African Aviation Regional issues that affect the numerous pilots who work in this area of the world.

SA to ryanair

Old 18th Jan 2018, 15:26
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SAA to ryanair

Hearing interesting rumours about SAA offering pilots to Ryanair? Any further info?

Last edited by UAV689; 19th Jan 2018 at 08:07.
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Old 18th Jan 2018, 19:39
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Who is the "SA" you are referring to?
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Old 19th Jan 2018, 08:07
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Sorry, meant SAA!
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Old 19th Jan 2018, 20:19
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It fits, SAA have excess 737 crews and have asked them if they are willing to work for other carriers.

See here
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Old 20th Jan 2018, 03:21
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But it's only for those holding EU passport, as per the information spec sheet.
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Old 20th Jan 2018, 10:42
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Devil EU passport

A mate at SAA told me that they've been told that Ryanair will accept pilots without EU passports for a 2 year period as they're on the scarce skills list or something like that.
Might only be for direct entry captains though and that the basing options would be limited by this.

Still could be better than an LCC job in SA (or mine!) for those with the green mamba.

Apparently they're going down to SA in the next few weeks to screen the SAA pilots that are interested.
If anyone down there (non-SAA) wants to see them as well it might be worth emailing them?
[email protected]
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Old 21st Jan 2018, 10:09
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Taking a Ryanair contract would be like crossing the picket line at a strike, and you will certainly have to come wearing your thickest skin. As a European citizen and EASA licence holder, I too have the opportunity to join Ryanair. I have declined specifically out of empathy for Ryanair pilots and cabin crew. You should do the same.
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 06:08
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I'm not sure I'd characterize it as crossing a picket line but I hear what you're saying Bonway. There are (as there always are) many sides to this.
SAA has just transferred the last B737-800s to Mango and now there are potentially 60 odd SAA pilots who could face losing their jobs. Therefor not everyone can afford to take the same viewpoint as you and need to put bread on the table.

One of the reasons SAA has taken that decision is because the pay and benefits at Mango are so much lower than SAA. Safair is even worse. And this isn't a case of SAA paying too much, it's that Mango and Safair pay way below the market rate for pilots.

So if a Mango pilot or a Safair pilot took up a Ryanair contract they'd they'd actually be standing in solidarity with their SAA, Mango and Safair counterparts by showing their own management that they are undervaluing and underpaying them.
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 12:18
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I don't think any/many FO's will take it. Ryanair are offering 177k euro per annum for B738 captains. Now that ain't too bad.

BTW : there are no pilot retrenchments planned at SAA. Around 100 pilots retire in the next 5 years. (+- 20 pilots retire per year) No indication from the union that jobs are at risk.

Last edited by Ghost_Rider737; 22nd Jan 2018 at 17:09.
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 13:31
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Bonway, you are clearly living in relative luxury where you can make those choices 'on a matter of principle'. I think that for several this will be a magic life-line, in more ways than one! And people from there will be, by necessity, a lot more 'thick skinned' than you might imagine in your relative luxury! By declining the 'opportunity' to work for Ryanair through your principles, do not complain if you find that you are indirectly helping non-EU citizens into those 'EU' jobs!
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Old 25th Jan 2018, 16:55
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Originally Posted by sa737driver View Post
A mate at SAA told me that they've been told that Ryanair will accept pilots without EU passports for a 2 year period as they're on the scarce skills list or something like that.
Might only be for direct entry captains though and that the basing options would be limited by this.

Still could be better than an LCC job in SA (or mine!) for those with the green mamba.

Apparently they're going down to SA in the next few weeks to screen the SAA pilots that are interested.
If anyone down there (non-SAA) wants to see them as well it might be worth emailing them?
[email protected]
for those rated captains requiring visas it would be Dublin, which is a great place to bring up a family from my own experience or Stansted, lots of Brazillians hired through these channels.
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Old 25th Jan 2018, 20:02
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Of course, we do have different opinions on this and that is how it should be. Our backgrounds are vastly different and they dictate our points of view. I grew up an orphan in Durban, paid for my flying by working as a miner in Virginia, OFS, did my national service at 6 SAI, including active time in Namibia and Angola, and I flew for SAA many years ago. Based upon that, accusations of my privileged status may be gravely overstated.

That said, the fact is, no EASA license and/or no EU passport and you won't be working for Ryanair anymore than I could walk into SAA or Mango tomorrow, no matter what Parc or Rishworth tell you. As fairly as you justify your differences between South African local carriers, so do I over here. Coming to work for Ryanair whilst the current dispute is in process, would, without any doubt, be a picket line crossing.
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Old 26th Jan 2018, 05:49
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Originally Posted by jonesyinthesky View Post
for those rated captains requiring visas it would be Dublin, which is a great place to bring up a family from my own experience or Stansted, lots of Brazillians hired through these channels.
Thanks Jonesy. I'll pass that on to my mates as well. They did say that the info being distributed says there will be limited basing options due to the work permit issue. I'm sure most will be thrilled if it's Ireland. Standsted would also be good. I think in the 90s some SAA pilots actually contracted for Ryanair out of Stansted on a short term contract?
Out of the three Ireland bases of Shannon, Cork and Dublin do you know which is the most junior and therefor "most likely" to get assigned to?
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Old 26th Jan 2018, 11:23
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Take your raincoats folk. It’s wet and windy!
Do contact the Unions in those countries to get the lowdown on what’s going on at the mo. I’d get their input in particular regards to the rather dodgy (tax wise) contracts that could be offered. Make sure you’re paid from day one on a direct contract. It may be that figures quoted are “contract rates” which when netted out will be well below headline figures. Ryanair are masters of working the numbers. Be prepared for a fairly brutal culture shock. Its not a bed of roses to say the least and most importantly bring your own screw top mug. Upside is they don’t charge for the hot water from the kettle but do remember your own tea bags or coffee! Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.
Think, very, very carefully, do extensive research and think long term, is it where you want to be? Don’t be tempted by cash alone. Ireland and UK are very expensive places to live. I know a number in US $ terms who earn less in SA but have I’d say a better overall standard of living.
That said... life’s an adventure.. hey!
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Old 26th Jan 2018, 12:20
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sa737driver

just spoke to my source and she said SNN and ORK no chance but DUB yes as well as the UK, most likely STN, for those with EU passports, most places in Italy/Sicily, nothing really in Spain apart from Lanzorote/Las Palmas, Portugal good opps in LIS and OPO, FAO, Bulgaria new base in Bourgas, Morrocco, Fez, Gdansk and Wroclaw in Poland, FRA in Germany plus bases for their charter airline Ryanair Sun in Poland, she said she thinks that RYR will do assessments in South Africa like they did in Brazil if there is enough interest.
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Old 26th Jan 2018, 12:23
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they are only offering RYR direct employment contracts and salaries are £135k all in in STN and about €150k in DUB, i only left so i could get some long haul experience but i would go back.
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Old 27th Jan 2018, 11:32
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Hi Jonesy
Thanks for taking the time to reach out to your contact and thanks again for posting that here. Obviously won't be taken as gospel or as a definite but it's nice to get an inkling of the idea! Really appreciate your time and effort.
The SAA guys have been told the same, that if there's enough interest Ryanair will go down to SA and do the screening there.
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Old 27th Jan 2018, 21:55
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Bonway
I like your attitude , and Your are quite right!
Here is the plan, engage with RYR at your hearts delight folks. Get an offer !

Then wait until the Union is properly in.
By this time next year the offer is 25% better and you all are ready for all the ATPL exams you need to write.
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Old 28th Jan 2018, 10:31
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BluSdUp

Cheers!

Joe le Tosh

Naai jou maatjie.
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Old 28th Jan 2018, 19:21
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Please keep it nice guys. It you want to have a shoving match please do it by PM.
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