Bmibaby
My point about the bank being supportive is that if Granite or whoever else take in bmir, even with a handout from DLH / IAG to take on bmir, it is likely that Granite will need to borrow some cash from somewhere to cover losses until bmir is lobg term profitable. This could mean raising equity from current shareholders, talking to a venture capital fund, but it's likely the bulk of the cash will come from a bank. If the bank won't commit now to providing a loan facility in the next 2 years it puts much more risk on the shareholders - are the shareholders willing to accept the risk of possible over expansion ?
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Flypuppy
I was referring to a Terms sheet agreement.
Re Regional I think that the deal re Granite was announced in what Oct or Nov? and seems to have stalled, the rumours are that Granite would get £2 of assets for every £1 invested,so for an investor it's double your money apart that is from ensuring that it at leasts breaks even.
I don't think the Scottish card comes into it. Bmir may have its operational head office in ABZ but it's run from the Midlands like or not or more accurately FRA. There is no shortage of flights between Scotland & England so I doubt the competion people will be concerned one way or the other, access to LHR is of course another matter, but we are all Europeans now so LHR is to be viewed the same as AMS BRU CDG FRA and let's face it many choose to avoid LHR.
Speaking strictly from a pilots point of view many may be better off within IAG let's face it a back door into BA would be a result that few could have dreamt of!
Re Regional I think that the deal re Granite was announced in what Oct or Nov? and seems to have stalled, the rumours are that Granite would get £2 of assets for every £1 invested,so for an investor it's double your money apart that is from ensuring that it at leasts breaks even.
I don't think the Scottish card comes into it. Bmir may have its operational head office in ABZ but it's run from the Midlands like or not or more accurately FRA. There is no shortage of flights between Scotland & England so I doubt the competion people will be concerned one way or the other, access to LHR is of course another matter, but we are all Europeans now so LHR is to be viewed the same as AMS BRU CDG FRA and let's face it many choose to avoid LHR.
Speaking strictly from a pilots point of view many may be better off within IAG let's face it a back door into BA would be a result that few could have dreamt of!
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Montezuma
Bmi is to be intergrated into BA not IAG 6 months from now bmi will not exsist all bmi slots will be flown by BA tails. I if you think otherwise let's hear your vision of how this will unfold?
IAG is an holding company not an airline!!
IAG is an holding company not an airline!!
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Why don't some of you do some research before posting? The buyer for bmi is still not precisely determined, according to the papers submitted to the EU Competition Comission:
"International Airlines Group (IAG) and LHBD Holding Limited entered into an
agreement on 22 December 2011 pursuant to which IAG – directly or via its
subsidiary BA – will acquire from LHBD Holding Limited 100% of the shares of
British Midland Limited (bmi)."
So either eventuality remains a possibility. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the actual purchaser is determined by the existence of baby and/or regional within the bmi group at the time of purchase.
"International Airlines Group (IAG) and LHBD Holding Limited entered into an
agreement on 22 December 2011 pursuant to which IAG – directly or via its
subsidiary BA – will acquire from LHBD Holding Limited 100% of the shares of
British Midland Limited (bmi)."
So either eventuality remains a possibility. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the actual purchaser is determined by the existence of baby and/or regional within the bmi group at the time of purchase.
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If you really believe that the Scottish Government are going to just let BA/IAG close down a Scottish airline with out a screaming match
On the LHR routes BA will be the sole operators if the acquisition goes ahead. It would seem unlikely that the capacity will be expanded in an overall context, on say LHR Scotland routes. If anythink BA will make the capacity as close a match to demand or current pax numbers overall so as to ensure best use of the limited slots at London.
Back to point, given that in the main BA is the primary carrier and has attractive routes, what will the PR do, drive passengers to the competition on the main routes to LHR their will be no exact competition, hence what will the passengers do start flying to other London airports instead when LHR is really where they want to go???? Maybe they could do AFWX to LCY and EZY to LGW. Im not convinced that the potential negative PR will do much harm at all, if this materialises.
On the subject of the who will buy or own bmi, depending on the contract that is in place for bmi staff (or bmir or baby for that matter), will have a bearing on the future.Eg if the contract says 'we reserve the right to move your work to a different country etc in line with the needs of the business' (note down work for bmi etc so dont know the precise details, the employees will). Will these contract details still stand and if so could say pilots be offered say moved to different divisions subject to type rating and need etc.. and have an option to go or not. Not sure that it matters one bit who is said to be buying the company over.
IAG is buying and it will do whatever it likes with the assets when it takes them over. Note also (hate to say it) BA and Willie will make commercial decisions that are right for the financial health of IAG/BA/IB etc. He will give maximum comfort on things like domestic routes, monopoly situation etc until the green light is given to the take over. That makes perfect sense, I cant see him having decided on routes etc until that happens.
Interesting to see that from today I see EI BFS LHR flights now show codeshare with BA on departure screens.... this hasnt happened in the last 4 years.
EI-BUD
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If you really believe that the Scottish Government are going to just let BA/IAG close down a Scottish airline with out a screaming match I think you may not understand just how badly BA are regarded by Holyrood. The Scottish media would love a pop at BA, and would give Lufty an impressive PR reaming
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I have after reading the last few days of posts, have this to put forward.
The LHBD group has agreed to sell the BMI group, to the IAG group.
So my take on it is this, IAG owns BA and plans to integrate one of the three airlines from the BMI group, namely BMI into BA.
The other two airlines in the BMI group are not wanted by the IAG group.
As pointed out, if the LHBD group can not off load BMIR & bmibaby prior to the agreed date, then the payment from IAG is drastically reduced, or nothing at all.
The way l see it and l hope it does not happen, this enables the IAG group to shut down both BMIR & bmibaby. This is why the drastic reduction in price that IAG will pay.
The LHBD group has agreed to sell the BMI group, to the IAG group.
So my take on it is this, IAG owns BA and plans to integrate one of the three airlines from the BMI group, namely BMI into BA.
The other two airlines in the BMI group are not wanted by the IAG group.
As pointed out, if the LHBD group can not off load BMIR & bmibaby prior to the agreed date, then the payment from IAG is drastically reduced, or nothing at all.
The way l see it and l hope it does not happen, this enables the IAG group to shut down both BMIR & bmibaby. This is why the drastic reduction in price that IAG will pay.
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IAG have agreed to buy 100% of the bmi group, bmibaby and bmi regional are wholly owned by bmi, it is for this reason that Willi Walsh has stated that the agreed price would be substantially reduced (£60m+) if WW and bmir are not sold prior to the share transaction completion expected end
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@max nightstop
Flypuppy has done a damn sight more research than a bmi pilot on maxi nightstops!
@Spotty M - too right buddy, too right.
Why don't some of you do some research before posting?
@Spotty M - too right buddy, too right.
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I can't help but think that SRB is missing a good opportunity.
He could buy baby and rename it VirginBaby. He could announce that he has ordered 200 Boeing 797s, with the new secret RR engine, to take on Ryanair and Easyjet.
Money should not be a problem, he does own a bank.
I hope to be on the first flight of this new airline, I missed out flying on Concorde, now what a good idea, VirginConcorde. No that would be impossible!
He could buy baby and rename it VirginBaby. He could announce that he has ordered 200 Boeing 797s, with the new secret RR engine, to take on Ryanair and Easyjet.
Money should not be a problem, he does own a bank.
I hope to be on the first flight of this new airline, I missed out flying on Concorde, now what a good idea, VirginConcorde. No that would be impossible!
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Quote:
"There are a number routes served by both Baby and Regional which would leave Scotland less well connected to other parts of the UK... "
But the 'greenies' (in Labour, Lib-Dem, Scot Nazis, Tories as well as Greens) don't want people to travel by air, so the loss of all those services will be seen by them as a victory! There are trains... stick with them!! (Or, root out all the 'greenies'!!!)
"There are a number routes served by both Baby and Regional which would leave Scotland less well connected to other parts of the UK... "
But the 'greenies' (in Labour, Lib-Dem, Scot Nazis, Tories as well as Greens) don't want people to travel by air, so the loss of all those services will be seen by them as a victory! There are trains... stick with them!! (Or, root out all the 'greenies'!!!)
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Currock...no rumour..check the French Connect website.
Speaker is Patrick Malval...subject...and I quote:
What will be the impact of the purchase of British Midland by British Airways?
The Iberia Merger: What are the consequences for European Airports?
Speaker is Patrick Malval...subject...and I quote:
What will be the impact of the purchase of British Midland by British Airways?
The Iberia Merger: What are the consequences for European Airports?
Flypuppy may also have a point on Aberdeen. Very difficult to blame BA for not continuing beach routes to the Med but equally cannot see BA wanting to keep any route out of ABZ open besides Heathrow. Yes flybe and Eastern may compete already on Manchester and Norwich routes but when a monopoly provider fares will presumably increase. What happens to Esbjerg and Groningen though - would Eastern be interested ?
Presumably if bmir was wound up, SAS, Brussels and Swiss would each open an Edinburgh route.
Presumably if bmir was wound up, SAS, Brussels and Swiss would each open an Edinburgh route.
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MB
I would guess that's the reason for the price reduction if they are not sold before IAG takes full control of bmi.
Having said that it would not be simple or straight forward, especially in WW's case with a full Summer schedule ahead and I guess saying to the boys and girls at the sharp end BTW your finished in Autum would not be er? motivational so they would have to offer either an enhanced retention package, unlikely or bite the bullet and an immediate shut down, again unlikely or more likely continue to seek disposal.
With regional it's more difficult to see a positive out come E135/145 are a waste of a LHR slot and flying for beeline under IAG won't can't last, there's not much left, Flybe might make some sense? but what to do with the ERJ's are they owned or leased?
Perhaps a third way might be to get someone to take on WW & bmir, if the ERJ's are owned, then gifting them in to a new set up as assets might add some meat? They could share a lot of the back room stuff, the 737 or more likely ERJ's could become a fleet and a lot of overheads would go at a stroke. The new company could cut an exchange deal with Embraer with owned ERJ's traded in for E Jets which would work well on WW's short routes or thinner longer routes? Just a thought, probably a daft one
Having said that it would not be simple or straight forward, especially in WW's case with a full Summer schedule ahead and I guess saying to the boys and girls at the sharp end BTW your finished in Autum would not be er? motivational so they would have to offer either an enhanced retention package, unlikely or bite the bullet and an immediate shut down, again unlikely or more likely continue to seek disposal.
With regional it's more difficult to see a positive out come E135/145 are a waste of a LHR slot and flying for beeline under IAG won't can't last, there's not much left, Flybe might make some sense? but what to do with the ERJ's are they owned or leased?
Perhaps a third way might be to get someone to take on WW & bmir, if the ERJ's are owned, then gifting them in to a new set up as assets might add some meat? They could share a lot of the back room stuff, the 737 or more likely ERJ's could become a fleet and a lot of overheads would go at a stroke. The new company could cut an exchange deal with Embraer with owned ERJ's traded in for E Jets which would work well on WW's short routes or thinner longer routes? Just a thought, probably a daft one