T5 - Transport Select Committee Hearing 7-May-2008

[slip and turn]

BBC News 24 is led to believe that Willie Walsh is due to be heard later this afternoon and they will try to show his evidence. BAA are on at the moment but BBC News 24 are taking a break until WW is on.

PS If this gets lost in Airports and Routes before 1530Z then you'll know that someone thinks it's not important today

PPS He's on now at 1505Z! Pretty in pink - sorry burgundy

PPPS Actually he is very much on top of this Hearing so far. Impressive with his command of the detail and his honesty ...

Saved by the division bell!

Airlines Airports and Routes here we come

[d71146]

Just been watching this on the news must say Willie looks a bit harassed.

[woodpecker]

Not to mention the two plonkers from the BAA.

One had to be asked the same question five times and still didn't answer it.

It was summed up by him saying all the car parking problems were down to one barrier not working and there was a problem with one of the air-bridges that affected aircraft operations. Apart from that it worked well on day one!!!

[doubledolphins]

From what I saw of it, the wonders of the red button, I was so underwealmed by the "Managers" in question. "Did you check your emails from your middle management?" "No , thought I would sort out the problem first."
Priceless! (Bet its the middle managers that have to pay the consequences though.)

[slip and turn]

Yeah the BAA peeps spluttered a bit at times, but they didn't wobble WW today, did they?

I was expecting him to be wobbled and maybe their lunches had got the better of the quizmasters, but he was well prepared and disarmingly frank at least until the division bell went at half past four.

Did he get a grilling after that, do we know?


I was particularly impressed by the way WW separated himself from questions about the baggage system itself, the building facilities e.g. lifts, the computer systems, and even stand guidance.

Sounds like they have successfully reserved their position against BAA, IBM etc. on all those things and if they have, and there is ultimately BA shareholder value in pursuing those entities, then I think WW can claim credit for it himself by being very careful and reserved about apportioning blame right from the outset.

Resilient fella, isn't he?

[ZeBedie]

I bet WW was glad that Gwyneth Dunwoody (RIP) wasn't there to rip his head off.

[Capt H Peacock]

Amen Zeb,

She'd have made Boxty out of the little tinker. What a crying shame

[apaddyinuk]

BA "Failed to Foresee" T5 Chaos

Heres a link to BBCs website report

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7388296.stm

[timzsta]

Yes old Gwyneth would have eaten him alive. Remember seing her rip some people from the railway industry to pieces earlier in the year after the fiasco post new year engineering works.

Remember her asking this fellah if he had an opinion on it all. He said "No". She replied something like "Make sure that's on the record please, a railwayman and unionist of 30 years experience without an opinion!"

[BIGBATMAN]

Regarding stand entry guidance the problems about that was more the fact there were no dispatchers to turn them on result in most flights being marshalled on, rather than them not working.

Something to do with a dispatcher had to finsh off their last flight before they move onto the next resulting in delays for guildance and jetty service.

Although on most occasions the dispatchers were only about 20m from the button but according to there sop cant turn it on.

i wonder how much extra fuel was burnt that day waiting for basic service??

Cheers Big

[Cluster One]

Regarding stand entry guidance the problems about that was more the fact there were no dispatchers to turn them on result in most flights being marshalled on, rather than them not working.

Does T5 not use the Safegate automated docking guidance system? I understood (and please correct me if I am wrong) that this system is always active and will automatically detect and identify an approaching aircraft, ensuring that the approaching aircraft matches the type that is expected at that gate.

Regards

[Willie Wash]

Enamoured by the diminuative Walsh

Glad to see Slip and Turd was enamoured by Mr Walsh today. I personally found him very toady! I found the his first address to the committee 'can i take my jacket off' like a naughty school boy, hilarious. My sides were splitting when he struggled to take the top off the water bottle. What a complete pratt. The sooner he retires the better, shame the second half wasn't broadcast. As they say, the luck of the Irish.

[Poof in Boots]

You have to fast forward into the hearing by 2 hours 6mins and 32 secs to see Walsh rattled by a question over whether Kirkwood and Noyes had signed a confidentiality agreement.

Walsh refused to answer, so it must be a YES.

Go to www.Parliamentlive.tv to see it all again.

I wrote to Gwyneth Dunwoody over T5 and unfortunately she died as we know.Nothing to do with my letter I hope. The committee today were hopeless. Mrs Dunwoody must be turning in her grave. What a different event it would have been with her in the Chair!

[M.Mouse]

Does T5 not use the Safegate automated docking guidance system?

That may be the case but 'elf an' safety decrees mean that the dispatcher (now called a Turnround Manager in newspeak) has to visually check the stand for obstructions because pilots are too stupid to do so for themselves like wot we did in the olde days.

A shortage of available TRMs was one of the few things we successfully transferred into T5.

[Hotel Mode]

That may be the case but 'elf an' safety decrees mean that the dispatcher (now called a Turnround Manager in newspeak) has to visually check the stand for obstructions because pilots are too stupid to do so for themselves like wot we did in the olde days.

Its worse than that, they're there to ensure we set the Park brake, cos we cant be expected to remember everything. They'll have them walking in front with red flags soon.

[Joetom]

Stand management at LHR is at a very low level.

Redcap/Dispatcher/Turnaround Manager gets to the stand too late to do the checks.

Stands have loads of unwanted stuff at the wrong times.

FOD gets removed by the weather or tyres.

Redcaps/Dispatchers/Turnaround Managers tend to be in the wrong place when aircraft taxi on to the parking spot, they often up in the finger, they can't see the aircraft about to hit an object.

I can only guess it's cheaper to fix the damage than fix the the problems that cause the damage.

[slip and turn]

Originally Posted by Poof in Boots

You have to fast forward into the hearing by 2 hours 6mins and 32 secs to see Walsh rattled by a question over whether Kirkwood and Noyes had signed a confidentiality agreement.

Thanks for the pointer to where we can catch up with the full hearing.

Personally I'd say that Louise Ellman did not rattle WW in any Gunwoody-esque type of way. He was obviously extremely well briefed and knew the scope of the flight envelope of this hearing. He knew he could defy the questionner without fear of reprimand.

I am sure the late GG would have found a way to his sensitive bits, but they just don't make 'em like that anymore.

Actually I think there's a big clue in the David Wilshire questions starting around 2:17:52 about IT.

That was a definite way in to his sensitive bits. What I was hearing there was that BA's IT department did not see their role in any way as designers of the BAA Baggage handling software or interface. They were observers! He said it at least twice. And there was something he said about a software filter that remained in place (about 2:18:42?) that appeared not to help and the the way Willie Walsh introduced it made me think of the metal transport bar to be found inside the top of the washing machine that you remove when you take it out of the box and before you start using it . So BA ordered a new washing machine, someone unpacked it, they plugged it in and discovered that no-one had removed the transport bar...sorry software filter ... brilliant

I would not be at all surprised if BA's IT department were pleased to just let others design the system and were not pro-active at all. I have seen IT departments who expect facilities contracts (everything from complete new premises and non-IT bits of hardware to essential core parts of their networks) to be delivered a bit like a new server. That is most likely to occur if someone calls the overall contract a 'Design and Build' contract.

Such ruthlessly narrow-minded IT persons expect it (the whole 'Design and Build' contract such as it affects them) delivered to their door, be brought up in the lift, and someone to bring the delivery chit to their desk, with the product still sealed and safety wrapped, exactly to their concept of the specification and no-one elses. They will then plug it in on schedule for some crazily short testing regime on the critical path, designed mostly just to calibrate and to test their own configurations. Consequently if some third party fool has been daft enough to commit to a delivery specification without understanding what was really expected then they just unplug it and send it back. And when the project manager says well that was a critical task and now we are behind schedule while we wait for a replacement, the IT guys shrug their shoulders and say "well it was your project" ... Been there, done that! It pays to be a mindreader when interfacing with an IT department.

There was also a bit earlier, (around 2:05:43) an unprompted and possibly unguarded admission that the server message traffic associated with the system was far greater than had been planned for. That also looks like evidence of pp IT planning.

I would now predict that if BA still expect to recoup costs as a result of the IT failures then they will be a very long time coming, as in very unlikely. The only way they could possibly recoup is if they saw the risk in what surely was a system unique to T5 and pinned it on others in contracts before it happened.

He admitted earlier that they had an opportunity to refuse to move when they did, but they didn't foresee the risk of what happened and so they moved anyway. Was either Mr Kirkwood or Mr Noyes in charge of the IT risk, I wonder?

After seeing this last part of the hearing, I now struggle once more to see the worth of Mr Walsh staying.

For the board to still be retaining him, he must be very good at parts of the business we don't get to hear about.

[MarlboroLite]

I thought it was classic when an MP asked the BAA CEO

" have you launched an investigation yet"

and his reply..

" I haven't had the time yet"

or words to that effect.

[BIGBATMAN]

The Safedock can be automatic but due to health and safety should be programmed before each arrival and should have a TRM present next to the emergency stop to activate it should they need too.
However most of the time they walk off leaving the stand gulidance uncontrolled.

As for pilots looking out, this is very true all are capable of looking out however this shouldnt be down to the pilot alone as his view and perspective maybe not a reliable than that on the ground due to hismpostion.
I have attending incidents were aircraft hit equipment so im afraid pilots quite righlty need help to achieve a safe approach to the stand and its unfortunate accidents happen.

Cheers
Big

[Willie Wash]

Fit for 5

More like Fit for FCUK ALL, what a complete Wille wonker. Oh i was amazed when WW's grip failed to remove the top from the water bottle! I thought such a tight fisted littlle Wa$&er would have breezed it. He should of organised a BA working party to plan the opening! So how can you expect the man to open a multi million pound terminal when he struggles with a bottle top?