Finnish Lappeenranta to become Ryanair's gate to Russia?
7006 fan:
Yes, and if you're a Russian you still pay much less than a Westener where travel is concerned. They still pay about 30% of the going rate for a former Soviet hotel, eg the Rossiya in Moscow. They also pay much less for domestic and international travel on Russian-based carriers. Some would argue that in both cases that's all they're worth.
With regard to the visa situation, the great fear (as I understand it), is that if Russia eliminates the visa requirement for EU nationals, there will have to be a reciprocation, thus raising the spectre of the EU being flooded with a significant criminal element. Most Chechens carry Russian passports - think about it.(btw - for those of you who might think it's flooded already - you ain't seen nothin' yet!)
This is precisely what happened with Albania.
On the plus side there would presumably be a significant inflow of beautiful Russian women too!
Yes, and if you're a Russian you still pay much less than a Westener where travel is concerned. They still pay about 30% of the going rate for a former Soviet hotel, eg the Rossiya in Moscow. They also pay much less for domestic and international travel on Russian-based carriers. Some would argue that in both cases that's all they're worth.
With regard to the visa situation, the great fear (as I understand it), is that if Russia eliminates the visa requirement for EU nationals, there will have to be a reciprocation, thus raising the spectre of the EU being flooded with a significant criminal element. Most Chechens carry Russian passports - think about it.(btw - for those of you who might think it's flooded already - you ain't seen nothin' yet!)
This is precisely what happened with Albania.
On the plus side there would presumably be a significant inflow of beautiful Russian women too!
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an update about visas
September 29,
Russia and the European Union could sign an agreement on simplifying visa regulations at an October summit in London*, the British Ambassador to Russia Tony Brenton said Thursday. The ambassador said that every effort was being made to make sure the document was signed, but added that Russia and the EU had so far failed to iron out all the details.
Russia's envoy to London, Yury Fedotov, said Wednesday the planned agreement was only a step toward a visa-free regime.
"If this is done, it will be an important and easy-to-understand result of the summit because it [the simplification of visa regulations] affects interests of millions," the diplomat said.
But the signing of this agreement "does not remove the strategic task of achieving visa-free regulations between Russia and the EU."
___________
* October 4th
Russia and the European Union could sign an agreement on simplifying visa regulations at an October summit in London*, the British Ambassador to Russia Tony Brenton said Thursday. The ambassador said that every effort was being made to make sure the document was signed, but added that Russia and the EU had so far failed to iron out all the details.
Russia's envoy to London, Yury Fedotov, said Wednesday the planned agreement was only a step toward a visa-free regime.
"If this is done, it will be an important and easy-to-understand result of the summit because it [the simplification of visa regulations] affects interests of millions," the diplomat said.
But the signing of this agreement "does not remove the strategic task of achieving visa-free regulations between Russia and the EU."
___________
* October 4th
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Well, FR still doesn't fly to any town close to St. Petersburg. Did MOL forget about the potential associated with the multi-million population of Western Russia and its historical towns? Well, not at all. But there are some hints FR might think about changing its attitude and flying... directly to some Russian destinations.
13/09/06
Source: Flightglobal.com
Well, it's in fact the first time FR's representative hints officially about Russia. How likely the agreements are? Let's observe the situation.
Ryanair eyes Russia and other medium-haul routes as bilateral agreements expand European cabotage zone
By Kerry Ezard
Irish budget carrier Ryanair will consider adding destinations in Russia to its network if the country enters a bilateral air services agreement with the European Union (EU).
St Petersburg and other Russian cities would be a “natural extension” to the carrier’s network, Ryanair director of new route development Bernard Berger said yesterday at the World Low-Cost Airlines Congress in London.
“If Russia becomes available, there are many possible destinations [for Ryanair],” says Berger, adding that any future foray into the Russian market for the carrier “would depend on airport costs”.
By Kerry Ezard
Irish budget carrier Ryanair will consider adding destinations in Russia to its network if the country enters a bilateral air services agreement with the European Union (EU).
St Petersburg and other Russian cities would be a “natural extension” to the carrier’s network, Ryanair director of new route development Bernard Berger said yesterday at the World Low-Cost Airlines Congress in London.
“If Russia becomes available, there are many possible destinations [for Ryanair],” says Berger, adding that any future foray into the Russian market for the carrier “would depend on airport costs”.
Source: Flightglobal.com
Well, it's in fact the first time FR's representative hints officially about Russia. How likely the agreements are? Let's observe the situation.
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Sorry for reviving a VERY old thread (started in 2005), Ryanair already fly to Lappeenranta anyway. However, my new message is not necessarily about Lappeenranta and may relate to any other European airline.
Last Monday the Finnish and Russian Transport Ministers have signed a protocol amending the air services agreement between Finland and Russia. The protocol significantly liberalises air transport services between the two countries. According to the press release of the Finnish Ministry of Transport and Communications:
Just pondering the significance of that document. Could it be a kind of loophole giving low-cost carriers an opportunity to enter Russia via Finland? Like Ryanair via Tampere or Norwegian [and others] via Helsinki to St. Petersburg, Moscow or anywhere else? Ryanair do not sell connecting flights, it's their strategy, but some other LCC's do it. Are there still many hurdles to overcome or is it just a question of direct negotiations between the airlines and Russian airports? So vast market out there... What's your opinion?
Last Monday the Finnish and Russian Transport Ministers have signed a protocol amending the air services agreement between Finland and Russia. The protocol significantly liberalises air transport services between the two countries. According to the press release of the Finnish Ministry of Transport and Communications:
With the amendment, the concept of a national airline is removed from the air services agreement. In the future an undertaking operating air services between Russia and Finland does not need to be in Finnish ownership. It is enough that the airline is established in Finland and has an Operating Licence and Air Operator Certificate issued in accordance with local regulations.
As a result of a ruling by the European Court of Justice, bilateral air service agreements between EU Member States and Russia must be renegotiated with respect to certain parts.
In December 2010, a decision was taken that these negotiations would commence between Finland and Russia. The protocol that was now signed makes Finland the first country with which Russia has revised the agreement. This agreement can also be used as a basis for negotiations between Russia and other EU countries.
The amendment enables the designation of more than one airline on a route between two cities. In addition, it removes obligatory commercial agreements between airlines.
'I am pleased that the protocol amending the air services agreement has finally been signed. The revised agreement enables more diverse flight connections from Finland to Russia and vice versa. I believe that in the future this will benefit the consumers', Minister of Transport Ms Merja Kyllönen says.
As a result of a ruling by the European Court of Justice, bilateral air service agreements between EU Member States and Russia must be renegotiated with respect to certain parts.
In December 2010, a decision was taken that these negotiations would commence between Finland and Russia. The protocol that was now signed makes Finland the first country with which Russia has revised the agreement. This agreement can also be used as a basis for negotiations between Russia and other EU countries.
The amendment enables the designation of more than one airline on a route between two cities. In addition, it removes obligatory commercial agreements between airlines.
'I am pleased that the protocol amending the air services agreement has finally been signed. The revised agreement enables more diverse flight connections from Finland to Russia and vice versa. I believe that in the future this will benefit the consumers', Minister of Transport Ms Merja Kyllönen says.
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It is enough that the airline is established in Finland and has an Operating Licence and Air Operator Certificate issued in accordance with local regulations.
pee - I thought that Brussels had a *very* strong preference for deals like this to be negotiated purely at an EU level, rather than at individual country level. Would this have any impact here ?
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Yeah, originally it's been a local deal tailored just for Finland and our Eastern neighbours. Brussels wanted it to be altered to concern the entire European Union, so that everybody who wants to fly from the territory of Finland to Russia had the same conditions/ rules (all EU registered airlines). The deal has been ammended according to this. Now, what obstacles still exist, has to be clarified. Will it be possible just to negotiate directly with, say, Novosibirsk airport and without any further permissions start flying there (from HEL, TMP, OUL and so on), I'm not sure.
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It is enough that the airline is established in Finland
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Hello everybody!
Was very pleasant to find such topic about Ryanair from LPP made in 2005 comparing with 2010 when Ryanair started flying.Thats really works!
Morever, im located in LED and have a transport company which deliver Russian passenegers from LEd to LPP by my buses and back. 90% of my clients are Russians travelling to Europe, 10% are Westerns coming to LED.
The demand is very strong and i feel that someday visas can be canceled for EU citizens but i wont discuss it as 2 much time can be spent for this.
The main reason why im here is that i wish to make seasonal charters for the first time and regular ones from LPP to the Barcelona as thats the most popular city for Russians here. I have a sponsor who can invest and need an airline which can offer a cargo for these aims.
Specialists are always welcome. We can discuss all detailes of the work. You can send prv message.
Cyril Sokolov
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@Falconson
Hi, Cyril.
To make things clear, I'm not the employee of Ryanair. My knowledge is related to some local sources - not even directly located in LPP as I live elsewhere in Finland.
I'll make some comments, though.
> The demand is very strong.
Indeed, it seems to be strong, but as you write...
> 90% of my clients are Russians travelling to Europe, 10% are Westerns coming to LED.
...and it's the result of the fact Ryanair do not even hint Lappeenranta as their "gate to Russia", as stated in the title of this thread and do not mention St. Petersburg. Whatever the reason, they don't advertise that in such way (elsewhere the airports' proximity to big centres is being emphasized, here not). There is no information about any bus connections LPP <-> LED on FR site either.
> That really works!
Well, it does, despite the very restrained attitude of Ryanair. But to my knowledge, there are no new routes coming to LPP regardless of the potential it has. Why? Mainly because Ryanair wants a couple-euro-per-pax marketing support from the town of Lappeenranta. It probably won't happen, because so many travellers, like your customers, just don't need Lappenranta town for their European travels. They need just LPP airport and Ryanair, nothing else, their money will not return to commune of Lappeenranta. As simple as that. Now back to Ryanair. They are obviously the party that could gain the most from this exceptional location of LPP. In their thinking there is, however, one main obstacle. No support, no routes. In other words, no 2 euro per pax, nothing will happen. In that case it looks like a very unreasonable self-limiting rule. You write
> Barcelona thats the most popular city for Russians here.
It possibly means, that Ryanair could try to sell tickets LPP - BCN or LPP - GRO with profit from the very beginning without the couple-euro-per-pax extra. Yeah, but here we go again: no support, no routes. Needless to say, they could sell bus tickets of the enterprise like yours getting the 2 €/ pax this way, but aren't active in that regard.
Having said this, keep trying in getting the attention, the potential is there, I'm sure.
Anyway, what would the Russian authorities say if someone tried to advertise LPP as St. Petersburg-West? Can you anticipate?
...
Hi, Cyril.
To make things clear, I'm not the employee of Ryanair. My knowledge is related to some local sources - not even directly located in LPP as I live elsewhere in Finland.
I'll make some comments, though.
> The demand is very strong.
Indeed, it seems to be strong, but as you write...
> 90% of my clients are Russians travelling to Europe, 10% are Westerns coming to LED.
...and it's the result of the fact Ryanair do not even hint Lappeenranta as their "gate to Russia", as stated in the title of this thread and do not mention St. Petersburg. Whatever the reason, they don't advertise that in such way (elsewhere the airports' proximity to big centres is being emphasized, here not). There is no information about any bus connections LPP <-> LED on FR site either.
> That really works!
Well, it does, despite the very restrained attitude of Ryanair. But to my knowledge, there are no new routes coming to LPP regardless of the potential it has. Why? Mainly because Ryanair wants a couple-euro-per-pax marketing support from the town of Lappeenranta. It probably won't happen, because so many travellers, like your customers, just don't need Lappenranta town for their European travels. They need just LPP airport and Ryanair, nothing else, their money will not return to commune of Lappeenranta. As simple as that. Now back to Ryanair. They are obviously the party that could gain the most from this exceptional location of LPP. In their thinking there is, however, one main obstacle. No support, no routes. In other words, no 2 euro per pax, nothing will happen. In that case it looks like a very unreasonable self-limiting rule. You write
> Barcelona thats the most popular city for Russians here.
It possibly means, that Ryanair could try to sell tickets LPP - BCN or LPP - GRO with profit from the very beginning without the couple-euro-per-pax extra. Yeah, but here we go again: no support, no routes. Needless to say, they could sell bus tickets of the enterprise like yours getting the 2 €/ pax this way, but aren't active in that regard.
Having said this, keep trying in getting the attention, the potential is there, I'm sure.
Anyway, what would the Russian authorities say if someone tried to advertise LPP as St. Petersburg-West? Can you anticipate?
...
Last edited by pee; 22nd Nov 2011 at 13:12.
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Falconson, you should try to contact Wizzair, it is even more experienced in Eastern Europe than Ryanair. I suppose LPP could fit their profile and to BCN they already fly. Theoretically they could use Poland- or Hungary- based planes with flight patterns like that:
Day 1: KTW (or WAW or BUD) - LPP - BCN - KTW
Day 2: KTW - BCN - LPP - KTW
Travelling from LED to WAW, BUD or KTW "Krakow West" isn't cheap either, so such kind of routes could also work well.
Day 2: KTW - BCN - LPP - KTW
