To Contract or not to Contract
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To Contract or not to Contract
Gentlemen, I have been offered the opportunity to go on contract in North Africa on a Caravan. As a young 750hr instructor looking to move on, is this the step forward as I see it as or not. Advice, particularly from the guys who started off in contract would be appreciated. Thanx in adavnce.
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Is it with a reputable company? Will you be trained properly, and will they do the required prof/recurrency checks? Is the salary acceptable? Would you have to pay for your rating, or would you be bonded? Do they operate other, larger types (ie is there scope for advancement?) And if so, is there a believable timetable for this? What would the work entail? Do you think you would handle/enjoy the contract lifestyle? (This can be a real problem if you have a long term partner/spouse) Could you get some comments from guys who work for the company already?
Those are just a few of the questions I would have to ask myself or the company concerned before venturing forth....it depends how keen you are for a change. For me, I was lucky enough to go onto a multi turbine on my first contract job. A 'Van is a great aircraft, but it doesn't exactly pad the CV in a big way. Still, it's certainly a step along the road.
Those are just a few of the questions I would have to ask myself or the company concerned before venturing forth....it depends how keen you are for a change. For me, I was lucky enough to go onto a multi turbine on my first contract job. A 'Van is a great aircraft, but it doesn't exactly pad the CV in a big way. Still, it's certainly a step along the road.
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What Shrike said. You also need to ask yourself how much more day VFR your CV can stand before it begins to look a little thin.
May I suggest that you set yourself a timetable of a year or two before moving on to airlines or charter if you can manage to do that. This would help you avoid getting stuck in the contract rut and being regarded as just another contract cowboy for the operators to shaft.
My advice would be that once in, get out of contracts as fast as you can...
May I suggest that you set yourself a timetable of a year or two before moving on to airlines or charter if you can manage to do that. This would help you avoid getting stuck in the contract rut and being regarded as just another contract cowboy for the operators to shaft.
My advice would be that once in, get out of contracts as fast as you can...
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Contract work should be used as a stepping stone to better things. The most important thing as far as I'm concerned is what is the progression like at the company meaning do they operate multi-turbine aircraft and how quickly do guys move through the ranks. As mentioned you don't want to get too much van time especially as it will be right hand seat to start with.
Did contract up in Loki for a little over 2years, had a awesome time, did some fantastic flying on an absolutly incredible machine (DHC-5, Buffalo). I'd recommend contract to anyone but not for any lenght of time. However, you're away from home A LOT so your home/social life is going to take flak. Know guys (young guys) who've been doing contract for +5years and that to me just shows a lack of incentive to move on as contract depending where you are is very easy.
Good luck
Did contract up in Loki for a little over 2years, had a awesome time, did some fantastic flying on an absolutly incredible machine (DHC-5, Buffalo). I'd recommend contract to anyone but not for any lenght of time. However, you're away from home A LOT so your home/social life is going to take flak. Know guys (young guys) who've been doing contract for +5years and that to me just shows a lack of incentive to move on as contract depending where you are is very easy.
Good luck
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As these guys are saying - the second you start contract work is the second you need to start scheming on how to get out of it and onto your next stable job. It's ridiculously easy to watch years of your life disappear there.
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The Van is a great machine, especially for the operator. But on your CV it's only worth 500 hours, and that is if it is your first Turbine. After that your just wasting your time, you need twin and Multi crew to move on.
She is a lovely machine, simple and easy to fly. But therein lies the problem. Spend too much time on oneand you forget how to fly a real plane. She's made to be flown buy guys with only 400 hours or less. She is easier that a 206 that is for sure.
If there is a chance for advancement onto a bigger plane withing the company within a year I'd go for it. But if you going co-jo, I'd say forget it.
She is a lovely machine, simple and easy to fly. But therein lies the problem. Spend too much time on oneand you forget how to fly a real plane. She's made to be flown buy guys with only 400 hours or less. She is easier that a 206 that is for sure.
If there is a chance for advancement onto a bigger plane withing the company within a year I'd go for it. But if you going co-jo, I'd say forget it.
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Thanx, for the advice. I'm quite sure that I wouldn't want to spend more than a year in contracts (definetely less than that on a Van) and I'm well aware that spending too much time in one aspect can be detrimental. So I'm asking should I continue doing flight instruction for another year (I have about 500 hours of instruction time) or look at going on the contract.
However is it true that once one has a couple of hundred contract/turbine hours and one is willing to get a rating on the old stalwart - the Kingair, that other opportunities are bound to open up? I'm at a crossroads and not sure which yellow brick road to take.
However is it true that once one has a couple of hundred contract/turbine hours and one is willing to get a rating on the old stalwart - the Kingair, that other opportunities are bound to open up? I'm at a crossroads and not sure which yellow brick road to take.
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hey
My ten cents worth...Go for it; I spent two years as an instructor and whilst everyone else seemed to be moving onto bigger things the best thing that fell into my lap at the time, was a C210 job in Central Africa. Then I stayed on a van for many moons , but it proved invaluable later down the line. At the time it seemed a pain but it certainly will make you more contacts than were your sitting at present. So if its co pilot or boy pilot (heaven forbid
) on a C208 (!) just take every flying opportunity with both hands and worry about the detail later!
DD
) on a C208 (!) just take every flying opportunity with both hands and worry about the detail later!DD
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I agree with DD, You have 750 hrs, to get any shot at any airline you need 2500+hrs Go and make a start on the Van and see where it leads, if you think you are going to spend less than a year on contracts or at least on the Van you might be dissappointed. There are alot of 1900 P1's who have 3500hrs plus who have spent 4+ years on contracts. The truth of the matter is, that this is the best way to prep yourself for later jobs, get 2000hrs of instruction time and you will be way behind the drag curve. Going on contract will also show you how little you actually know about flying outside the comfort zone.
Pack your bags and head off, as many have done before you, and many more will do after you.
Good luck
Pack your bags and head off, as many have done before you, and many more will do after you.
Good luck
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Been doing contracts for over ten years now and solidly stuck in that rut. Trying desperately to get a real job but it appears the only offers I get are to go on contract again and again. Not a nibble from airlines. The only way out seems to be to get out early or to get onto one of the glamour machines like a B200 or 1900 and move on from there. Avoid the workhorses at all costs if you can.
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I would have to say that you gotta
grab this opportunity with open arms!
In SA you basically have got to do some contract
work in your career before advancement. Its like
the proverbial next step on the ladder.
There are many pro's and con's but I would have to say that
the pro's outweigh the cons for somebody with
your sort of experience. You can always keep your instruction
current when you are home for your standard 1 month off.
As previous posters have mentioned that you will learn a hell of a
lot and the learning curve is steep as compared to your
basic circuit training. Not only do you learn alot about
the poling, but alot about yourself and the world around you.
If it was my choice flying circuits and doing contract well it's
a no brainer! Get out of your comfort zone
and go and challenge yourself. It will take some adjustment
but you should get used to your new life. Not everybody copes
with contract work and it is tough but the rewards are great!
You can't learn that flying anywhere else, and the experience
you gain will be kept with you for life!
But words of caution. PM a few of the guys here like SRT or
B200DRVR or IR PIRATE or me or talk to any pilot who has done
contracts before and reveal the identity of this
operator so we can help you decide if this is a shady operator
or not. There are a few out there who will eat you alive.
So good background info is a must, you cant go to North Africa
blindly.
SRT,B200DRVR,IR PIRATE hope you dont mind me mentioning your
names, this guy could use some of your experience
grab this opportunity with open arms!
In SA you basically have got to do some contract
work in your career before advancement. Its like
the proverbial next step on the ladder.
There are many pro's and con's but I would have to say that
the pro's outweigh the cons for somebody with
your sort of experience. You can always keep your instruction
current when you are home for your standard 1 month off.
As previous posters have mentioned that you will learn a hell of a
lot and the learning curve is steep as compared to your
basic circuit training. Not only do you learn alot about
the poling, but alot about yourself and the world around you.
If it was my choice flying circuits and doing contract well it's
a no brainer! Get out of your comfort zone
and go and challenge yourself. It will take some adjustment
but you should get used to your new life. Not everybody copes
with contract work and it is tough but the rewards are great!
You can't learn that flying anywhere else, and the experience
you gain will be kept with you for life!
But words of caution. PM a few of the guys here like SRT or
B200DRVR or IR PIRATE or me or talk to any pilot who has done
contracts before and reveal the identity of this
operator so we can help you decide if this is a shady operator
or not. There are a few out there who will eat you alive.
So good background info is a must, you cant go to North Africa
blindly.
SRT,B200DRVR,IR PIRATE hope you dont mind me mentioning your
names, this guy could use some of your experience
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Flyer14
By now I hope you have the info you require and can make an informed decision. Listen to SRT. He knows of what he speaks.
One other small piece of advice, for what it's worth. If you don't already have your ATP subjects, use the time in the bush to study. It is not always easy. ( Too many nurses to chase in Loki, too much beer to drink elsewhere), but it can be done and you will be ready to move on much sooner. I saw plenty guys sit for years and then later bemoan their luck when they could not move on.
Good and enjoy
By now I hope you have the info you require and can make an informed decision. Listen to SRT. He knows of what he speaks.
One other small piece of advice, for what it's worth. If you don't already have your ATP subjects, use the time in the bush to study. It is not always easy. ( Too many nurses to chase in Loki, too much beer to drink elsewhere), but it can be done and you will be ready to move on much sooner. I saw plenty guys sit for years and then later bemoan their luck when they could not move on.
Good and enjoy
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ditto....
After 10 years contracting, I am still saying this a temporary thing that I am going to do while I am waiting for a nice stable job. So call me a procrastenator, but I loved what I was doing. So SRT you arent the only one. I have progressed from a B200 to a 1900 to a jet. So I have the hours the types the engines and still no stable job.
Those go to guys whose farthers are there already.....
This year I took a break, after 5500hrs. I took a breather, and tried my hand at charter. I found lots of willing takers, and I also found out where lots of these place with funny names are in the country of my birth, where rich people go to get away from it all! I am sure some of these place I have been to but I am sure the dindnt have exotic sounding names then.
I also found out, that all those nice stable jobs are snatched up by guys all my junior, just because they were there. And because people knew them.
I am a firm believer in the flying/life experience contract work will give you, and of course something no one seemed to mention, the MOOOOLAH! At times the money is disgustingly low, and at times the exchange rate makes you feel like the lotto winner, wanting to hide from friend and foe to avoid saying no. But here is a bit of advice. If you see this as a stepping stone do that! Dont use the money that you get to buy a bloody house for R1.something million in Woodhill or Stonemansion or one of those places with counritish sounding names that is in actual fact a horizontal apartment block, dont buy a bloody Volvo get a wife and 3and a half kids. Use the money to do just what this period of your life is for. Furthering your career. If that means you have to go and buy yourself an ATR rating,with that money DO IT.
On your time off. Dont go and holiday in Monaco for a month. Go and try to do some charters, flash your grin at the charter queens. Remember your aim is to get in.
A dear friend in a tight spot told me a month ago. Your whole aim of your career must be to get to the point where you earn the most money as possible. Then you can fly what and where you want. I differ a bit from him but in a nut shell its true. Taking into account your personality, marks the different way you are going to walk that road. You do it your way, but that is the aim. As I said before I like to like what I am doing, I like watching sunsets, I like flying planes, and I like getting paid for it.
Now comes the flipside. My ex-wife and all my ex-girlfriends didnt like what I was doing, they liked the money part but that is where it stopped. They never do. You cannot expect her too. Its wrong.If she like you going on contract, just tighten the purse strings and you will see some fellow popping out the woodwork, that kept her back warm, while you were away.
All the contract operators will make you believe that flying for their company is a privelage and "a Career". Bool****e! It make it easier for them to hook you and hold you.
To cut a long story short. Contracting is a career stepping stone, and not a healty way of life. Because of its fickleness and fluid nature, get in get out, get a life.
[Mr. Moderator. if I get any hate mail from the operators now can I forward it to you so we can post it?]
Remember old contract pilots dont die, they just get a new set of wings and go fly for somewhere else.....
PS. 40yr old orphan with ATP flying Licence,looking for a father to adopt him, preferable a senior captain/or Training Captain with one of the Local airlines. He solemly swear to buy expensive presents on Fathersday, Christmas, and Birthday. He is prepared to throw in a case of good expensive pinotage and and a abottle of scoth per month. All interested parties with a sense of humour, forward email adresses so he can email his CV.......all offers will be considered, however the first secure offer of employment, will secure the adoption...
Those go to guys whose farthers are there already.....
This year I took a break, after 5500hrs. I took a breather, and tried my hand at charter. I found lots of willing takers, and I also found out where lots of these place with funny names are in the country of my birth, where rich people go to get away from it all! I am sure some of these place I have been to but I am sure the dindnt have exotic sounding names then.
I also found out, that all those nice stable jobs are snatched up by guys all my junior, just because they were there. And because people knew them.
I am a firm believer in the flying/life experience contract work will give you, and of course something no one seemed to mention, the MOOOOLAH! At times the money is disgustingly low, and at times the exchange rate makes you feel like the lotto winner, wanting to hide from friend and foe to avoid saying no. But here is a bit of advice. If you see this as a stepping stone do that! Dont use the money that you get to buy a bloody house for R1.something million in Woodhill or Stonemansion or one of those places with counritish sounding names that is in actual fact a horizontal apartment block, dont buy a bloody Volvo get a wife and 3and a half kids. Use the money to do just what this period of your life is for. Furthering your career. If that means you have to go and buy yourself an ATR rating,with that money DO IT.
On your time off. Dont go and holiday in Monaco for a month. Go and try to do some charters, flash your grin at the charter queens. Remember your aim is to get in.
A dear friend in a tight spot told me a month ago. Your whole aim of your career must be to get to the point where you earn the most money as possible. Then you can fly what and where you want. I differ a bit from him but in a nut shell its true. Taking into account your personality, marks the different way you are going to walk that road. You do it your way, but that is the aim. As I said before I like to like what I am doing, I like watching sunsets, I like flying planes, and I like getting paid for it.
Now comes the flipside. My ex-wife and all my ex-girlfriends didnt like what I was doing, they liked the money part but that is where it stopped. They never do. You cannot expect her too. Its wrong.If she like you going on contract, just tighten the purse strings and you will see some fellow popping out the woodwork, that kept her back warm, while you were away.
All the contract operators will make you believe that flying for their company is a privelage and "a Career". Bool****e! It make it easier for them to hook you and hold you.
To cut a long story short. Contracting is a career stepping stone, and not a healty way of life. Because of its fickleness and fluid nature, get in get out, get a life.
[Mr. Moderator. if I get any hate mail from the operators now can I forward it to you so we can post it?]
Remember old contract pilots dont die, they just get a new set of wings and go fly for somewhere else.....
PS. 40yr old orphan with ATP flying Licence,looking for a father to adopt him, preferable a senior captain/or Training Captain with one of the Local airlines. He solemly swear to buy expensive presents on Fathersday, Christmas, and Birthday. He is prepared to throw in a case of good expensive pinotage and and a abottle of scoth per month. All interested parties with a sense of humour, forward email adresses so he can email his CV.......all offers will be considered, however the first secure offer of employment, will secure the adoption...
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Go for it!
I am as the name sugests, a contract pilot for the long haul. I love the type of flying and the people you meet. It is a far less pretentious crowd of people than you tend to get in other aviation circles and the money is great. From a flying aspect, I dont think you should start putting time limits on an a/c, if you enjoy flying the maschine, then stay on it till you get bored, be that 200hrs or 2000hrs, the "value" of those hrs are for you to decide, I have met many happy pilots who have over 6/7000 hrs on one type of "contract" maschine and they love every minute of it. all about your attitude to it. If you come up here with an idea that you need to escape as soon as you can, you wont enjoy contract too much and will miss out on a hell of a lot. as far as "contract pilots have no incentive" goes, stick that, I started contract with the same intensions as you, get 500 hrs on a van and go fly 747's. funny thing is i fell in love with this type of work and dont want to leave. I have many mates who have moved onto airlines, many hated it and came back to contract, some are still flying the "big stuff" and want to come back but cant due training bonds. If you find a job you enjoy, take it. It seems to be a select few who love their job and as far as i am concerned, that is what you should be striving for, not some illusion that the grass is greener. best of luck on the new job and hope to have a beer with you up here some time!
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Moving on
Well said CD,
The trick is to know when to move on. and where to go. You say you are looking for a stable job near to home. Why not try any number of airlines outside SA. After all, you are not wotking there now anyway! I also did about ten years contract work and then had to move on. (The family issue reared it's head.) I joined an airline out side SA and never looked back.
Cheers
The trick is to know when to move on. and where to go. You say you are looking for a stable job near to home. Why not try any number of airlines outside SA. After all, you are not wotking there now anyway! I also did about ten years contract work and then had to move on. (The family issue reared it's head.) I joined an airline out side SA and never looked back.
Cheers
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...with ATP flying Licence,looking for a father to adopt him, preferable a senior captain/or Training Captain with one of the Local airlines. He solemly swear to buy expensive presents on Fathersday, Christmas, and Birthday. He is prepared to throw in a case of good expensive pinotage and and a abottle of scoth per month. All interested parties with a sense of humour, forward email adresses so he can email his CV.......all offers will be considered, however the first secure offer of employment, will secure the adoption...
Wonder if there's an ou toppie airline captain looking for a set of ugly twins?
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Let's Go!
Well, I've had a long hard think, looked at all the advice especially what was sent in the PM's and think I should get off my arse bite the bullet and go ahead. I think I've had enough Captaincy on a C-150! Sir Osis of the River, thanks for the ATP advice, however I've already passed them. It may break me or make me but either way I think I'll be better off for the experience. This can only lead to better things judging by what some of the guys have said. Thanks alot to everyone who posted and PMed. It's much appreciated and helped me come to what I think is the right move at this stage of my flying! Thanks guys! Good luck and FLY SAFE!