No Job For Outsider
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When the field is levelled, then moan!!!
Mr Riccardo, I believe you are missing the major point here my friend. What you first have to realise, is that in the current state of the market, we are basically dogs, fighting over the little scraps of jobs that the operators toss our way. If you dont like the imagery, then you gotta go out and strengthen your mind, because those are the facts. Having a pilot's licence makes you no more special than other member of society, and does not guarantee any sort of preferential treatment. When the market is oversaturated, you have to accept that things are not going to be easy, and one often has to make do with the smaller, less glamorous jobs.....IF you can find them. Otherwise, mortgage your house, buy yourself a widebody rating, and then stop moaning. Or grow up, and work your way up through the system. Those of us without the financial means to buy ourselves out of this depression, just have to be patient. Remember... every DOG has his day.
Secondly, nobody specifically denies you a job due to your nationality. The operators are trying to look after some of their local assets too, which I can promise you, does a lot for their image in the eyes of the South African crew members who get given a chance, rather than see the job go to a national of another country. Only when the playing field is levelled, by making it as easy for South African guys to get validations and work permits in the US or Europe, will you have right to complain about not being given a job in SA. Give us third world pilots the chance we deserve in our own country. With your European licence the world is your oyster. Most of us cant afford the licence, and anyway dont have the right to live and work in Europe or the US, so the local operators are the bread which we survive off. Dont complain about those that look after our interests, its just plain selfish.
Secondly, nobody specifically denies you a job due to your nationality. The operators are trying to look after some of their local assets too, which I can promise you, does a lot for their image in the eyes of the South African crew members who get given a chance, rather than see the job go to a national of another country. Only when the playing field is levelled, by making it as easy for South African guys to get validations and work permits in the US or Europe, will you have right to complain about not being given a job in SA. Give us third world pilots the chance we deserve in our own country. With your European licence the world is your oyster. Most of us cant afford the licence, and anyway dont have the right to live and work in Europe or the US, so the local operators are the bread which we survive off. Dont complain about those that look after our interests, its just plain selfish.
(Russian Gynegology)
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Haven't you fellows ever paid any thought that life could be much better if you stop fighting and protecting your scrappy jobs? I can guarantee that if you stop fighting to fly for nothing in those third class jobs and stop back stabbing each others things can only get better.
There is always a market for well runned aviation business with modern airplanes as well as there is a market for scrap like what you try to protect. Do you really like to be part of such in a long term? Just grow up and either have a job as a professional pilot or do something else. Don't live your life like a scavenger and try to convince yourself that this is aviation !
There is always a market for well runned aviation business with modern airplanes as well as there is a market for scrap like what you try to protect. Do you really like to be part of such in a long term? Just grow up and either have a job as a professional pilot or do something else. Don't live your life like a scavenger and try to convince yourself that this is aviation !
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Not Professional Eh??
So let me just get one thing straight. Please explain what a PROFESSIONAL pilot is....Im betting youre meaning an airline box office jockey. In the line of work we do, you die if you're not professional, so the mere fact that Im alive must mean something. Remember that not all pilots need to be in Airlines. There is other, much more interesting flying out there, and yes, if you have to scavenge at it, then so be it, it doesnt bother me...Im am a fully fledged contract slut!!! And a professional one to boot.....
(Russian Gynegology)
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IR PIRATE,
Looks like you are happy what you do, that's good. Try to stay alive and enjoy the bits what others may throw for you.
So who is a professional pilot? I may not be a right person to answer as I newer flew any major airline but I would think that someone who is not scaring paying passengers away...? I did my time in Africa, 6 years. I also flew in USA as well in Europe, now based in Asia. I must admit that I also flew for South African operator on bizjet. Still flying on large bizjets and enjoyning my life. I must say that I do not miss those poorly paid unsecure Twin Otter/Beech jobs very much.
Have fun
Looks like you are happy what you do, that's good. Try to stay alive and enjoy the bits what others may throw for you.
So who is a professional pilot? I may not be a right person to answer as I newer flew any major airline but I would think that someone who is not scaring paying passengers away...? I did my time in Africa, 6 years. I also flew in USA as well in Europe, now based in Asia. I must admit that I also flew for South African operator on bizjet. Still flying on large bizjets and enjoyning my life. I must say that I do not miss those poorly paid unsecure Twin Otter/Beech jobs very much.
Have fun
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See, the biggest problem in SA at the moment, is that there is no movement, from turbines onto jets. For someone who doesnt really have much enthusiasm for Airline type work, that leaves very few options, other than contract work. I was in Corporate flying for a few years, which I loved so much, however, when a company starts to battle....the flight department is usually the first casualty, this can happen to anyone.... Now if there was some sort of feeder movement onto light jets, things would be very different. Trust me, I hate the system as it stands right now, however, I am making the most of what I can get right now, and that is my point. Jobs arent there for the picking any more, so by collecting the scraps, you are ending up with a solid meal. BTW: the contract companies these days, are at least stable, and the pay is not that bad, if you consider that it is such a flooded market. When the crop is bountiful, the price is low..... Scarce things cost the most money.....we are not scarce.....
(Russian Gynegology)
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I understand what you are saying. However, as I said earlier, as long as there are folks willing to work for "free" and to cut each others throats someone will use that situation. There in SA is a very busy and professional outfit operating large bizjets worldwide. Majority of their crews are from outside South Africa, why? I hope that the reason is not because all local heroes are too busy fighting between them selves....
Have fun!
Have fun!
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Give me a jet...for free
I would hazard a guess that they are not South African crew, because they require jet hours to get onto their shiny jets, and there is nowhere for the average South African pilot to build those hours, so for new pilots they need to look outside, and that basically summises what I am so sad about. This is also why so many people will work for peanuts, because if they did not, they would never get ANY experience, whatsoever, so how does one break this vicious cycle?? Put yourself in the shoes of a pilot that has for example 5000hrs TT, with 4000 on turbines, but the companies want 500 or so hours on jets (if youre lucky). He would fly a jet almost for free, in the dodgiest outfit, so as to make himself employable by a better, more " professional " outfit, thats just the way the industry had manipulated most younger pilots into prostitution. Where is the light??
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Pilots
I can see that still there are pilots that will step down others because they want appear to the face of the operator great .Are you one of them I.R.PIRATE ?Do you think that one operator look at you and say "great you are"you dont even care at those of your same nationality ,if some one would offer a job on the B747 you stab on the back even another pilot from your country.Personally I do not want to grow up if that means to be like you.You are just showing how good you are to try to step down others.Big mistake buddy.Not with me .You and pilots like you have to stop to run the market any where in the world.If the market is not douing good is not because of no market but because people tht run the business are not professional.I know many operator that have manager or president that do not even know why an airplane fly, but still they will tell to a pilot that he do not know how to fly.If you feel to be a dog it si your problem .
I am a pilot a professional pilot and I am proud of it .Yes I am special because I am a pilot , because I live like a pilot among others pilotand not among doggy.
Sincerly
Riccardo Volante
I am a pilot a professional pilot and I am proud of it .Yes I am special because I am a pilot , because I live like a pilot among others pilotand not among doggy.
Sincerly
Riccardo Volante
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No Riccardo, you got this whole picture skewed, because you are reacting bitterly to being rejected. I have no need to defend myself and my ways, as you know absolutely less than zero about me. Do not be trapped into ignorant thinking, and blinded by what you think you mean to the world as a pilot. It will tire you out eventually, because running around all day telling the world you are special, will destroy you. I dont think there is anything wrong with being thankful that I have a salary at the end of every month, to support my family and I. Yes there might be some doggy style, but we like it that way. Now stop crying!!
"Love flying for the right reasons, and you will love it for life....love flying for the wrong reasons, and it will destroy you."
"Love flying for the right reasons, and you will love it for life....love flying for the wrong reasons, and it will destroy you."
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You will tire me?
You will tire me ? I do not know zero about you?Yes definaly you are you belive to be.You are bitter with the rest of the world just because you have been unable to get job in Europe or USA.That is you problem.You want to fly jets but you canot because in your country with racial problem you can get one and you think that is a problem caused by the Europe and USA .Wake up buddy if that happen is due to the politics of you country do not blame others such I do not blame others country for the problem that I have in my country.I guess you got to stop to step down others.If you want to be a dog pilot it is you problem.I don know what kind of exmple you are for is around your self.And another think me tire me show me what you can do.I remand yopu that yopu too do not know anything about me.And now if you do not like what I do write stop to look at my post .You are not in title to say nothing.
Sincerely
Riccardo Volante
Sincerely
Riccardo Volante
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Dry your tears
Please wipe the tears out of your eyes when youre busy typing with your one finger, cause clearly you cant see what you're doing.
Or go play with your model aeroplanes, and wait for puberty, are you six years old??
Or go play with your model aeroplanes, and wait for puberty, are you six years old??
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"You are bitter with the rest of the world just because you have been unable to get job in Europe or USA"
What the....
You're the one that started the thread whinging that the world was against you because you couldn't get a job.
What do you know about SA politics you bigot.
Go play in traffic pal.
What the....
You're the one that started the thread whinging that the world was against you because you couldn't get a job.
What do you know about SA politics you bigot.
Go play in traffic pal.
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Riccardo
You are correct in the fact that there are a lot of pilots from SA in the US and in Europe. now you can only live and work in Europe if you have a right of abode , which means that you have to have a EU passport. Now a lot of South Africans do have Eu passports, which allows them to work in Europe.
The Us is a different story you can get a permit to study or to do some work, but try and find out what you need to do to gwt in to an airline, and you will find the same thing...US work for US citizens.
The Us is a different story you can get a permit to study or to do some work, but try and find out what you need to do to gwt in to an airline, and you will find the same thing...US work for US citizens.
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Aisch
Same s*it different day. Not WHAT you know..... it is WHO you know in the industry.
Lots of low time guys picking up the juicy bits.(connections) 10000 hrs n twenty yrs in the industry ..accident free...tonnes of experience....good machines on licence....still have to stand in the queue. Just the way it is.
Still wondering why
Lots of low time guys picking up the juicy bits.(connections) 10000 hrs n twenty yrs in the industry ..accident free...tonnes of experience....good machines on licence....still have to stand in the queue. Just the way it is.
Still wondering why
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I.R. PIRATE and WOOF, totally agree with you.
As for Ricky Ricardo.....our Italian pilot, perhaps the company saw a few spelling mistakes on his CV and realised they would have to invest too much cash to get your english on par(along with the validations etc).Why can't you get work in all those European countries???
Leave the limited African contract market for our previously advantaged, or if you are a African wannabe- Indiana Jones hats for sale at Walmart $5.99
As for Ricky Ricardo.....our Italian pilot, perhaps the company saw a few spelling mistakes on his CV and realised they would have to invest too much cash to get your english on par(along with the validations etc).Why can't you get work in all those European countries???
Leave the limited African contract market for our previously advantaged, or if you are a African wannabe- Indiana Jones hats for sale at Walmart $5.99
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Problem Solved
Riccardo, I have spoken to the company in question, and asked as to why you didnt get the job....
They said if you had just let your mother type your application letter, you might have stood a chance, however, you felt grown up enough to do it yourself. I admire that, but next time dont shout at all south africans just cause you wanted to type your own letter. Trust me, Mother does it much better....
They said if you had just let your mother type your application letter, you might have stood a chance, however, you felt grown up enough to do it yourself. I admire that, but next time dont shout at all south africans just cause you wanted to type your own letter. Trust me, Mother does it much better....
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Ricardo
ET is a proudly South African company and if they don't feel the need to employ foreign pilots, no one has the right to tell them otherwise. I am proud of a company that is willing to support the South African aviation industry. Why should you get a job in South Africa, working for a South African company, flying a South African aircraft, when their is alot of South African who is 100% able and qualified to do it???
ET is a proudly South African company and if they don't feel the need to employ foreign pilots, no one has the right to tell them otherwise. I am proud of a company that is willing to support the South African aviation industry. Why should you get a job in South Africa, working for a South African company, flying a South African aircraft, when their is alot of South African who is 100% able and qualified to do it???
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Brainless Yap
Riccardovolante
Dont flatter yourself Mate!
After taking one good look at you, ET probably fed you some bu11sh1t line a-propos to not employing foreigners, as quite obviously it was a ploy to surreptitiously bin your unsightly ass.
They realized you had an aptitude equivalent to a Dog - no wonder you continuously and reverently refer to our most trusted mutts - and so they showed you the door.
What did you expect when you wrote this particular thread? Could it be that you anticipated our deep regret; that we would severely reprimand the respective Company, then give you a pet on the back and send you on your merry way? Go Figure!??
It is confusing why the futile 'irrelevant racism' card always pops it's ugly head into any decent discussion? Possibly since all other avenue's have been exhausted and constructive criticism becomes less obtainable. The "Proverbial Cliche".
It's abundantly clear that you have no other point to make. Consequentially, succumbing to the usual and inevitable dredged up garbage is predictable, yet again.
Go and cry somewhere else - another forum perhaps - as clearly, you cannot hack the rejection so aptly articulated by pilots in this country who are proud of what they do.
We can go on busting you up all day pal. Let's not embarrass you any further. Do us all a favour; put you tail between your legs and beat it!!
Dont flatter yourself Mate!
After taking one good look at you, ET probably fed you some bu11sh1t line a-propos to not employing foreigners, as quite obviously it was a ploy to surreptitiously bin your unsightly ass.
They realized you had an aptitude equivalent to a Dog - no wonder you continuously and reverently refer to our most trusted mutts - and so they showed you the door.
What did you expect when you wrote this particular thread? Could it be that you anticipated our deep regret; that we would severely reprimand the respective Company, then give you a pet on the back and send you on your merry way? Go Figure!??
It is confusing why the futile 'irrelevant racism' card always pops it's ugly head into any decent discussion? Possibly since all other avenue's have been exhausted and constructive criticism becomes less obtainable. The "Proverbial Cliche".
It's abundantly clear that you have no other point to make. Consequentially, succumbing to the usual and inevitable dredged up garbage is predictable, yet again.
Go and cry somewhere else - another forum perhaps - as clearly, you cannot hack the rejection so aptly articulated by pilots in this country who are proud of what they do.
We can go on busting you up all day pal. Let's not embarrass you any further. Do us all a favour; put you tail between your legs and beat it!!