staff, despite the EU!
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Quote: "Yes, another irrational europhobe"
Not at all, Artie Fufkin, just the cold facts, am telling it like it is.
Obviously co-operation between European countries is desirable, but we don't need an interfering, nit-picking, self-serving, money-wasting bureacracy in Brussels, a gravy-train that cannot get its accounts audited. Suspending all payments to Brussels would solve the debt-crisis at a stroke.
You probably believe that the EU has "kept the peace" in Europe since 1957, not so. It is welfare states, increasing prosperity (despite the EU) and mass travel that has done this. It is inconcievable that European countries would go to war now, we all know each other thanks to travel and have too much at stake. It's a million miles from grinding poverty for the majority that characterised the warring Europe of the early 20th century.
Look at the EU now, its policies and interference in southern European countries is causing no end of distress and could threaten their stability.
Governments cannot offer aid to companies in trouble, and over-zealous intepretation of their pointless "directives" puts jobs at risk.
Monetary union for political rather than economic reasons is crippling the continent's economy. For all his faults, Gordon Brown played a blinder keeping us out of that particular mess.
Everything positive that the EU takes credit for could be done by agreement between individual governments, for example, a single European sky, common air traffic control and openskies arrangements with other countries.
That's brought the thread back to aviation!
As previously stated, the government cannot bail out BD, the EU prevents it. It is true that successive governments would probably have been dis-inclined to do so, but they should have the option!
Judging by the subsequent posts since you called me a "Euro-phobe", Artie Fufkin, it appears that you are on the wrong side of the argument!
Hope this helps
Not at all, Artie Fufkin, just the cold facts, am telling it like it is.
Obviously co-operation between European countries is desirable, but we don't need an interfering, nit-picking, self-serving, money-wasting bureacracy in Brussels, a gravy-train that cannot get its accounts audited. Suspending all payments to Brussels would solve the debt-crisis at a stroke.
You probably believe that the EU has "kept the peace" in Europe since 1957, not so. It is welfare states, increasing prosperity (despite the EU) and mass travel that has done this. It is inconcievable that European countries would go to war now, we all know each other thanks to travel and have too much at stake. It's a million miles from grinding poverty for the majority that characterised the warring Europe of the early 20th century.
Look at the EU now, its policies and interference in southern European countries is causing no end of distress and could threaten their stability.
Governments cannot offer aid to companies in trouble, and over-zealous intepretation of their pointless "directives" puts jobs at risk.
Monetary union for political rather than economic reasons is crippling the continent's economy. For all his faults, Gordon Brown played a blinder keeping us out of that particular mess.
Everything positive that the EU takes credit for could be done by agreement between individual governments, for example, a single European sky, common air traffic control and openskies arrangements with other countries.
That's brought the thread back to aviation!
As previously stated, the government cannot bail out BD, the EU prevents it. It is true that successive governments would probably have been dis-inclined to do so, but they should have the option!
Judging by the subsequent posts since you called me a "Euro-phobe", Artie Fufkin, it appears that you are on the wrong side of the argument!
Hope this helps
Yes causing problems, but not for you or I.
So this is the week that BMI personal find their futures? EU commissions will come to a decision? All other bodies will have made their minds up? Good luck to everyone concerned. I hope it's positive news for you.
Join Date: Mar 2008
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I can see and would expect that where bmi & BA had a duopoly and it now become a BA monopoly, then yes fares are bound to rise. In the UK this will only effect MAN EDI & ABZ, one world will become a monopoly from Belfast through Aer Lingus.
People often quote GLA but from a business point of view it makes sense to be using a 767 rather than two A320/19's and of course better use of the limited slots in to LHR, how much the alleged price increase on this route is down to increased fuel costs?
I can't imagine that the EU will try to force other competition on to these routes, bmi couldn't make them work as part of STAR and there was nothing wrong with the product
Time to bring this sorry saga to end
People often quote GLA but from a business point of view it makes sense to be using a 767 rather than two A320/19's and of course better use of the limited slots in to LHR, how much the alleged price increase on this route is down to increased fuel costs?
I can't imagine that the EU will try to force other competition on to these routes, bmi couldn't make them work as part of STAR and there was nothing wrong with the product
Time to bring this sorry saga to end
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MAN EDI & ABZ all have connections to hubs at AMS, BRU, CDG & FRA (with some connections to CPH too). What 'monopoly'? LHR is not the only 'hub' airport in the universe.
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Trossie
Agreed and that's my point, its only a monopoly in to LHR in addition there are many flights serving London's other airports from all these places, so i don't understand what the fuss is about?
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Surely this will affect us in the form of higher airfares!
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Agreed and that's my point, its only a monopoly in to LHR in addition there are many flights serving London's other airports from all these places, so i don't understand what the fuss is about?
MD
If BA were to withdraw from Dublin, it would be because they can't make any money flying there. Aer Lingus would therefore have a monopoly because of the workings of the free market rather than because of the ba/BMI take-over.
The EU can compel BA/IAG to make slots available to potential competitors on various routes, but it cannot compel competitors to lose money flying those services in competition to BA. We cannot lose sight of the fact that bmi has been losing money at an alarming rate and that, ultimately, is the reason why the take-over situation has developed to begin with! Why should others be able to make money on routes where bmi has presumably been losing heaps of it?
It is not unreasonable for the EU to ensure that people can compete if they want to, but the actual number of new airlines who will put that to the test - given that the LHR slots will be tied to the routes on which competition is deemed to be needed - will be remote, I think.
The EU can compel BA/IAG to make slots available to potential competitors on various routes, but it cannot compel competitors to lose money flying those services in competition to BA. We cannot lose sight of the fact that bmi has been losing money at an alarming rate and that, ultimately, is the reason why the take-over situation has developed to begin with! Why should others be able to make money on routes where bmi has presumably been losing heaps of it?
It is not unreasonable for the EU to ensure that people can compete if they want to, but the actual number of new airlines who will put that to the test - given that the LHR slots will be tied to the routes on which competition is deemed to be needed - will be remote, I think.