SA man gets 16 years in Kabul

[yokebearer]

Ok so now I am anally retentive and my life is perfectly structured. My mind boggles at the conclusions you guys can jump to. My sin is that I think humans should and can be more clever than they are and that punishing them by locking them up for a lifetime for stupidity is not achieving much....

By the - I did my time in Paki/Afghanistan in a King Air. And Sierra Leone, and the Congo. Had a family member murdered on his farm.

All for locking up some and even the death penalty.

Still not convinced locking up/executing stupid drug mules achieves much.

To Sousa - Buddy you seem a bit angry. The language you use is offensive and uncalled for. The sad thing is we probably know each other.....

[Doodlebug2]

The guy deserves all he gets!

[perceval]

with the country and his 'job' , am wondering if he'll actually serve that sentence or buy his way out . Where was he trying to get the stuff to anyway ? South ?

[unstable load]

God point Perceval.

As for the where to for the product, anywhere is as bad.

On the bright side, maybe BECAUSE of his job, he may not get out at all...

[flyems]

Mercenary (I know 'security consultant' sounds better these days) gone Drug dealer .Was probably personnal consumption to forget all the people he killed , tortured ...
Amusing demonstration of immanent justice .

his 'job'

Presume you know the guy? Presume you have some insight to his contract, and that of his employer? Do you actually know what he was employed to do there?

You are rather condescending about the person, I presume you’ve never been on the wrong side of the law? Never flown outside of the W&B envelope of an aircraft? Never pushed WX minima at any time? Never considered that those things kill people? Are you taking drugs to soothe your conscience?

[B Sousa]

To Sousa - Buddy you seem a bit angry. The language you use is offensive and uncalled for. The sad thing is we probably know each other.....

There is that Possibility. My fathers name surname was Sousa, not familiar with the Yoke bearer family.
We differ on the term Offensive. That language is just a polite way of saying we disagree. We cannot post offensive language here as this is a "sensitive" website. I do get a bit Abrupt at times, but Im sure you wil get over it. My posts serve the purpose, they get your attention.

Never flown outside of the W&B envelope of an aircraft? Never pushed WX minima at any time?

Slow down a bit, understand the point but lets not equate your post with six Kilos of Heroin.
I can only assume that Yoke Bearer has not had some close relative hooked on that. What they do to get that next fix.

Still not convinced locking up/executing stupid drug mules achieves much.

Au Contrare. It curbs recidivism........

[flyems]

Sensitivity Disclaimer: This post is written with no one person in mind, rather a general expression of my point of view...

Slow down a bit, understand the point but lets not equate your post with six Kilos of Heroin.

All a matter of relativity isn't it?

I'm always amazed at how easy it is to justify some potentially fatal transgressions of the law, and then preach from a moral high ground about other perceived fatal transgressions of the law, surely all potentially fatal transgressions of the law should be dealt with equally?

Separate to my previous statement, we could argue extensively about the validity of laws and their application, some would like to see laws pertaining to habit forming substances reversed to the extend that governments generate income from them as opposed to throwing large amounts of cash at curbing it with very little demonstrable effect.

I put it to you that addiction to heroin is no worse than addiction to other substances, I will refer to alcohol as an example. Cynically there seems to be a quiet acquiesce from most about alcohol, the biggest silence from those that benefit from it by means of tax collections... And before I get the lecture about the horrors of 'drugs', I've seen the sad results of all types of addictions first hand...

[unstable load]

surely all potentially fatal transgressions of the law should be dealt with equally?

Ideally, yes! Sadly due to various reasons, not least

that benefit from it by means of tax collections

among others, it is highly unlikely.

I put it to you that addiction to heroin is no worse than addiction to other substances, I will refer to alcohol as an example.

and I will concur, wholeheartedly, BUT (as there always is) it is still way beyond the expectations of even the most permissive of us to expect that

We should be able to regulate ourselves by now.

That day is in all honesty in the waay distant future and most likely nothing more that wishful thinking. Yes, it's a sad prospect that we are so fallible, but quite honestly that is the one thing that guarantees us uniqueness as human beings and anyone who seeks to standardise that particular foible is being foolhardy in the extreme.

Say for example it happens, what will we do with all those people who are in law enforcement right now, and where will the likes of GWB get a scapegoat to allow them to flex their muscles and go off and slap on the pipi?
We will degrade to being a species of sheep that is devoid of what makes us unique in the first place.
I for one do not want to be around when that day dawns.

[B Sousa]

I put it to you that addiction to heroin is no worse than addiction to other substances,

Maybe but no prize on that. There is one sidebar to the difference. Alcohol addictions runs at the most $25/day Heroin, maybe $300-400/day. NOW how do you think a heroin user is going to support that habit.

The point I get from Yoke bearer is that everything is OK, but someone else must pay for it. In this case if he supports it, let him pay, I certainly dont want too. Be it taxes or loss of property to support their habits.

Its nice to sit on that lofty spot and determine whats good for other people. Seems to be a lot of that and probably even more now that America has capitulated. I love it when all of a sudden its in their backyard and then listen to the noise.

As to the guy in Kabul, it will be interesting to see if he makes 16 years or bribes his way out. Im sure those who were in his chain of distribution could care less and certainly wont be sending him Red Cross packages anytime soon. His position has been replaced.

One other thing since we are beating this to death is about the "War on Drugs" which is a total failure by any standards. The U.S. crying the loudest of course. They are in Afghanistan and have plenty of power there, yet the Heroin exports have increased since their arrival. Go figure on that one. Its all about the money.....

[flyems]

most $25/day Heroin, maybe $300-400/day

In some 'dry' countries $25 of alcohol a day would not touch sides.... In Afghanistan $300-400/day of heroin would keep many people supplied with the stuff...

NOW how do you think a heroin user is going to support that habit

How do we support our habit of flying? How does a gambling addict support his habit? How does an alcoholic support his habit in a 'dry' country? There seems to be this stereotype that all habit forming substance users are out there to steal and pilfer and kill, deal with the person, not the substance... Should all alcohol sales be banned because of alcoholics? Should all tobacco sales be banned because people are addicted to nicotine? Should all casinos/horse racing be banned because of gambling addicts? Again, as a society we need to deal with the people, not the reason, if I am a responsible gambler/drinker, why should I be punished because of the small portion of people that are unable to do so responsibly? And yes, I am suggesting that there are responsible 'drug' users out there...

Its nice to sit on that lofty spot and determine whats good for other people

Exactly my point, to expand on that, sitting in a lofty spot with a glass of wine in your hand deciding which habit forming substance is acceptable or not...

As to the guy in Kabul, it will be interesting to see if he makes 16 years or bribes his way out

Reality is that anyone, regardless of the reason for their visit, will make an attempt to bribe their way out of third/developing world institutions of that kind.

Heroin exports have increased since their arrival

They're between a rock and a hard place in terms of heroin... The initial drive was to stop all production, but in doing so you are taking the livelihood away from the farmers, which is not a bright idea unless you can provide them with an alternate income... Guess when the 'enemy' then came along and promised the farmers unlimited production in exchange for support for the cause, it wasn't difficult to figure the way ahead...

[B Sousa]

How do we support our habit of flying?

Enough with the dodge. Could care less if the monetary amount in Afghanistan is different. Thats where the source lies. In the states if someone has a habit like that, they rob, steal and kill for that $3-400/day. Theres where we have the problem. Now you would prefer to legalize it so they all run around stoned. Maybe like drive head on into you while your out with the family? It dont work that way in life and I dont want to be burdened with their dumb a55. If the Government provides for them, then its me who foots the bill. I have no use for those folks. Take pity on them if you will, not me. Life is all about choices and if you make bad ones, you should have to live with them. I live with mine. ( actually she lives with her new husband)

Should all alcohol sales be banned because of alcoholics? Should all tobacco sales be banned because people are addicted to nicotine? Should all casinos/horse racing be banned because of gambling addicts?

OK, here we go again, cars because there are bad drivers?? Motorcycles?? Which reminds me some places require helmets. Why is that? Because if your dumb a55 gets in an accident and all of a sudden you become Mr Veggie head, whos going to pay for you? Thats right the rest of us. So wear your dam helmet. Then it decreases our odds of being burdened.
Alcohol, Tobacco, Horse racing are much less of a burden on the general population. Heroin IS NOT.

but in doing so you are taking the livelihood away from the farmers, which is not a bright idea unless you can provide them with an alternate income...

Heard that and I somewhat understand its a political football. Thats the extent of my understanding. You want it outlawed then destroy it. Farmers then turn bad guys, cull the herd. Sounds pretty harsh to many but thats life. It would be nice to be able to say they can grow roses or some other BS but in that terrain I dont know the possibilities. Either way its a problem, curb it OR just say F' it everything is fair game. That be the case Im going to grow some in the backyard along with some Coke plants and get rich. You may laugh but in many years working around the Narcotics field we did have some Opium Poppies growing in backyards in the states. Probably more now.

sitting in a lofty spot with a glass of wine in your hand deciding which habit forming substance is acceptable or not...

Your not going to win a prize with that either, I dont make the decisions. Hopefully they are made by someone a bit more level headed..ha ha

I think we have beat this dead horse alive again and one thing it does prove is there is by no means an easy answer, only opinions.