Whatzz uup at Safair
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Thank GOD for engineers! I sometimes know my co-pilots name.
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Nationwide sale
Do you think that Safair can buy Nationwide while retrenching or do you think they might buy the company to provide work for the safair techs?
Who does Nationwide's maintenance at present?
Who does Nationwide's maintenance at present?
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Cape Town
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Nationwide has their own AMO and Technicians wich is good. Well if you read into the Comair bussiness and what they did to Sunair it the past. Suspicion is that maybe Safair is working with SAA to get Comair off the map like they did with Sunair in this way Safair can maybe start there own airline. Well who knows what those sly CEO's are up to now again.
All we can do is wait and see
All we can do is wait and see
Join Date: Jul 2007
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share holders
I tend to agree with you that the shareholders should launch an invertigation, but we know it will not happen as we all know that safair is run by bean counters, not aviation orientated and dedicated aviation management. we used to have a saying " 16 hercs and 1 merc' now I hear it's just the other way around. as long as the share holders expect huge returns on their investment, safair will suffer, as we know that aviation cannot generate the same return as car leasing. I think alot of aeroplanes will be sold again, to satify said share holders, unfortunately, it will not help the company. They need to fly on contracts, not park the hercs and hope for better days.
Join Date: Jul 2007
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CONTRACTS/MARKETING/CONTRACTS/MARKETING/CONTRACTS/MARKETING!!!
That is what it is about gentlemen, not empty promises.
Happy aircrew are productive aircrew-truth and transparency instead of silence!
That is what it is about gentlemen, not empty promises.
Happy aircrew are productive aircrew-truth and transparency instead of silence!
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Has any one have some new news on the SAFAIR Sagga. Well I wonder if Comair can see what will happen to them in the future if they eventually put all their eggs in one Bascket. I wonder if the top people in Safair Comair and Saa read thease forums. Maybe they can Learn something. Well if you know them or some one who is high up tell them about these forums
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Air -crew Salaries
What should happen, is that Safair should pay their Air-crew's per hour flown, and not a fixed salary so that they can sit around and still take home a handsome salary at the end of the month for doing nothing.
Join Date: Jun 2005
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Safair etc.
It seems that Safair forms part of or falls under Imperial Holdings, as are, allegedly, NAC and through share holding Naturelink.
In a recent interview om ClassicFM the newly appointed CeO, Hubert Broody, mentioned that aviation is no longer part of its strategic vision.
You decide
In a recent interview om ClassicFM the newly appointed CeO, Hubert Broody, mentioned that aviation is no longer part of its strategic vision.
You decide
Join Date: Nov 2002
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Arend III I would have to agree with you. fzzr0 what are you on about dude. Are you trying to br sarcastic. I am with safair and believe me we are not earning the greatest salaries to start off with. Granted we do not work very hard compared to most SA airlines but no one is being forced to work for these other slave driving airlines.
Have a great day
ct
Have a great day
ct
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Jealousy makes you nasty
It sounds to me that fzrr0 might be one of those disgrunteled workers in OPS getting pissed off because us flying crew get paid S&T. What he does not understand is that WE are the ones sitting away from loved ones over christmas and new years, WE are the ones missing family birthdays while he sits fat, dumb and happy in his air con office and drives his merc home every night to his family. Another thing, maybe if we were actually flying, we could look at per hour pay.
But the way things are going now, WE will get other jobs, but what about you?
But the way things are going now, WE will get other jobs, but what about you?
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Jobs
SAFARi fire fighter. For your information, its when Airlines fly, that they make money, and then everyone is happy. Like you say if you fly you could look at per hour rates. I dont sit in OPS, and am probably away from home a lot more that you, also over most holidays and festive season.
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fzrr0 that is a good point. Can I forward your last statement to our marketing dept. I wish we could fly more. So do all the guys that are sitting around for weeks and weeks doing squat. I still do not understand your comment about getting paid by the hour though.
I may just be missing something.
ct
I may just be missing something.
ct
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The demise of Safair
Gentlemen, a lot of posts have been going around about Safair. A lot of blame has been put on management at Safair and some people on this site have even gone so far as to blame the aircrew for sitting at home and earning a salary. Be that as it may, I think its time we look at what is happening and what needs to happen fast or a once great company will be lost forever.
Imperial Holdings, the parent company who acquired SAFAIR in 1998 (as well as NAC and recently acquired Naturlelink through shareholding), seems not to be interested in their aviation division anymore, according to the new CEO of Imperial, Mr Hubert Brody. This was made public by himself in a recent interview on a Classic FM radio show when he indicated that “aviation is no longer part of its strategic vision.” Makes me wonder why they even appointed Mr Hugh Flynn as the new chief executive officer of their Aviation division, probably just to shut it all down. All of these names are freely available on Imperial’s website, should the moderators be concerned about their mention.
So bearing this in mind, you now have Safair receiving no more financial backing from Imperial, yet still having to show a profit to the Imperial investors. Last I heard it was something ridiculous like 30% (you show me any aviation company who can consistently show that kind of profit every year). Management is thus doing the only thing they can to achieve this, selling off assets. One can only sell off so many assets before you start to damage your core business - in this case, the leasing out of aircraft and providing specialized operation. The next step would be to try and bring in more funds with existing contracts. To achieve this you start to review your contracts and increase prices, thereby risking losing your clients to competitors. The next step is to cut overheads. The best way to do this is retrench personnel and presto, you save more money. But there is an old saying in aviation. To make a small fortune you need to start with a big one. The problem is, the small fortune is now getting so small that you cannot make a profit anymore.
The bottom line is, unless Safair gets some serious investors to back them and soon, this company is not going to be around for much longer.
Imperial Holdings, the parent company who acquired SAFAIR in 1998 (as well as NAC and recently acquired Naturlelink through shareholding), seems not to be interested in their aviation division anymore, according to the new CEO of Imperial, Mr Hubert Brody. This was made public by himself in a recent interview on a Classic FM radio show when he indicated that “aviation is no longer part of its strategic vision.” Makes me wonder why they even appointed Mr Hugh Flynn as the new chief executive officer of their Aviation division, probably just to shut it all down. All of these names are freely available on Imperial’s website, should the moderators be concerned about their mention.
So bearing this in mind, you now have Safair receiving no more financial backing from Imperial, yet still having to show a profit to the Imperial investors. Last I heard it was something ridiculous like 30% (you show me any aviation company who can consistently show that kind of profit every year). Management is thus doing the only thing they can to achieve this, selling off assets. One can only sell off so many assets before you start to damage your core business - in this case, the leasing out of aircraft and providing specialized operation. The next step would be to try and bring in more funds with existing contracts. To achieve this you start to review your contracts and increase prices, thereby risking losing your clients to competitors. The next step is to cut overheads. The best way to do this is retrench personnel and presto, you save more money. But there is an old saying in aviation. To make a small fortune you need to start with a big one. The problem is, the small fortune is now getting so small that you cannot make a profit anymore.
The bottom line is, unless Safair gets some serious investors to back them and soon, this company is not going to be around for much longer.
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So bearing this in mind, you now have Safair receiving no more financial backing from Imperial, yet still having to show a profit to the Imperial investors. Last I heard it was something ridiculous like 30% (you show me any aviation company who can consistently show that kind of profit every year). Management is thus doing the only thing they can to achieve this, selling off assets. One can only sell off so many assets before you start to damage your core business - in this case, the leasing out of aircraft and providing specialized operation. The next step would be to try and bring in more funds with existing contracts. To achieve this you start to review your contracts and increase prices, thereby risking losing your clients to competitors. The next step is to cut overheads. The best way to do this is retrench personnel and presto, you save more money. But there is an old saying in aviation. To make a small fortune you need to start with a big one. The problem is, the small fortune is now getting so small that you cannot make a profit anymore.
The bottom line is, unless Safair gets some serious investors to back them and soon, this company is not going to be around for much longer.
The bottom line is, unless Safair gets some serious investors to back them and soon, this company is not going to be around for much longer.
Feasant Plucker
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So bearing this in mind, you now have Safair receiving no more financial backing from Imperial, yet still having to show a profit to the Imperial investors. Last I heard it was something ridiculous like 30% (you show me any aviation company who can consistently show that kind of profit every year)
“aviation is no longer part of its strategic vision.”
But look! Enter the White Knight, stage left, bearing a large valise stuffed with cash. His name? Ah! Now that would be telling!
(but it's not iKhaya.......)
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Salaries per hour flown
Hi CT,
What I am trying to say, is that if you were paid per hour flown, the Airline makes more money, and all are happy.(in the days that you could fly) Your Marketing division leaves a lot to be desired) believe me. Another topic of discussion could be:
Why is Safair selling off all their GOOD Herc's and sitting with the rubbish that Transafrik dumped? The Guys that made that decission, should be shot.
What I am trying to say, is that if you were paid per hour flown, the Airline makes more money, and all are happy.(in the days that you could fly) Your Marketing division leaves a lot to be desired) believe me. Another topic of discussion could be:
Why is Safair selling off all their GOOD Herc's and sitting with the rubbish that Transafrik dumped? The Guys that made that decission, should be shot.
Join Date: Mar 2006
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Commercial decision – you said.
What is a commercial decision? It is al about money – isn’t it?
Do you close something down when it is making money, or do you close it down when it is not making money ?(SAA not applicable)
I feel for the good, honest and passionate workers. But aviation is a career of hire and fire – South Africa is only now catching up with the rest of the world. Wait for the bad days – prepare it is coming. Wait for $ 100 /barrel.
Soon the resurrected guzzlers from the scrapers (DC 9’s MD’s 200 ect) will face doomsday.
Oh by the way – are you a Communist or Capitalist? Have you ever run your own company and employed personal? Do you know what’s a BOTTOM LINE ? This is what the shareholders are interested in. If you don’t make the FIGURE (like SAA) **** is coming.
I think that SAFAIR caught up with reality again like in the 90’s.
The biggest problem in aviation today is that very very very few pilot’s, engineers and also managers, are familiar with the business side of the game – the money side in other word.
By the way – a Mango pilot the other day could not tell me what are the costs for a tyre change, engine o/h or landing fee for the 800. It just shows you how far the flight decks are removed from reality?
I am sure that Gert de Klerk could tell you this while deaming.
How do you know if your company is making money?( SAA not applicable, they have no right for existence in a market economy)
TFC
What is a commercial decision? It is al about money – isn’t it?
Do you close something down when it is making money, or do you close it down when it is not making money ?(SAA not applicable)
I feel for the good, honest and passionate workers. But aviation is a career of hire and fire – South Africa is only now catching up with the rest of the world. Wait for the bad days – prepare it is coming. Wait for $ 100 /barrel.
Soon the resurrected guzzlers from the scrapers (DC 9’s MD’s 200 ect) will face doomsday.
Oh by the way – are you a Communist or Capitalist? Have you ever run your own company and employed personal? Do you know what’s a BOTTOM LINE ? This is what the shareholders are interested in. If you don’t make the FIGURE (like SAA) **** is coming.
I think that SAFAIR caught up with reality again like in the 90’s.
The biggest problem in aviation today is that very very very few pilot’s, engineers and also managers, are familiar with the business side of the game – the money side in other word.
By the way – a Mango pilot the other day could not tell me what are the costs for a tyre change, engine o/h or landing fee for the 800. It just shows you how far the flight decks are removed from reality?
I am sure that Gert de Klerk could tell you this while deaming.
How do you know if your company is making money?( SAA not applicable, they have no right for existence in a market economy)
TFC
Join Date: Mar 2006
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So bearing this in mind, you now have Safair receiving no more financial backing from Imperial, yet still having to show a profit to the Imperial investors. Last I heard it was something ridiculous like 30% (you show me any aviation company who can consistently show that kind of profit every year). Management is thus doing the only thing they can to achieve this, selling off assets. One can only sell off so many assets before you start to damage your core business - in this case, the leasing out of aircraft and providing specialized operation. The next step would be to try and bring in more funds with existing contracts. To achieve this you start to review your contracts and increase prices, thereby risking losing your clients to competitors. The next step is to cut overheads. The best way to do this is retrench personnel and presto, you save more money. But there is an old saying in aviation. To make a small fortune you need to start with a big one. The problem is, the small fortune is now getting so small that you cannot make a profit anymore.
The bottom line is, unless Safair gets some serious investors to back them and soon, this company is not going to be around for much longer.
Well said sir .
TFC
The bottom line is, unless Safair gets some serious investors to back them and soon, this company is not going to be around for much longer.
Well said sir .
TFC