NEWCASTLE - 6
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New charter airline to based
Had a look through a lot of tour operators websites and i cant find anything.
Could we see someone new basing for summer 2008?
Im sure that TCX and FCA join contract at NCL runs out after this summer so i do think that FCA it could be.
Continuation of: http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...254057&page=15
Had a look through a lot of tour operators websites and i cant find anything.
Could we see someone new basing for summer 2008?
Im sure that TCX and FCA join contract at NCL runs out after this summer so i do think that FCA it could be.
Continuation of: http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...254057&page=15
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Fingers crossed! we need some changes at NCL!
Also does anyone else see the EI flights a lil disappointing? the loads are rarely high, most seem to still be using FR, who to be fair i tihnk hav better flight times than EI.
Anyone know anymore about XL being based at NCL permanently from this summer? 2 737's seem to be the rumour still, wouldn;t this clarify the departure of FJE? Doubt XL and FJE would operate on a perm bases at NCL.
Also, what about Globespan offering long haul routes from NCL? starting up Toronto this summer, they do Cape Town from MAN etc and seem to be expanding. No-one seems to mention there development towards north east.
Also does anyone else see the EI flights a lil disappointing? the loads are rarely high, most seem to still be using FR, who to be fair i tihnk hav better flight times than EI.
Anyone know anymore about XL being based at NCL permanently from this summer? 2 737's seem to be the rumour still, wouldn;t this clarify the departure of FJE? Doubt XL and FJE would operate on a perm bases at NCL.
Also, what about Globespan offering long haul routes from NCL? starting up Toronto this summer, they do Cape Town from MAN etc and seem to be expanding. No-one seems to mention there development towards north east.
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Plenty of development here if the latest rumours are true 
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NCL1
Globespan (the tour operator) have operated to Toronto from NCL for years using Air Transat but have now taken it in-house with their own new airline.
I can't really see them expanding at NCL with their other North-Eastern operations centred at DTV.
Globespan (the tour operator) have operated to Toronto from NCL for years using Air Transat but have now taken it in-house with their own new airline.
I can't really see them expanding at NCL with their other North-Eastern operations centred at DTV.
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Looks like XL will have a 737 and 757 again.
I heard that XL will be year round from October when FJE cease operations at NCL.
As regards a new charter operator, I wouldnt be surprised to see FCA replace one of the TCX units if the contract is up soon.....lets wait and see
I heard that XL will be year round from October when FJE cease operations at NCL.
As regards a new charter operator, I wouldnt be surprised to see FCA replace one of the TCX units if the contract is up soon.....lets wait and see
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NCLfan
I'm not sure where your assessment of loads on the 6G Ncl-CWL route come from. It was barely ever more than half full, very frequently operating with single figures - and that was long before 6G effectively disappeared. 20 pax or fewer on a Q400 is not a good basis for running a route.
As for NCL-BHX, I would be astounded to see it. It would be the shortest mainland route on the BE network, and barely 30 minutes airbourne. Only inter-island between JER and GUR, or BHD and GLA are shorter routes.
Flybe predominately operates mainland UK and French routes with the Q400, and I doubt NCL would be any different were BE ever to reopen the base (which I doubt, despite the publicity). The newer routes to the near continent running from SOU may be a possibility, but BE has well established competition on to those destinations from NCL and would struggle to compete.
French routes are an option, but the more southerly destinations (BOD, EGC, TOU, PGF) are a bit of a stretch for the Q400 (pushing 3hrs), and fuelling in France is massively expensive compared to the UK. Again, not an overly attractive proposition.
I'll be as pleased as anyone should it happen, but don't go holding your breath.
I'm not sure where your assessment of loads on the 6G Ncl-CWL route come from. It was barely ever more than half full, very frequently operating with single figures - and that was long before 6G effectively disappeared. 20 pax or fewer on a Q400 is not a good basis for running a route.
As for NCL-BHX, I would be astounded to see it. It would be the shortest mainland route on the BE network, and barely 30 minutes airbourne. Only inter-island between JER and GUR, or BHD and GLA are shorter routes.
Flybe predominately operates mainland UK and French routes with the Q400, and I doubt NCL would be any different were BE ever to reopen the base (which I doubt, despite the publicity). The newer routes to the near continent running from SOU may be a possibility, but BE has well established competition on to those destinations from NCL and would struggle to compete.
French routes are an option, but the more southerly destinations (BOD, EGC, TOU, PGF) are a bit of a stretch for the Q400 (pushing 3hrs), and fuelling in France is massively expensive compared to the UK. Again, not an overly attractive proposition.
I'll be as pleased as anyone should it happen, but don't go holding your breath.
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Maude Charlee
I'm not holding my breath, just think that any BE base would be good for NCL and may breathe some new life into what has been a pretty stagnant domestic market of late.
On the CWL route, the point I was really making was it needs a new operator. In March 06 for example, before 6G left the route carried 2066 pax in that month, however in Nov 06 T3 carried 1556, which on these numbers is a near 25% reduction in pax numbers. I just think if BE came in the market would change, as even 6G's fares weren't that cheap! Who would have thought that NCL-EXT would be double daily with BE despite heavy competition from EZY up the road at BRS.
I only quoted BHX as a route as BE did themselves in a news article I read fairly recently.
I agree, I would love and want BE to re-open the NCL base but until I see a press release from them and bookings open I just won't believe it!
HH6702
So what is the press conference at NCL tomorrow you have been discussing in the Ryanair forum?
I'm not holding my breath, just think that any BE base would be good for NCL and may breathe some new life into what has been a pretty stagnant domestic market of late.
On the CWL route, the point I was really making was it needs a new operator. In March 06 for example, before 6G left the route carried 2066 pax in that month, however in Nov 06 T3 carried 1556, which on these numbers is a near 25% reduction in pax numbers. I just think if BE came in the market would change, as even 6G's fares weren't that cheap! Who would have thought that NCL-EXT would be double daily with BE despite heavy competition from EZY up the road at BRS.
I only quoted BHX as a route as BE did themselves in a news article I read fairly recently.
I agree, I would love and want BE to re-open the NCL base but until I see a press release from them and bookings open I just won't believe it!
HH6702
So what is the press conference at NCL tomorrow you have been discussing in the Ryanair forum?
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Heard that T3 have cancelled the London City due to LCY new owners doubling landing charges to encourage larger aircraft in the region of 100 seats to use the airport, greedy b******S, I hope the place sinks due to global warming
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However nice it would be to see the return of FCA to NCL, I very much doubt it will happen. Should the contract between the Thomas Cook group and the First Choice group not be renewed, then both tour operating arms would have greater number of seats to sell. For example at the moment, FCA pax are carried on TCX a/c with smaller allocations of holidays to sell. Same with TCX, as some of the seats onboard are sold to First Choice. This arrangement decreases the number of seats each tour operator has the responsibility for selling and cuts the risk of having empty seats. If say, FCA based an A320 to fly their holidays, then the number of seats they would have to sell is 180, more than at present, and again same for TCX holidays. They would have to sell 235 seats on majority of their flights. What I am getting at is that the risks for both companies increase if the contract is not renewed and lets not forget that First Choice is decreasing its concentration on the Short Haul package market.
Some other questions that have come up during these recent NCL discussions:
Have XL actually stated that their contract with Flyjet will be terminated as it was for 3 years and after the summer 07 season still has 18 months left on it?
Would, if it did happen, XL base their own a/c at NCL during the winter or sub contract it out again?
Somebody said expect new route announcements in the next few days, what is the source of this information?
Despite press coverage, do we think BE will actually have a 4 a/c operation at NCL?
Will Jet2 find enough a/c to base 5/6 a/c at NCL for the summer and how many will it reduce to in the winter and there are still large gaps in their programme, could we see more routes?
Will VLM make a go of NCL-LCY?
Some other questions that have come up during these recent NCL discussions:
Have XL actually stated that their contract with Flyjet will be terminated as it was for 3 years and after the summer 07 season still has 18 months left on it?
Would, if it did happen, XL base their own a/c at NCL during the winter or sub contract it out again?
Somebody said expect new route announcements in the next few days, what is the source of this information?
Despite press coverage, do we think BE will actually have a 4 a/c operation at NCL?
Will Jet2 find enough a/c to base 5/6 a/c at NCL for the summer and how many will it reduce to in the winter and there are still large gaps in their programme, could we see more routes?
Will VLM make a go of NCL-LCY?
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From another well known forum....
Cimber Air (QI) just announced that from March 25th, 2007, they will start operating a once-daily 50-seat CRJ flight CPH-NCL, with convenient connections in CPH.
The route has been tried before, first by easyJet, then by SK (op. by QI), and now they try themselfes. FlyBe talked about starting NCL-CPH with a Q400 a few months ago; donøt know what happened with that.
NCL will be the 11th UK destination from CPH; no other airport in Scandinavia or Germany has as many flights to the UK as CPH: LHR, LGW, LCY, STN, MAN, BHX, LBA, GLA, EDI, NCL, ABZ.
Cimber Air (QI) just announced that from March 25th, 2007, they will start operating a once-daily 50-seat CRJ flight CPH-NCL, with convenient connections in CPH.
The route has been tried before, first by easyJet, then by SK (op. by QI), and now they try themselfes. FlyBe talked about starting NCL-CPH with a Q400 a few months ago; donøt know what happened with that.
NCL will be the 11th UK destination from CPH; no other airport in Scandinavia or Germany has as many flights to the UK as CPH: LHR, LGW, LCY, STN, MAN, BHX, LBA, GLA, EDI, NCL, ABZ.
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Given BE have a massive recruitment headache looming for this year, I will be surprised if they can crew existing aircraft and provide a full 07 schedule, let alone new routes from new bases. If the BACON merger does proceed, it will get massively worse given the numbers of crew baling out from BACON at the moment.
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Transwede: despite press coverage, do we think BE will actually have a 4 a/c operation at NCL?
We will just have to wait and see!!
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Maude Charlee
I'm not holding my breath, just think that any BE base would be good for NCL and may breathe some new life into what has been a pretty stagnant domestic market of late.
On the CWL route, the point I was really making was it needs a new operator. In March 06 for example, before 6G left the route carried 2066 pax in that month, however in Nov 06 T3 carried 1556, which on these numbers is a near 25% reduction in pax numbers. I just think if BE came in the market would change, as even 6G's fares weren't that cheap! Who would have thought that NCL-EXT would be double daily with BE despite heavy competition from EZY up the road at BRS.
I'm not holding my breath, just think that any BE base would be good for NCL and may breathe some new life into what has been a pretty stagnant domestic market of late.
On the CWL route, the point I was really making was it needs a new operator. In March 06 for example, before 6G left the route carried 2066 pax in that month, however in Nov 06 T3 carried 1556, which on these numbers is a near 25% reduction in pax numbers. I just think if BE came in the market would change, as even 6G's fares weren't that cheap! Who would have thought that NCL-EXT would be double daily with BE despite heavy competition from EZY up the road at BRS.
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Good news about Cimber Air and NCL-CPH. Didn't think with CPH airports owning part of NCL that the route would not be flown. Cimber maybe just the right airline to operate the flight. Small aircraft which can feed into a large route network and support short breaks to CPH. However, this route has been attempted numerous times now by different airlines and none of them has ever lasted long, so fingers crossed for this time!
Thats one route NCL lost and someone else has stepped in and resurrected it. Lets hope we get a replacement for Oslo, Berlin and BUD or alternative eastern europe destination.
With Eastern stopping NCL-LCY will their 4th based aircraft do anything else or go to another base or just be used as a standby a/c?
Thats one route NCL lost and someone else has stepped in and resurrected it. Lets hope we get a replacement for Oslo, Berlin and BUD or alternative eastern europe destination.
With Eastern stopping NCL-LCY will their 4th based aircraft do anything else or go to another base or just be used as a standby a/c?
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Yes, they did operate on behalf of SAS last time round but this time they are doing it under their own name
If they can achieve the same good load factor as SAS did, with lower overheads they could have a profitable operation especially if it builds to twice daily. SAS had loads well over the figure they needed to go twice daily but the yield was not high enough to make it profitable enough.
If they can achieve the same good load factor as SAS did, with lower overheads they could have a profitable operation especially if it builds to twice daily. SAS had loads well over the figure they needed to go twice daily but the yield was not high enough to make it profitable enough.
Last edited by Jamesair; 23rd Jan 2007 at 12:12.
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All this talk about new routes makes me think again as to why we do not have a NCL - MAN of any sorts? If 6G can make a go of NCL - BHX on J41's with a high fare structure & limited through connections then MAN must seem very attractive. LHR is at present a mess & MAN could certainly support a choice of US connections. Accepted that Dan Air tried many years ago, but the conditions now are different, I'm assuming that ongoing surveys are conducted as to prospecive demand vs costs, though I would assume that something more akin to a Q400 would apear more viable than a J41.
On other comments re 6G, I admire their success in carving a niche on high revenue routes with frequency & lower capacity, but I do feel that this trend is going to be difficult to sustain. I used to fly with them regularly on the NCL - BHX & even at peak times it was unusual to see more than two thirds occupied. The service was always good & crew very pleasant but it's 'bums on seats' that will count in the end. I too don't see NCL-CWL being capable of adding anything positive to their revenue.
On other comments re 6G, I admire their success in carving a niche on high revenue routes with frequency & lower capacity, but I do feel that this trend is going to be difficult to sustain. I used to fly with them regularly on the NCL - BHX & even at peak times it was unusual to see more than two thirds occupied. The service was always good & crew very pleasant but it's 'bums on seats' that will count in the end. I too don't see NCL-CWL being capable of adding anything positive to their revenue.
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skyman771 I think you're getting a little confused. 6G was Air Wales, the routes you mentioned above are operated by Eastern Airways (T3).
Jet2
I suspect we may well see more from Jet2 for the coming summer. If their rumoured plan to base upto 6 aircraft are true then most planes will only operate around 1 flight per day, with alot of non-flying i.e parked on the tarmac. This would hardly be profitable for them to do, NCL being one of the highest in aircraft parking charges. Also alot of flights do not fit into the flight schedule and require extra a/c. For example the 2 weekly flights to TFS. Also BGO flights do slot into a programme well, unless they will be using the 146 LGW a/c?? Maybe we could see SXF and BUD/WAW?
Jet2
I suspect we may well see more from Jet2 for the coming summer. If their rumoured plan to base upto 6 aircraft are true then most planes will only operate around 1 flight per day, with alot of non-flying i.e parked on the tarmac. This would hardly be profitable for them to do, NCL being one of the highest in aircraft parking charges. Also alot of flights do not fit into the flight schedule and require extra a/c. For example the 2 weekly flights to TFS. Also BGO flights do slot into a programme well, unless they will be using the 146 LGW a/c?? Maybe we could see SXF and BUD/WAW?