Crazy Idea #206
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Crazy Idea #206
OK - I know this is crazy. If you are someone who can give an informed answer or tied in with someone who could give a realistic answer, then please post a reply.
If I was to fly a Cessna 206/210 to southern Africa - Botswana, Namibia, Zambia and then try to sell it how much trouble could I find. I see that many of the operators use these aircraft and of course they occasionally get bent. I have researched the USA end of things and I see no problems.
What say you bush flyers of Africa?
If I was to fly a Cessna 206/210 to southern Africa - Botswana, Namibia, Zambia and then try to sell it how much trouble could I find. I see that many of the operators use these aircraft and of course they occasionally get bent. I have researched the USA end of things and I see no problems.
What say you bush flyers of Africa?
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Don't know, whether the U$ is cheap enough, at the moment. Best would be, to contact the various operators in order to find out, who is willing to buy.
The one problem you might face is, that in any of those countries you would find a few people who already import a/c. They know the ropes, but certainly want their cut. So if you are trying to make a profit yourself, you might end up with a problem. I will give you 1 contact in Nam, read your pm.
The one problem you might face is, that in any of those countries you would find a few people who already import a/c. They know the ropes, but certainly want their cut. So if you are trying to make a profit yourself, you might end up with a problem. I will give you 1 contact in Nam, read your pm.
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How much trouble?
Umm... lots, I guess!
Just for a car you often need a curious document called a "carnet de passage," basically a mechanism that prevents you from selling your vehicle inside a certain country. I assume there is something similar in place for an aircraft.
When you cross the border to anywhere, even the USA, with something you want to sell there then you need to declare that to the customs authorities. Just at a guess you probably have no experience of dealing with African customs authorities otherwise you would probably know this is a really, really stupid idea. You could easily end up with an aircraft that was impounded for forever, when you couldn't just turn around and leave ("Oh, sorry, my mistake; did I say 'sell'? I just want to fill up the tanks and be on my way back over the border, okay? Byee.") but you certainly couldn't sell this now-smuggled aircraft of yours without paying a fine that left you out of pocket.
You seem to have some notion that you can just rock up with your Cessna and slip in un-noticed, lost in the crowd. Don't let this come as a shock but in Africa many officials are grossly underpaid in terms of their offical wages; they make their money off corruption, bribery and extortion. You really want to show up with an expensive airplane to try your luck in Africa with that crowd? This would be a guaranteed attention-getter.
Just for a car you often need a curious document called a "carnet de passage," basically a mechanism that prevents you from selling your vehicle inside a certain country. I assume there is something similar in place for an aircraft.
When you cross the border to anywhere, even the USA, with something you want to sell there then you need to declare that to the customs authorities. Just at a guess you probably have no experience of dealing with African customs authorities otherwise you would probably know this is a really, really stupid idea. You could easily end up with an aircraft that was impounded for forever, when you couldn't just turn around and leave ("Oh, sorry, my mistake; did I say 'sell'? I just want to fill up the tanks and be on my way back over the border, okay? Byee.") but you certainly couldn't sell this now-smuggled aircraft of yours without paying a fine that left you out of pocket.
You seem to have some notion that you can just rock up with your Cessna and slip in un-noticed, lost in the crowd. Don't let this come as a shock but in Africa many officials are grossly underpaid in terms of their offical wages; they make their money off corruption, bribery and extortion. You really want to show up with an expensive airplane to try your luck in Africa with that crowd? This would be a guaranteed attention-getter.
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Thanks for your post
You could be correct.
Is it possible that normal, eh, business practices will not be circumvented? That the aircraft will still go through the normal local government procedures to import an aircraft? Why will it be different if the airplane is already sitting on the ramp in country? I doubt a local air carrier will jeopardize his business.
Is it possible that normal, eh, business practices will not be circumvented? That the aircraft will still go through the normal local government procedures to import an aircraft? Why will it be different if the airplane is already sitting on the ramp in country? I doubt a local air carrier will jeopardize his business.
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I think I see what you are thinking of here but just stop and think about this one: Why can't you drive a car across the border to Canada or Mexico and sell it there? "Hey, Dude! Wanna buy a nice car?" Well, probably because, assuming you could sell the thing without being ripped off, beaten up or even killed stone dead then you will have to make it back across the border with a whole load of cash while the new owner will have to explain just where he came up with his new car. I don't suppose it could be any simpler with an airplane, could it?
You think you could get out of Mexico okay with $10 thousand in cash? Are you feeling that lucky? Now imagine leaving Africa with $100 thousand. Or will you take a check? If so, no need to go all the way to southern Africa, I know plenty of guys in West Africa ready to do a deal with you!
You think you could get out of Mexico okay with $10 thousand in cash? Are you feeling that lucky? Now imagine leaving Africa with $100 thousand. Or will you take a check? If so, no need to go all the way to southern Africa, I know plenty of guys in West Africa ready to do a deal with you!
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Its not a car, its a plane and almost all the a/c on the SA register are ex USA and in fact, there are a lot being advertised in SA that are still on the N register. Sefofane has bought all its caravans in the states and flown them to Bots or Nam as have a million other operators in the area.
Do your homework and you will find the way to get it done. If I were you I would start by contacting some of the aircraft sales companies in South Africa and ask them how they do it. Try aero export, they export a/c to RSA ex USA, foster aero,placo to name a few. contact them and ask how its done, hell they may even buy the a/c off you! Also try contact the charter opperators like Sefofane, Mac Air, Zambezi air, MAF, Airserv Uganda, delta air botswana, and a number of others in Namibia, they all have aircraft that they have imported and may even want another one.
Good luck and if you get it right, let me know, I would love to do a flight like that!
Dog
Do your homework and you will find the way to get it done. If I were you I would start by contacting some of the aircraft sales companies in South Africa and ask them how they do it. Try aero export, they export a/c to RSA ex USA, foster aero,placo to name a few. contact them and ask how its done, hell they may even buy the a/c off you! Also try contact the charter opperators like Sefofane, Mac Air, Zambezi air, MAF, Airserv Uganda, delta air botswana, and a number of others in Namibia, they all have aircraft that they have imported and may even want another one.
Good luck and if you get it right, let me know, I would love to do a flight like that!
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Your enthusiasm is commendable, Dog but perhaps those N-registered aircraft were bought in the States and flown back to Africa, not flown to Africa and bought right there on the ramp, when there is a very big difference between those two things.
Also, a Caravan (C208) burns Jet A, available everywhere, when this man is asking about a C206 or C210, when that means finding Avgas for the long flight across Africa.
Still, what do I know? Let us know how it works out if you try this, Mike.
Also, a Caravan (C208) burns Jet A, available everywhere, when this man is asking about a C206 or C210, when that means finding Avgas for the long flight across Africa.
Still, what do I know? Let us know how it works out if you try this, Mike.
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The hard bit is getting across the herring pond from Canada to Scotland
via Greenland and Keflavik. You will need ferry tanks and survival kit plus a lot of weather luck. Icing is a problem even in summer.
Plenty of light aircraft have done Europe to SA in easy stages.
Avgas can be a problem but it is doable with proper planning.
Ask the professional ferry pilots for advice.
There will be a lot of customs import/export paperwork and visa grief to organise in advance.
via Greenland and Keflavik. You will need ferry tanks and survival kit plus a lot of weather luck. Icing is a problem even in summer.
Plenty of light aircraft have done Europe to SA in easy stages.
Avgas can be a problem but it is doable with proper planning.
Ask the professional ferry pilots for advice.
There will be a lot of customs import/export paperwork and visa grief to organise in advance.
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I imported a Toyota Sienna about 12 years ago from a dealer in Vancouver, Canada to the Seattle area. The dealers in the Seattle area were charging a premium for this car and it pissed me off so I called a dealer in Vancouver on a wim. I told the Vancouver dealer I was from Seattle and he gave me the name of an importer in Seattle. The import expert cost me 700 and then I gave a good friend 100 bucks to swap out the odometer. And it was done and I saved about 3000 dollars. And yes the warranty was still good.
Also - in my banking career I did just a little international stuff with Canada. But I know a bunch of guys that did much more than me.
Last week I contacted the Botswana Transportation Ministry via the Botswana government web site with this same question. I'm not holding my breath for a reply. Per the web site there is a three country import (plus a few SA territories) agreement with SA, Namibia, and Botswana so technically they should all have the same regulations.
Also - in my banking career I did just a little international stuff with Canada. But I know a bunch of guys that did much more than me.
Last week I contacted the Botswana Transportation Ministry via the Botswana government web site with this same question. I'm not holding my breath for a reply. Per the web site there is a three country import (plus a few SA territories) agreement with SA, Namibia, and Botswana so technically they should all have the same regulations.
