Moremi Air van down
 

Any more info on this ?

**** man, the plane is still smoking. Obviously you are in town to hear about this. How about asking the people there and have a little respect instead of running to the forums to be the first to post about it.

Heard over the radio.since you close enough to see the smoke,any more info ?

Then you should already have all the info you need.

Information
 

Please let us know information as and when it becomes available - have friends waiting to hear if business associates were on the flight....

People ask out of concern and heartache - generally because they may know someone on the flight - dont think thats disrespectful. The news is already out there and its only half the story - if youve lost someone in an accident before youll know what its like to sit and wait - judge a little less harshly!

I totally agree with Mavs. Yeah.:rolleyes: Stop being too quick to judge without knowing why anyone would want to find out more info.

Please if you know who the pilot was and if they are ok can you please pm me as I have allot of close friends that I have not heard from.

lilflyboy262.
I assume you knew some of the people who were on board this flight and that, in any event, you are in Maun at this tragic and traumatic time.

I used to fly that plane, certainly brings things into perspective. Sad times for Botswana and for Moremi Air

This thread seems to be playing very close to its chest... a few more details for those of us who aren't resident in Botswana please? I have an old colleague and friend who works for Moremi - and it would be useful to know who/what/when/where/how.

This is not being ghoulish, but some facts to prevent the wrong thing being said to the wrong person...

If it is as bad as it sounds - next of kin to be informed before the press see any detailed information here please.

As requested, post deleted.

Please calm down and do not speculate.

Maun is a very close knit community and the local pilots will clearly be traumatised by the loss of friends.

Give them a little time and I am sure that someone will post a factual report of what happened, number of casualties, etc.

PLEASE show some sensitivity, the only people with the facts will almost certainly have lost close friends. The victims could well include pilots who have posted in this forum.

Yeah, never good to speculate but lets just hope the usual suspects (overloading or buggering around on a game flight) dont rear their ugly heads yet again.
Oompilot, all pilots complain about things all the time no matter where you are although must say that I been there done that, took the pineapple with Sefofane so they probably have a reason for complaining.:} Was hoping that with them getting bigger and a nicer fleet that it would change but obviously the leopard has not changed its spots.

I work for one of the other companies in Maun, and was in the air when the accident happened and the events following. This is the first fatal accident in several years here and has come as quite a shock.

The aircraft crashed very shortly after takeoff from one a strip at the northern edge of the Delta (about 25 mins from Maun in a Caravan). A fire destroyed most of the aircraft, only the tail remained intact. Whether the fire was post impact or started inflight is unknown. There were 10 pax and 1 (experienced) pilot onboard. Only 4 of the pax survived, some still in critical condition. The response from the different operators in the area, and from the BDF was quick. First people overhead within minutes, and medical crews there within an hour.

That's all the facts that are publicly known at the moment.

The most widely believed cause is an engine failure immediately after takeoff.

****. From this thread and elsewhere, I'm not liking what I'm hearing. I'm very much afraid that the pilot is the same guy who trained me in a Caravan. If so, he was extremely careful, pedantic, as thorough and conservative a pilot you could wish to find. He was so careful about every aspect of flying, and was always more prepared than less - and definitely had the experience to get out of a problem if it arose.

I simply can't believe this has happened.

Can anyone confirm if the pilot had the initials P.M. ?

Just heard it on French TV. 4 Swedes, 2 British and 2 French burned to death. 2 other French (a couple probably sitting at the back of the Van) survived and have been hospitalized in Joburg...

Article on Moremi
 

PM now fly's for Mack Air

Thanks Redsteel- looked at company website but PM was still shown as one of Moremi's pilots.

Following this thread and elsewhere on the web, I am absolutely gutted by the news about Martin. As mentioned earlier, he was one of my check pilots in the Van, and I cannot get my brains around how a steady, conservative, careful, and thoroughly experienced professional pilot like Martin could have crashed and been killed in such a tragic way.

There are so many other idiots that fly badly, take risks, don't care, break the rules, cut corners and generally push right up against their mortality and still get away with it. It is not right and not fair that Martin, who did none of the above ended up being killed so awfully, and these others still get away with it day after day. If I believed in a higher authority, it would be very very hard to make sense of their actions on this day.

I liked and very much respected Martin. He was a good man and a good pilot. I am honoured to have known him, and even more honoured that he trained me. Whenever I fly a Van in the future, I will remember him. You are missed Martin, and from all his friends and colleagues in Kenya our hearts and sympathy to Clare and Tanisha.

Second Plane Crash In A Week In Botswana's Okavango Delta | Fox News

Pleased to see that everyone walked away from this one.

Could there be a common factor here ?

It is many years ago now but I recall that some strips could turn to deep mud after rain and make it difficult to accelerate for takeoff.

OTOH, I have no idea what the conditions there are now so they could be in a drought with no hope of rain.

oompilot - that "quote" you posted was from a 2009 article - different chief pilot. :D

Fox News article-since when did Delta Air start fitting turboprop engines to their Cessna 206s ?:ugh: Or else it was a Cessna 208 Caravan-can someone clarify the details please?

A2-AID

Aviation Safety Network > ASN Aviation Safety WikiBase > Geographical regions index > ASN Aviation Safety Database results


This database also says turbo prop but they should have said turbo charged.

A2-AID Cessna | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

My first flying job was in Maun. I replaced Martin after he had resigned to go to Delta Air, flying A2-AJE (hence my username). I knew him and his wife (then girlfriend). 10 years later I now work for Youknowwho in the sandpit and had planned to meet up with Martin on one of my Nairobi flights but sadly we seemed to keep missing each other. He is a friend on my Facebook and was down as a "YES" to attend the Maun pilots 1998-2000 reunion in Macau. What a shock!! My deepest sympathies to his family. I'm sure we will all be charging our glasses for him at the reunion next year.

Skwinty-in regards to A2-AID and all the other C206s in Botswana; as far as I know none of them have turbocharged piston engines (naturally aspirated) but C206s in Namibia were commonly fitted with turbochargers due to higher elevation.

Martin's Memorial
 

I have an important message from Martin's family regarding the wake that was tentatively planned for this Saturday.

In view of the scale of the tragedy, and that the bodies are still being held for identification, any memorial for Martin and the other victims of this tragedy is being temporarily postponed. A wake will definitely be held, but not just yet. This applies to the Maun/Botswana flying community more than us in Kenya, so please spread the message that nothing is happening for this Saturday, but they will let you know when/where it will be held.

Heard that a 9th passenger passed away from complications due to the burns.
Tragic.
I am surprised to see how well Moremi Air have kept quiet about the other 5 accidents that have happened over the last three years.
This one brings the total to 6.

How are they still operating?

Thats because there hasn't been 5 others in the past 3 years.

AFE, PPL, KWA (or was it LEB?)
DOG was longer than 3 years ago.

The last fatal one was a lot longer than that.

DOG - Nov 2008 as per post on Pprune. hmmm 3 years by my calculation.
AEI?

Either way, somethings up and not quite right. Training? Management? Bad luck?
Hope it gets sorted.

Seems my memory is a little off :oh:

I have a theory as to why PPL and KWA were kept quiet. You seem to be in the know so you probably know what I'm talking about.

AEI didn't crash. Just had an off field landing :E


Some have been pilot error, some have been bad luck.

This is the 4th total aircraft write-off in 14 months for Moremi Air.
AFE - Aug 2010
PPL - Nov 2010
KWA - Jan 2011
and now AKD - Oct 2011

In addition to which, there was DOG in Nov 2008 (also a write-off) and AEI 1 month prior to AKD, AEI could have been more than an "off field landing" had there not been a road in the area.
The fact that AKD is the first fatality in many years is no excuse. Why is this operator still flying??

Moremi Air seems to be having a lot more incidents/ accidents than other operators in Maun, and yes I was flying a C206 around the Delta at the same time that A2-DOG was destroyed. Nothing much seems to have changed since then and few lessons have been learnt.:(

What does concern me is the reliability of the Pratt & Witney PT6 engine and the rate of recent engine failures on the Cessna 208 Caravan. I think this year Mack Air had an engine failure on takeoff out of Piajio in January and about 3 years ago Sefofane also had a problem on the takeoff roll but stopped in time.

Does anyone have any background knowledge on the PT6 powerplant and know of any problems they have experienced in the past ie A.D.s etc. ?

Regards,

Rico

I believe there is a question as to whether there was any component failure in the engine involved in this tragedy. It seems the cause of the power loss may be external to the engine itself.

One of the prime causes of premature PT6 failures is pilot error.
The inertial separator MUST be used where there is any danger of dust or sand being ingested. Yes I know, it saps some power, but that is the price of operating in hostile conditions.

The PT6 is one of the most reliable engines ever built but any mechanical contrivance can be damaged by abuse and neglect.

Rico:

The PT6 series of engines has been around for over 40 years now, and there are tens of thousands of these engines in service on many different types of aircraft.

If you think that the engine is an area of concern in the various accidents and incidents that you have enumerated, I think it would be more appropriate for you to narrow your focus and look at what 'common factors' these incidents have in common. For example, environmental conditions (e.g. hot & high, or salinity), maintenance practices, and even perhaps whether or not the same overhaul facility (not to mention the same regulatory authority providing oversight and control of the maintenance practices) was involved with all of these engines.

I'm not suggesting that this engine is flawless, instead, I am saying that you are taking too wide a view by just 'looking at the engine'. You need to investigate further and determine what other factors (related to engine operations) these accidents and incidents have in common.

Michael