DURHAM TEES VALLEY AIRPORT - 4
Join Date: Oct 2005
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£10 sez we come back from the Routes conference with absolutely p!ss all.
In other news, Flyglobespan have announced their IBZ routes for S08, and we don't feature, and since this was one of the better performing routes, it puts any 2nd aircraft in even more doubt.
In other news, Flyglobespan have announced their IBZ routes for S08, and we don't feature, and since this was one of the better performing routes, it puts any 2nd aircraft in even more doubt.
Join Date: Oct 2005
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All we can hope is that we do get something from the Routes conference. I like the bit that reads "meetings were planned with current and potential airlines".
Join Date: Dec 2005
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So, following their triumphant return from Sweden, coupled with the lack of knowledge in the local media, I expect to see something like the following:
Naff All Airlines to open base at Durham Tees Valley.
A new airline is to begin services from Durham Tees Valley.
It was confirmed today that Naff All airlines will be starting new routes from the airport in 2008. Chief Executive, Billy Liar, said ‘’it is our intention to base Naff All Boeings at DTV airport in 2008 following discussions with the management team. It’s early days yet, but it’s expected that new routes will be available to NeverNever land three times a week, Slumberland four times a week, long haul to the Promised land on Sundays only, and Palma forty six times a week’’.
An airport spokesman said that ‘’Naff All meets the airport’s vision for the future, and our marketing department is convinced that the new destinations will further improve the choice available to local people’’. He went on to say that ‘’the new destinations result from a tremendous amount of hard work, and the map of the world and set of darts were particularly helpful in deciding locations that people in the Tees Valley would visit’’. He added that ‘’a couple of minor issues still needed to be resolved before these new services commence, including convincing local residents that the number of undesirable elements seen hanging around the airport (apparently known as passengers) would be kept to a minimum, and that the garden bench from B&Q provided as part of the £56million development plans for the airport needs a coat of varnish before being brought back into service’’.
Well I was bored at work !!!
Naff All Airlines to open base at Durham Tees Valley.
A new airline is to begin services from Durham Tees Valley.
It was confirmed today that Naff All airlines will be starting new routes from the airport in 2008. Chief Executive, Billy Liar, said ‘’it is our intention to base Naff All Boeings at DTV airport in 2008 following discussions with the management team. It’s early days yet, but it’s expected that new routes will be available to NeverNever land three times a week, Slumberland four times a week, long haul to the Promised land on Sundays only, and Palma forty six times a week’’.
An airport spokesman said that ‘’Naff All meets the airport’s vision for the future, and our marketing department is convinced that the new destinations will further improve the choice available to local people’’. He went on to say that ‘’the new destinations result from a tremendous amount of hard work, and the map of the world and set of darts were particularly helpful in deciding locations that people in the Tees Valley would visit’’. He added that ‘’a couple of minor issues still needed to be resolved before these new services commence, including convincing local residents that the number of undesirable elements seen hanging around the airport (apparently known as passengers) would be kept to a minimum, and that the garden bench from B&Q provided as part of the £56million development plans for the airport needs a coat of varnish before being brought back into service’’.
Well I was bored at work !!!
Join Date: Feb 2005
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Routes Conference - Stockholm
Richard Whitehouse, group charter development manager 
at Durham Tees Valley Airport, called it the “foremost route development conference in the world” and said meetings were planned with current and potential airlines.
at Durham Tees Valley Airport, called it the “foremost route development conference in the world” and said meetings were planned with current and potential airlines.
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August 2007 Passenger Numbers
Well the August 2007 passenger numbers are out...
Total for August 2007 was 98150 (-10.3% on August 2006)
Aberdeen 2766 (51%)
Alicante 8521 (86%) [shared GSM, JKK, TOM]
Amsterdam 11164 (75%)
Arrecife 1712 (95%)
Bodrum 2146 (98%)
*Bourgas 2433 (105%) [shared BGH, TOM]
Brussels 275 (23%)
Corfu 1637 (87%)
Dalaman 5678 (90%) [shared OHY, TOM]
Dublin 6704 (77%)
Gerona 3984 (81%)
Faro 2749 (76%)
Heathrow 6600 (59%)
Ibiza 4255 (78%) [shared GSM, JKK, TOM]
Jersey 987 (95%)
Larnaca 1753 (93%)
Mahon 1958 (70%) [shared GSM, TOM]
Malaga 6674 (89%) [shared GSM, TOM]
**Nice 1053 (45%)
Palma 14070 (89%) [shared GSM, IWD, JKK, TOM]
Paphos 1816 (96%)
Pula 850 (65%)
Reus 2496 (90%) [shared BMA, TOM]
Tenerife 1468 (86%)
Warsaw 3714 (79%)
* - Bourgas is based on a full B738 (TOM) and half an A320 (BGH) as this is shared with LBA
** - The Nice flights for August were combined with Alicante flights, therefore, based on 60 seats each way, Nice was 98%, leaving the other 70 seats each way for ALC passengers, and the ALC numbers are therefore based on 70 seats on these flights (Wednesday and Sunday).
Analysis
First off, I can't see Nice or Pula returning for next summer, not with loads like these. Unless they want to keep Pula as a test that is, but otherwise I can't see it returning. If a second aircraft is based here for the main part of the summer (like this year) then I can see Tenerife, Arrecife and surely Las Palmas being included. There are a few hints towards this (JER changes times around the start of July and also Palma goes from 2 to 3 a week from the start of July).
Other new routes that are worth mentioning are Warsaw by Wizz which managed a respectable total for it's first full month, and also Ryanair's Gerona seems to be doing well also. I think 3x weekly may be a bit much through the winter, though.
The business routes didn't seem to do too well through August, although this is a typically holiday month, not business orientated and this may explain the low load factors on the Heathrow, Amsterdam and Aberdeen, and of course it's no surprise that Brussels was dropped!
As you can see, the usual holiday hotspots did well, Palma had the most passengers of all routes, over 14 thousand of you travelled between MME and PMI in August! Good ones that deserve a mention are Bodrum (98%), Paphos (96%) and Arrecife (95%). I wouldn't be surprised to see more flights to these next year (will anyone take up Paphos?!).
Total for August 2007 was 98150 (-10.3% on August 2006)
Aberdeen 2766 (51%)
Alicante 8521 (86%) [shared GSM, JKK, TOM]
Amsterdam 11164 (75%)
Arrecife 1712 (95%)
Bodrum 2146 (98%)
*Bourgas 2433 (105%) [shared BGH, TOM]
Brussels 275 (23%)
Corfu 1637 (87%)
Dalaman 5678 (90%) [shared OHY, TOM]
Dublin 6704 (77%)
Gerona 3984 (81%)
Faro 2749 (76%)
Heathrow 6600 (59%)
Ibiza 4255 (78%) [shared GSM, JKK, TOM]
Jersey 987 (95%)
Larnaca 1753 (93%)
Mahon 1958 (70%) [shared GSM, TOM]
Malaga 6674 (89%) [shared GSM, TOM]
**Nice 1053 (45%)
Palma 14070 (89%) [shared GSM, IWD, JKK, TOM]
Paphos 1816 (96%)
Pula 850 (65%)
Reus 2496 (90%) [shared BMA, TOM]
Tenerife 1468 (86%)
Warsaw 3714 (79%)
* - Bourgas is based on a full B738 (TOM) and half an A320 (BGH) as this is shared with LBA
** - The Nice flights for August were combined with Alicante flights, therefore, based on 60 seats each way, Nice was 98%, leaving the other 70 seats each way for ALC passengers, and the ALC numbers are therefore based on 70 seats on these flights (Wednesday and Sunday).
Analysis
First off, I can't see Nice or Pula returning for next summer, not with loads like these. Unless they want to keep Pula as a test that is, but otherwise I can't see it returning. If a second aircraft is based here for the main part of the summer (like this year) then I can see Tenerife, Arrecife and surely Las Palmas being included. There are a few hints towards this (JER changes times around the start of July and also Palma goes from 2 to 3 a week from the start of July).
Other new routes that are worth mentioning are Warsaw by Wizz which managed a respectable total for it's first full month, and also Ryanair's Gerona seems to be doing well also. I think 3x weekly may be a bit much through the winter, though.
The business routes didn't seem to do too well through August, although this is a typically holiday month, not business orientated and this may explain the low load factors on the Heathrow, Amsterdam and Aberdeen, and of course it's no surprise that Brussels was dropped!
As you can see, the usual holiday hotspots did well, Palma had the most passengers of all routes, over 14 thousand of you travelled between MME and PMI in August! Good ones that deserve a mention are Bodrum (98%), Paphos (96%) and Arrecife (95%). I wouldn't be surprised to see more flights to these next year (will anyone take up Paphos?!).
Routes Conference - Stockholm
I read the report in the Gazette and wondered how many local papers around the world were running that story with the just a few changes in names etc...
Join Date: Feb 2007
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MMETeesside
An interesting set of statistics but your analysis is based on, what I assume the ( ) figures are as load factors and is, therefore, irrelevant in terms of whether a route may, or may not, be continued.
Load factors are NOT the key measure an airline will use for route sustainability - YIELD is the key.
I'm old enough to recall years when Thomsons operated a DC10 out of NCL to tenerife; they filled it nearly every week, but only by massive discounts. The 'seats' sold went through the roof; the load factors were 95%+ but the YIELD was so low that thye scrapped it as soon as they could. There can come a time when 'any revenue is good revenue' but it does not make it profitable.
I have no idea how well, or otherwise, these routes have done in terms of yield but I do think that this is what will determine whether or not you see them next year and thereafter.
GH
An interesting set of statistics but your analysis is based on, what I assume the ( ) figures are as load factors and is, therefore, irrelevant in terms of whether a route may, or may not, be continued.
Load factors are NOT the key measure an airline will use for route sustainability - YIELD is the key.
I'm old enough to recall years when Thomsons operated a DC10 out of NCL to tenerife; they filled it nearly every week, but only by massive discounts. The 'seats' sold went through the roof; the load factors were 95%+ but the YIELD was so low that thye scrapped it as soon as they could. There can come a time when 'any revenue is good revenue' but it does not make it profitable.
I have no idea how well, or otherwise, these routes have done in terms of yield but I do think that this is what will determine whether or not you see them next year and thereafter.
GH
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Apparantly that is why bmibaby left, and not a disagreement over landing fees as was previously thought, so assuming that's true, how are Flyglobespan supposed to generate good yields where bmibaby couldn't?
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DTVAirport
Supply and Demand.
Create the demand and the product becomes valuable.
Easy to say, difficult to execute.
Maybe the question should be;
What can FlyGlobespan and DTV do to make me, and others, book their flights rather than other operators from other airports to the same destination:
Day of operating - absolutely
Timings - absolutely (probably THE key for a lot of passengers)
Good OTP - yes, I don't want a delay at DTV as the facilities are very limited.
Cost - mmmm, within reason this is not the main driver. I'd pay a % more for better flight times, on the right days etc.
Ease of getting to the airport and parking costs - Access could be better, parking charges should be megga competitive to the competition.
Airport experience - every time I've flown through DTV I in awe of how quickly you can get through the airport, especially on arrival.
DTV as an airport have to really go and 'sell' their product on the ground, day after day, across the whole of their catchment area. When was the last time DTV did any marketing anywhere north of NCL? or around the M62 corridor? I've said it before on this site but NCL made their big steps forward in the late 80's early 90's with a good marketing manager who took a roadshow around the whole of their catchment area; on the doorsteps of MME, LBA, MAN, EDI & GLA. They went to as many independent travel agents as they could find, invited them to roadshows, took them to the airport and really 'sold' something (not sure that the 'product' was actually there at the time but the message was very clear - use us and we'll grow together, we'll both benefit, we'll both profit). They hit the multiples with presentations at their local, regional and national meetings. At that time they had 3 individuals in the team; manager, agent and P/T admin support BUT they were supported by the MD and other airport staff and they invitied and included the carriers and agents based on the airport on the basis is that if they actually generated more passengers everybody involved with the airport would benefit. They even had people doing punchy presentations at local meetings of Roundtable, Womens Institute etc. The guy who led this was called Mike Finch, sadly he got the order of the boot when a new MD was appointed, but no-one should ever take away the vision and drive he had even though he knew naff-all about aviation and airports when he was appointed - what he did know was how to market a product.
DTV has some advantages over NCL, MAN and LBA. Identify these, show that 'small can be beautiful' and market, market, market.
Apologies for the ramble, quiet day in the office!
GH
Supply and Demand.
Create the demand and the product becomes valuable.
Easy to say, difficult to execute.
Maybe the question should be;
What can FlyGlobespan and DTV do to make me, and others, book their flights rather than other operators from other airports to the same destination:
Day of operating - absolutely
Timings - absolutely (probably THE key for a lot of passengers)
Good OTP - yes, I don't want a delay at DTV as the facilities are very limited.
Cost - mmmm, within reason this is not the main driver. I'd pay a % more for better flight times, on the right days etc.
Ease of getting to the airport and parking costs - Access could be better, parking charges should be megga competitive to the competition.
Airport experience - every time I've flown through DTV I in awe of how quickly you can get through the airport, especially on arrival.
DTV as an airport have to really go and 'sell' their product on the ground, day after day, across the whole of their catchment area. When was the last time DTV did any marketing anywhere north of NCL? or around the M62 corridor? I've said it before on this site but NCL made their big steps forward in the late 80's early 90's with a good marketing manager who took a roadshow around the whole of their catchment area; on the doorsteps of MME, LBA, MAN, EDI & GLA. They went to as many independent travel agents as they could find, invited them to roadshows, took them to the airport and really 'sold' something (not sure that the 'product' was actually there at the time but the message was very clear - use us and we'll grow together, we'll both benefit, we'll both profit). They hit the multiples with presentations at their local, regional and national meetings. At that time they had 3 individuals in the team; manager, agent and P/T admin support BUT they were supported by the MD and other airport staff and they invitied and included the carriers and agents based on the airport on the basis is that if they actually generated more passengers everybody involved with the airport would benefit. They even had people doing punchy presentations at local meetings of Roundtable, Womens Institute etc. The guy who led this was called Mike Finch, sadly he got the order of the boot when a new MD was appointed, but no-one should ever take away the vision and drive he had even though he knew naff-all about aviation and airports when he was appointed - what he did know was how to market a product.
DTV has some advantages over NCL, MAN and LBA. Identify these, show that 'small can be beautiful' and market, market, market.
Apologies for the ramble, quiet day in the office!
GH
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groundhand In absolute agreement with the total content of your post, which puts a very succinct view on what is involved in marketing as opposed to simply ‘advertising’, a point which has been noted earlier in this thread. However possibly a lot of the problems at DTV can be illustrated in that the NCL approach to the issues was :-
whereas at DTV in reading of such positions with fancy titles such as 'group charter development manager'
, suggesting a significant infrstructure of 'sayers' rather than 'doers', then possibly they have somewhat 'lost the plot!'.
At that time they had 3 individuals in the team; manager, agent and P/T admin support BUT they were supported by the MD
, suggesting a significant infrstructure of 'sayers' rather than 'doers', then possibly they have somewhat 'lost the plot!'.
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Flyglobespan have now announced Pula from EDI and GLA for S08 but again no mention of us, yep, I definitely think it's a one aircraft job.
Perhaps we should be grateful since MAN, STN and LPL have all been given the chop?
Perhaps we should be grateful since MAN, STN and LPL have all been given the chop?
RE message from DB5
Thanks for your light hearted message, glad to see someone with a touch of humour to make me smile in this otherwise depressing world. Cheers DB5
Budget airline reduces DTV services
From Northern Echo - 5:52pm Wednesday 26th September 2007
AN airline has cut back part of its first full winter schedule after a lack of interest from passengers. But bosses at Durham Tees Valley Airport and Flyglobespan said the cutback was only a small part of the overall operations.
Budget airline Flyglobespan, a web-based airline founded in 2002, has cut some of its weekly flights to Palma, on Majorca. The flights were due to fly from Durham to Palma every Saturday during the winter. Bosses at Flyglobespan yesterday said flights would finish on November 17, restarting again in March.
They had decided to reduce the airline's operations because Palma had proved not to be a popular winter destination. They also wanted to give passengers enough time to find alternative flight arrangements.
A spokesman for Flyglobespan said: "There has been a really poor uptake on it. We have had to cancel it and let customers know in plenty of time."
Flyglobespan, who launched its first flights from Durham Tees Valley in March, runs flights to ten European destinations, five of which are part of its winter programme. None of the other four winter routes will be affected.
A spokesman for Durham Tees Valley Airport, said: "Given that this is Flyglobespan's first full winter season operating from Durham Tees Valley it is to be expected that the programme may have to be adjusted to reflect customer demand and in reality Majorca is not seen as a major tourist destination in the winter. However, it should be pointed out that the airline will be operating a significant programme throughout the winter to other destinations including Alicante, Malaga, Lanzarote and Tenerife - and the Palma service is scheduled to resume operations from March."
AN airline has cut back part of its first full winter schedule after a lack of interest from passengers. But bosses at Durham Tees Valley Airport and Flyglobespan said the cutback was only a small part of the overall operations.
Budget airline Flyglobespan, a web-based airline founded in 2002, has cut some of its weekly flights to Palma, on Majorca. The flights were due to fly from Durham to Palma every Saturday during the winter. Bosses at Flyglobespan yesterday said flights would finish on November 17, restarting again in March.
They had decided to reduce the airline's operations because Palma had proved not to be a popular winter destination. They also wanted to give passengers enough time to find alternative flight arrangements.
A spokesman for Flyglobespan said: "There has been a really poor uptake on it. We have had to cancel it and let customers know in plenty of time."
Flyglobespan, who launched its first flights from Durham Tees Valley in March, runs flights to ten European destinations, five of which are part of its winter programme. None of the other four winter routes will be affected.
A spokesman for Durham Tees Valley Airport, said: "Given that this is Flyglobespan's first full winter season operating from Durham Tees Valley it is to be expected that the programme may have to be adjusted to reflect customer demand and in reality Majorca is not seen as a major tourist destination in the winter. However, it should be pointed out that the airline will be operating a significant programme throughout the winter to other destinations including Alicante, Malaga, Lanzarote and Tenerife - and the Palma service is scheduled to resume operations from March."
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GSM Looking then at what will be the revised winter timetable, then it would appear that GSM are only to operate 8? flights a week out of DTV W08. At just over one per day then what is the remainder of the utilisation of what is a based 736? As for the delivery of the reduction, then a classic piece of "condescending twaddle". Clearly GSM or DTV? are not up for ( possibly incompotent?) for the fight for market share in the more difficult winter months. None of this bodes well for an optomistic view on SO8.
) for the fight for market share in the more difficult winter months. None of this bodes well for an optomistic view on SO8.
I wonder what would happen if they used some of the cut slots and flew to a ski destination. I know you cannot take your bucket and spade but I believe the people of Teesside just might like to have one flight to such a destination.
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Yes, but as with anything planning, marketing required. DTV have shown to date a lack of compotence & what is there to suggest any change? Also it would seem to me that any announcement for any further W08 destinations, ski or otherwise related would be rather late, when much of the target market are already making their plans & arrangements on what is already on offer by 'the competion'.
Perhaps what should be questioned is what are GSM's real motives in the W08 flight reductions
Perhaps what should be questioned is what are GSM's real motives in the W08 flight reductions
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I see 05 is in use today, have they got the glideslope and all the landing equipment working and signed off now?
Operating 05 again today due to the strong northerly winds which are forecast to gust upto 25-35kts today at some point.
-HD-