Virgin Nigeria
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Virgin Nigeria
Hi Chaps
Was wondering if anyone has any news from VK regarding the non payment of salaries. I hear that the pay is late every month, and that the pilots are getting a bit uneasy.
I also hear that the airline does not have enough money to pay for maintenance and that VNC has had to be left behind in France as they could not secure any finance to get an engine.
These must be worrying times for those left in Lagos.
Cheers
Paddy
Was wondering if anyone has any news from VK regarding the non payment of salaries. I hear that the pay is late every month, and that the pilots are getting a bit uneasy.
I also hear that the airline does not have enough money to pay for maintenance and that VNC has had to be left behind in France as they could not secure any finance to get an engine.
These must be worrying times for those left in Lagos.
Cheers
Paddy
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The end is nigh
flying paddy,
From experience in that neck of the woods, it's not difficult to see when a company is going belly up!
For those who're still there hoping to move on to the EMB190 or some long-haul fantacy?
I wish you luck!
This is time to dust your CV's and start looking.
For me, late payments are the first indication that something has fundamentally gone wrong.
When it reaches the stage that pilots refuse to fly, they'll start to get salaries off sales of tickets to pay, by which time, its already too late!
Unfortunately, this is the jungle! You just have to learn to see the signs.
Time to move boys, thankfully, Arik has the 'METAL' to keep you all busy.
Here goes the once cherished positions held by those who never in their wildest imagination, believed they could possibly be bestowed with such.
A word is enough for the wise!
LJT
From experience in that neck of the woods, it's not difficult to see when a company is going belly up!
For those who're still there hoping to move on to the EMB190 or some long-haul fantacy?
I wish you luck!This is time to dust your CV's and start looking.
For me, late payments are the first indication that something has fundamentally gone wrong.
When it reaches the stage that pilots refuse to fly, they'll start to get salaries off sales of tickets to pay, by which time, its already too late!
Unfortunately, this is the jungle! You just have to learn to see the signs.
Time to move boys, thankfully, Arik has the 'METAL' to keep you all busy.
Here goes the once cherished positions held by those who never in their wildest imagination, believed they could possibly be bestowed with such.
A word is enough for the wise!
LJT
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Pity.
VK as far as I am concerned have tried to provide excellent service under difficult operating conditions.
They are an excellent airline.
ALML their services provider is also an excellent company,and I feel for them if the claim opening this thread is true.
I hope it is not true,and if it is true that they come out of it intact.
If anyone can,ALML and current VK mgmt should be able to.
Good luck guys.
VK as far as I am concerned have tried to provide excellent service under difficult operating conditions.
They are an excellent airline.
ALML their services provider is also an excellent company,and I feel for them if the claim opening this thread is true.
I hope it is not true,and if it is true that they come out of it intact.
If anyone can,ALML and current VK mgmt should be able to.
Good luck guys.
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AVSEC,
Don't blow smoke up our rear end. The current management were the ones that screwed up everything. Govt or the environment has nothing to do with the financial screw ups in the company. Get your facts straight.
Don't blow smoke up our rear end. The current management were the ones that screwed up everything. Govt or the environment has nothing to do with the financial screw ups in the company. Get your facts straight.
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A company that employs alot of expats,and puts them in luxurious apartments, while they barely manage to fly 40 block hours a month will surely rock the boat.Guys, call me racist or eat me alive, but that is a waste and the fact..Pilots are living like Kings, doing nothing at the expense of the company.Some have been in the employ of virgin for almost a year now and have not flown even one sector.The company is over bloated.At the end of the day, the same expats will pack their bags and leave while the locals will be left behind with red eyes when the company folds up.I am not against expats please but a good planning will do.I am just citing one of the factors that has led to the problem.VK also has a lot of ground staff (locals)doing nothing from the check in counters to the ramp and etibets place.
Last edited by 5N Pilot; 3rd Feb 2009 at 17:24.
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My House is ur House!
5N-Pilot, no worries mate, we have room for local pilots here at Arik.
No red eyes allowed over at VirginNigeria as far as I´m concerned, hopefully this will not be the case, but if it happens will be waiting with arms wide open.
Goodluck and hang in there.
B
PS: Balewa supports local Pilots
PS2: LJT heard from me mates here at Arik u once flew for VirginNigeria, this true!
No red eyes allowed over at VirginNigeria as far as I´m concerned, hopefully this will not be the case, but if it happens will be waiting with arms wide open.
Goodluck and hang in there.
B
PS: Balewa supports local Pilots
PS2: LJT heard from me mates here at Arik u once flew for VirginNigeria, this true!
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hey,hey....
Pilots are not the only employees at VK.
Apparently some think only pilot rostering/commuting is an essential part of what can make VK successful or not.
Shame on you.
Pilots are not the only employees at VK.
Apparently some think only pilot rostering/commuting is an essential part of what can make VK successful or not.
Shame on you.
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Two things!
BALEWA,
Your mates are entitled to imagine who i may be, or where i might have worked in the past. No problem with that.
I am curious to know why you ask though, and what significance that would have to Vk going belly-up?
5N Pilot,
I agree with you that the management of Vk has been the reason why Vk has ended up where it is. As i hear it, thats now a company where HR has more of a say in operations than the DFO,CP etc?
Apparently, the said HR guru's have been the master-minds of running the company into the ground with their less then ideal ideas about how an Aviation company should be run!
What do you expect when most of them came form British-American Tobacco; Unseemly thinking this is the advent of cigarette marketing and advertisements??!!
fayz76,
I shall ask your ear here.
I would imagine that what 5N Pilot refers to is basically what i have stated above or at least along those lines. Venting his frustration on what he may see daily or perceive.
I must point out that though you may view his statements as racist, i would implore you to see it differently.
I do agree though, that his mention of the word 'racist' must have spurred your response.
Expats sometimes come as Black people from other countries and do not necessarily have to be white.
If I for instance, took one of the deals being offered me either by Flightdeckrecruitment or one of the other agencies? I would be heading to Lagos as an expat, regardless of my nationality.
I must say, that what you have stated holds water.
Different people perceive particular events differently. It all depends on what angle an individual tends to view the same event.
I see where you are coming from, and i also see where 5N Pilot is coming from too.
You're both on the same side, just having two different views of the same situation.
I ask that we do not go into the racial connotations that could result from this thread and try to keep this discussion civil and within the boundaries of why Vk seems to be going under.
I BEG OF YOU ALL!!
LJT.
Your mates are entitled to imagine who i may be, or where i might have worked in the past. No problem with that.
I am curious to know why you ask though, and what significance that would have to Vk going belly-up?
5N Pilot,
I agree with you that the management of Vk has been the reason why Vk has ended up where it is. As i hear it, thats now a company where HR has more of a say in operations than the DFO,CP etc?
Apparently, the said HR guru's have been the master-minds of running the company into the ground with their less then ideal ideas about how an Aviation company should be run!
What do you expect when most of them came form British-American Tobacco; Unseemly thinking this is the advent of cigarette marketing and advertisements??!!
fayz76,
I shall ask your ear here.
I would imagine that what 5N Pilot refers to is basically what i have stated above or at least along those lines. Venting his frustration on what he may see daily or perceive.
I must point out that though you may view his statements as racist, i would implore you to see it differently.
I do agree though, that his mention of the word 'racist' must have spurred your response.
Expats sometimes come as Black people from other countries and do not necessarily have to be white.
If I for instance, took one of the deals being offered me either by Flightdeckrecruitment or one of the other agencies? I would be heading to Lagos as an expat, regardless of my nationality.
I must say, that what you have stated holds water.
Different people perceive particular events differently. It all depends on what angle an individual tends to view the same event.
I see where you are coming from, and i also see where 5N Pilot is coming from too.
You're both on the same side, just having two different views of the same situation.
I ask that we do not go into the racial connotations that could result from this thread and try to keep this discussion civil and within the boundaries of why Vk seems to be going under.
I BEG OF YOU ALL!!
LJT.
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Fayz76, i will like to ask you one question please: Are u not underutilized? How many hours do you fly ?How many staff and aircrafts does VK have? I am sure the answer will suffice.
If you feel insulted however, please i am very sorry, but in the context of VK being mismanaged, i stand by what i have written.
LJT, yes you are very much right, the DFO and CP are now errand boys of the HR, to the detriment of the company and VK pilots are treated as second class staff.
If you feel insulted however, please i am very sorry, but in the context of VK being mismanaged, i stand by what i have written.
LJT, yes you are very much right, the DFO and CP are now errand boys of the HR, to the detriment of the company and VK pilots are treated as second class staff.
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Someday VK HR should ask themselves if who justifies their jobs in the first place.
Oh and BTW I can confirm that there is no racism from expats who are working for VK, in fact I could go on to say that it is more of reverse racism in Lagos, without doubt I would say that some expats are treated with utter contempt.
Just an observation.
FP
Oh and BTW I can confirm that there is no racism from expats who are working for VK, in fact I could go on to say that it is more of reverse racism in Lagos, without doubt I would say that some expats are treated with utter contempt.
Just an observation.
FP
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My fellow ppruners, note that this thread was started by a disgruntled racist from S.A fired from VK recently,for his racist behavioural traits.
They were so happy to see him go,they almost held a party!
He is very pained!first jet job!
Any opportunity to run down vk..................................
To all VK pilots,listen to LJT,it may be time to dust your cv's
They were so happy to see him go,they almost held a party!
He is very pained!first jet job!
Any opportunity to run down vk..................................
To all VK pilots,listen to LJT,it may be time to dust your cv's
Last edited by seper; 4th Feb 2009 at 06:31.
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5N-PILOT
if the VK expat is your idea of luxury,i really would be afraid to see what "basics" mean to you
VK has the WORST deal for expats
-paid in local currency and in local banks and hit hard by exchange rate fluctuations
-only one month leave a year
-leave tickets are sorted out by expats themselves
-no meals in guest house
-transport srtictly for work,on your own for anything else
-medicals at your own expense.
Is this luxury?
They most have the lowest overheads for expats for any airline in Nigeria!
So how do they live like kings?
Guest house has bed tv/dstv and a swiming pool with algae................ are this luxury
you confuse me 5N-PILOT!
if the VK expat is your idea of luxury,i really would be afraid to see what "basics" mean to you
VK has the WORST deal for expats
-paid in local currency and in local banks and hit hard by exchange rate fluctuations
-only one month leave a year
-leave tickets are sorted out by expats themselves
-no meals in guest house
-transport srtictly for work,on your own for anything else
-medicals at your own expense.
Is this luxury?
They most have the lowest overheads for expats for any airline in Nigeria!
So how do they live like kings?
Guest house has bed tv/dstv and a swiming pool with algae................ are this luxury
you confuse me 5N-PILOT!
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Faisal,
I dont believe the "locals" are against you guys. Dont forget some of the locals live abroad, and have similar circumstances as you. The problem is the idiotic attitudes in the company and the fact that there are no avenues to vent. So what may seem as racist or anti-foreign attitudes are just misplaced frustrations.
I have to agree that the foreign guys have the worst terms in the nigerian aviation scene. But as you know the mgmt pilots are not going to do anything to help you guys. If it doesn't benefit them, to hell with you.
You guys need to come together and fight your battles, trust me on this.
Seper,
I beg to disagree, Flying Paddy may be a racist, i dont care. But is anything he posted racist?
I dont believe the "locals" are against you guys. Dont forget some of the locals live abroad, and have similar circumstances as you. The problem is the idiotic attitudes in the company and the fact that there are no avenues to vent. So what may seem as racist or anti-foreign attitudes are just misplaced frustrations.
I have to agree that the foreign guys have the worst terms in the nigerian aviation scene. But as you know the mgmt pilots are not going to do anything to help you guys. If it doesn't benefit them, to hell with you.
You guys need to come together and fight your battles, trust me on this.
Seper,
I beg to disagree, Flying Paddy may be a racist, i dont care. But is anything he posted racist?
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I am afraid that having lived in africa for a very long time it has become obvious to me that any expat who airs a difference of opinion that flys in the face of any african plan, gets branded as a racist.
I just threw a question out there to see what the boys where thinking about.
cheers
FP
I just threw a question out there to see what the boys where thinking about.
cheers
FP
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They have just lost two pilots last week due to bad management decision to stop paying them their per diem . then not giving them the accommodation allowance .they still waiting to be paid their last month salary !!
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NDB17, please edit your post...no use of PIN's please.
If the original post is true, and I have heard the rumors on the street, then this is sad.
The major bane of VK has been an overly powerful HR department, with no working knowledge of the aviation industry.
Secondly, and no less important, was the staffing at top management level, again no working knowledge of the aviation industry. FACTS.
Then there was the government interference which forced VK to start the international routes 3years too early, pull a/c out of scheduled services for an ill fated hadj exercise etc, etc.
lastly, whats this with refusing a major backer, UBA, from buying majority shares....if true.
At the end of the day, a bad case fro aviation in Nigeria.
And for all, the expats at VK have the worst deal ever. No Work, No Rec, enough to drive you up the wall..sad a lot of good chaps and lassies there.
If the original post is true, and I have heard the rumors on the street, then this is sad.
The major bane of VK has been an overly powerful HR department, with no working knowledge of the aviation industry.
Secondly, and no less important, was the staffing at top management level, again no working knowledge of the aviation industry. FACTS.
Then there was the government interference which forced VK to start the international routes 3years too early, pull a/c out of scheduled services for an ill fated hadj exercise etc, etc.
lastly, whats this with refusing a major backer, UBA, from buying majority shares....if true.
At the end of the day, a bad case fro aviation in Nigeria.
And for all, the expats at VK have the worst deal ever. No Work, No Rec, enough to drive you up the wall..sad a lot of good chaps and lassies there.
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NDB17
SHUNANNY said it all!I believe and agree with him 100% on his analysis of VK.Mangement did them in!
My own intention is to point out that the likes of FLYING PADDY,are not people with any reliable information,but members of a "i must run down vk at all cost"
He is yet to deny that he was fired from VK!
Check his previous posts,that will show you this gentleman has scores to settle!
Dispassionate views like yours is what we want!
SHUNANNY said it all!I believe and agree with him 100% on his analysis of VK.Mangement did them in!
My own intention is to point out that the likes of FLYING PADDY,are not people with any reliable information,but members of a "i must run down vk at all cost"
He is yet to deny that he was fired from VK!
Check his previous posts,that will show you this gentleman has scores to settle!
Dispassionate views like yours is what we want!
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If Flying Paddy is the guy I suspect he is, I would say he is no more racist than the other 30,000 plus ex-pats based in God's Own Country....
I'm European and hope I'm not racist...and I try very, very hard not to be racist - but after five years trying to deal with the bureaucracy and locals' attitudes here, it is almost too easy to either become racist or to appear racist due quite simply to the frustrations/conditions which Nigeria, and Lagos in particular, throw at you 24/7/365....
Was having a beer with some of the VK guys last week - to a man, all seemed pissed-off and couldn't wait to move on....The old timers to somewhere a bit ' easier ' to work and live, the younger guys to somewhere a bit ' easier ' to live....Not too sure they represent the attitudes of the whole of VK's crews, but seems to me that pretty soon the combined effects of VK's management and a Lagos basing might mean that VK soon will be one of the very, very few companies with more aircraft than crew....
I'm European and hope I'm not racist...and I try very, very hard not to be racist - but after five years trying to deal with the bureaucracy and locals' attitudes here, it is almost too easy to either become racist or to appear racist due quite simply to the frustrations/conditions which Nigeria, and Lagos in particular, throw at you 24/7/365....
Was having a beer with some of the VK guys last week - to a man, all seemed pissed-off and couldn't wait to move on....The old timers to somewhere a bit ' easier ' to work and live, the younger guys to somewhere a bit ' easier ' to live....Not too sure they represent the attitudes of the whole of VK's crews, but seems to me that pretty soon the combined effects of VK's management and a Lagos basing might mean that VK soon will be one of the very, very few companies with more aircraft than crew....
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VK had a problem right off the bat when it was started, run by a set of managers who did not have the interest of the airline at heart but their own selfish needs. Sorry to say this but unless the company takes a real hard look at its expenditure it wont last the year. Forget expat crew and staff they dont cost that much in the scheme of things, talk about leasing a piece of junk (767) to operate against major operators. Realising the mess and starting from the foundation is a good start but it will take a lot of patience on the part of the staff to bolster and rally behind the management to make it work. All the advise and ideas can be put on this site but I really believe the management who can change things dont read this and those that read this site have their hands tied by those who are out for themselves.
I wish VK a long and speedy recovery.
I wish VK a long and speedy recovery.