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African Aviation Regional issues that affect the numerous pilots who work in this area of the world.

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Old 5th Apr 2005, 05:54   #1 (permalink)
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Cool "Loslyf" (similar 2 Hustler) reader thrown of SA Airline

Worst is - I know the ******- he is quite well known in our area (I will not reveal for what reasons though )

Jaco Nel

Cape Town - An irate businessman was chucked off a Nationwide Airlines flight at the Easter weekend when he allegedly kicked up a fuss because flight crew would not allow him to read Loslyf magazine on the aircraft.

"Nowhere on my ticket does it say that this magazine may not be read on the aircraft," said Capetonian AC Hoffman on Monday.

"And, I held the magazine in such a way that not even the woman in the seat next to mine could see what I was reading."

Hoffman and his partner, Tim Els, were en route from Johannesburg to Cape Town on business.

They are developers working in the tobacco industry and travel between the two cities once a week.

Els said: "AC always buys Loslyf."

According to Hoffman, this time around, he accidentally dropped the magazine while they were boarding the flight.

"The air hostess saw me dropping the magazine, and when I was unwrapping it in my seat, she came over to tell me to put it away," said Hoffman.

Snatched the magazine

"At first, I refused, but then she went and told the captain who broadcast her request via the intercom so that everyone could hear."

According to Hoffman, the air hostess then snatched the magazine and took it to the front.

"She came back and threw the magazine down in my lap. That's when I told her she was ****** rude," said Hoffman.

"She obviously does not know the difference between ******' and **** you, because she claimed I was swearing at her."

The aircraft was already moving and turned back from the runway towards the airport building where Hoffman was unloaded.

He had to make a statement to the police.

"This will not be the end of the matter," he said.

"My hand luggage has not even been returned yet," he said.

According to Vernon Bricknell, the airline's chief executive, his personnel complained about Hoffman's alleged "offensive" behaviour.

"Our policy contains no stipulations on pornography, but we simply do not allow that kind of stuff on our flights," he said.

On sale at airports

"It is not acceptable. If you want to look at it, go and do so in the toilet, but not there in front of everyone. There are children around."

Eugene Goddard, editor of Loslyf, said on Monday: "The only CNAs still selling the publication are those at airports.

"It is strange," he said. "Why do you sell something at airports if people are not allowed to read it on flights?"

Recently, Goddard and Loslyf were in trouble for allegedly offensive material about Amor Vittone (now suing Loslyf for R1m) and singer Juanita du Plessis.

Goddard was unable to provide an update on how the cases were progressing.

Edited by Iaine Harper
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Old 5th Apr 2005, 19:26   #2 (permalink)
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Lightbulb The man is getting famous ..

a second photo of him ..

A disgruntled passenger, taken off a Nationwide flight for allegedly threatening a stewardess who asked him not to read a pornographic magazine, on Tuesday said he was considering legal action against the airline.

AC Hoffmann said: "I'm seeing my lawyer later today."

He did not want to comment further about what happened.

According to media reports he was taken off a scheduled flight that was about to leave Johannesburg International Airport for Cape Town during the Easter weekend.

'Asked to desist reading porn'

Nationwide Airlines said on Tuesday that Hoffmann was asked to desist from reading a pornographic magazine, which he had with him, on the airplane.

Roger Whittle of the airline said other passengers had complained about Hoffmann reading the magazine.

In response to this, a stewardess approached Hoffmann and asked him to put the magazine away.

Whittle said: "He became abusive and threatened the cabin crew, using inappropriate language."

He said it was not so much the fact that Hoffmann had been reading the magazine that caused the airplane's captain to delay the flight and set him off, it was his "threatening behaviour".

"His behaviour was considered a threat to a safe flight and that is why the captain decided to set him off the plane."

'Airline can't have policy on everything'

Whittle said threatening behaviour on an airplane was an offence under civil aviation legislation.

Asked whether the airline had a policy regarding suitable reading material, Whittle said: "We can't have policy on everything. At some point common sense kicks in."

He added that the airline had received several e-mails thanking them for their action against Hoffmann.

"If he (Hoffmann) had said that he really wanted to read the magazine and was there somewhere more private he could, we probably would have accommodated him. But he went mad."

The SA Film and Publication Board said adult magazines containing sexual material had to be sold in sealed envelopes, but there were no restrictions on where they could be read.

Edited by Andiswa Mesatywe
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Old 5th Apr 2005, 21:12   #3 (permalink)
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Well done to the Nationwide crew.

With the declining moral standards in this country, it is about time someone stood up and did it. It is disgusting that such a magazine should be flouted round the general public and that children can see it!

Sounds like said passenger is a real village idiot in any case. Well done to all concerned and if other passengers had requested it, why does he not respect their wishes?
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Old 5th Apr 2005, 21:19   #4 (permalink)
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It certainly looks like something that should have "Insert icepick here" tattoed on it's forehead.
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Old 5th Apr 2005, 21:55   #5 (permalink)
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Well done!!

I know the crew of that a/c and think it's only way to go!! Well donw boys, thats the only way to set a standard. No more gruy areas on our airlines!!

As Mr Vernon said, go do it in the bathroom!

Come on people, lets be respectible!!

I'm in full seport for the Nationwide crew!!!!!!!!!!!!

You go!!
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Old 5th Apr 2005, 23:08   #6 (permalink)
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if i sit on board and read 'mein kampf' am i going to be thrown off for offending a jewish person.

lets be sensible here, i think everyone has the right to read or as in this case, look at whatever magazine they choose, hence south africa is supposed to be a democracy and a 'free' country.

yes, pornography is not everyones cup of tea, but neither is the bold and the beautiful, so what do i do, change the channel.

if the guy sitting next to you is looking at a porn mag, turn away and carry on minding your own business!
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Old 6th Apr 2005, 07:18   #7 (permalink)
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I know the guy and I can tell you guys now it was not about the porn mag - it was his "language usage".

He has no fear of the dreaded F word.

The porn mag just fuelled the issue. It was a matter of time and comes as no surprise to anyone of us that knows him.

Well done Nationwide
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Old 6th Apr 2005, 14:03   #8 (permalink)
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Interesting comments here and not what I would have expected. I guess the "Blue Laws" are still in effect down under. You can carjack someone, steal millions from the company fund, but for Gods sake dont be reading dirty magazines.......
That puts things at about 50 years behind the rest of the world.
As long as he is doing it and in his space, its usually considered his right. If the Passenger next to him didnt like it..........DUH....dont look. As to the potty mouth... Not good as that is shared by all around.
Hostie probably took the magazine away and read it herself.........or who knows..may have been in one of the pictures.
In a place so out of control as SA, one would think that this should be the least of the worries... How many Hosties were hooked up for Prostitution on SAA???
Interesting for sure as to the different values we see around the world.......
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Old 7th Apr 2005, 13:09   #9 (permalink)
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So then B Sousa.....define ' In a place as out of control as SA' as you seem to be an egg-spurt !!!!

So what you are saying is that you would not of had a problem if your child was sitting next to this guy while he was reading porn ??????......sheesh liberated parenting indeed. (Goes for you to South Coast but then again seeing as your location is the UK your comments dont surprise me in the least.....)

Well I echo all the other posts...well done to the crew of Nationwide....and I know for a fact that the office has been flooded with e-mails in support of the crews actions
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Old 7th Apr 2005, 13:36   #10 (permalink)
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Yogi Bear.......
Do I really need to comment. You live in JNB.Take a walk across town some evening, see if you return.......Have you had a Burglary or know someone who has recently?? Did the COPs steal more than the Burglars or was it about even??
Lets not deviate. It WAS NOT a child sitting next to the guy and I do hope he would have shown a bit more Moxie than that, should it have been..
Some folks just like to see where they can get a rise, probably the guy in question.
I dont really consider Hosties qualified to determine what Im reading when half of them cant read anyway........Im sorry it must have been the pictures she recognized or related too.
Get out in the world a bit, it might scare you.

Last edited by B Sousa; 7th Apr 2005 at 13:50.
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Old 7th Apr 2005, 14:04   #11 (permalink)
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ROFLMAO.....no you dont need to comment at all...you pretty much answered my question for me...lol

I did not say it was a child sitting next to 'him' either I was just using it as an example....you may find porn acceptable where ever and when ever but there are times when discretion needs to be used and I think sitting in an aircraft with more than just a few folks around who would be able to see what the contents of the magazine are would be one of those times......yes I agree that SA has it's problems but none of the countries in the rest of the world are squeeky clean either....you learn to live with these things and plan accordingly.....just like folks in the UK learn to live with the fact that kids can beat up a teacher at school and when the teacher retaliates then the teacher goes down and not the little angles who beat the crap out of them in the first place.....and just like folks in the US learn to live with the fact that they are probably more racist than any other country around but still get up on thier little soap boxes and call the rest ofthe world for being racist.....

The point I am trying to make is that there is a time and a place for things and I dont think that reading porn on an aircraft where women and children are present is such a bright thing to do....
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Old 7th Apr 2005, 14:44   #12 (permalink)
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I think we are on the same sheet of music. Im just not as restrictive as some., and certainly dont pander as to what "the Chruch says" , so far I have no hair growing from my hands.
Discretion...he didnt use a lot, but again.(other than kids) adults can make up there own minds and quit reading over this J/O s shoulder.
How did Racist get into the equation,??
No question the world in total has problems, some just greater than others. Again nobody said this guy was the brightest candle on the cake......
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Old 7th Apr 2005, 16:01   #13 (permalink)
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Dont want to interrupt your little spat, but its been said that the main reason for the removal of the pax was his offensive behaviour and language. Damn right to throw him out. What would've happened if he had a few beers along the way and gotten even worse.....?

Use the F-word wisely is what can be learnt from this episode
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Old 7th Apr 2005, 16:51   #14 (permalink)
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Only in reference to the ruling elite, then?
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Old 7th Apr 2005, 17:14   #15 (permalink)
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Thumbs up Loslyf reader gets a kick in the nuts

Pilot didn't appreciate man's 'bad attitude'

By Estelle Ellis

It was not the pornography but the aggressive behaviour and the swearing that made the pilot of a Nationwide flight decide to put a passenger, barred from reading a Loslyf, off his plane.

"It was my decision. I had him put off the plane," Captain Patrick Gericke said on Wednesday.

Gericke said he would have failed in his goal to ensure the safety of his passengers if he allowed a passenger who displayed aggressive and unpredictable behaviour on a plane.

"He can say that he bought the Loslyf at the airport. It means nothing. I can buy a pack of cigarettes at the airport - that does not mean I can smoke 20 (or any) of them on the flight to Cape Town."

'He can say that he bought the Loslyf at the airport'
He said the passenger, AC Hoffman, had
boarded the plane, sat down and started reading the magazine.

"One of my flight attendants explained to him that we were a family airline and in a tight environment and asked him to put the magazine away. He refused. It is a Loslyf, for goodness sake. It is really graphic porn. It is not like Scope in the old days," Gericke said.

"She informed me that he refused to put the magazine away. I asked Hoffman to obey the crew member. I informed him that he would otherwise be put off the flight.

"At this stage he stood up, chucked the magazine at the flight attendant and said take your s**t and **** off."

It was at this point, Gericke explained, that the matter had shifted from uncomfortable to problematic. "Then I had to deal with aggressive behaviour towards a crew member. There were 111 other passengers on that plane. All they wanted to do is get to Cape Town."

He said he had then turned back to the parking bay and had Hoffman put off the plane.

"I don't know the man from a bar of soap, but the moment he swore at one of my crew members, that was it."

This article was originally published on page 7 of The Cape Argus on April 07, 2005

Published on the Web by IOL on 2005-04-07 10:27:00
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Old 7th Apr 2005, 18:39   #16 (permalink)
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thanks for realising i am from the uk yogi, quite the detective...

however, i have been living in jbg for the last 4 years and although i would not read a pornagraphic magazine onboard a plane, more out of embarressement than anything else, i would not have a problem with someone who felt comfortable enough to do so.

i agree that it is not proper, for want of a better word, to read such a magazine infront of a minor and i would hope that most, who would consider reading or looking at such material would have the politness to refrain while sitting next to children.

and, after reading the captains version of events, i agree completely with having the man removed, but not for reading the magazine, but for the agressive and abussive behaviour displayed towards a crew member, no problem with that at all.

i would also like to ask yogi, to explain his statement...

'Goes for you to South Coast but then again seeing as your location is the UK your comments dont surprise me in the least.....)'

was that supposed to mean we in the uk are not all christian fundamenatlists like some of you here, or maybe we are not quite as civilised as south africans, or maybe it was supposed to mean because you are SO civilised now, that you can decide properly for the masses what they should and should not read...almost sounds like a law from the past, but i forget what country that could have been a law in within the last 20 years...

i know a good quote, take out of it what you will...

only two things are infinite; the universe and mans' stupidity and i am not sure about the universe.
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Old 8th Apr 2005, 06:15   #17 (permalink)
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Forget all the nonsense about the right to read what you want, whether dirty mags are on sale at airports, whether the crew reacted correctly or not. To my mind, this all comes down to one simple thing.


Respect for your fellow passenger and respect for the airline that is carrying you, and its employees.

This guy clearly has no respect for anyone other than himself.

I daresay his mates consider him to be a real "oke", but I think "oaf" is more accurate.

No doubt he reads this magazine at home in front of his wife and daughters, and they don't (dare) complain.

What a man!
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Old 8th Apr 2005, 08:40   #18 (permalink)
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Danger Kick 'em off

Can't agree more with the nationwide crews actions. Good on them. The guy can read what he likes but hey dude get real. Like a few people have said already there are people who are just plain offended by that sort of mag. Have a little concideration. As for getting aggressive with the cabin crew well all I can say is thay need to give the guy the prize for being King Stupid. What a tw1t.

As for South Coast. You are from the UK but hey dude we all have our faults. Can't we all just get along?

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Old 8th Apr 2005, 10:23   #19 (permalink)
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I am somewhat torn here...freedom of expression or whatever and all that. But it's down to common decency.

But when I see some lovely gentleman on the tube reading the Daily Sport (obviously not as bad as what's in Loslyf) I do wonder about them as a person as others have already said.

They are developers working in the tobacco industry and travel between the two cities once a week.
Oh yes..... what does a 'developer working in the tobacco industry' do?

All I know is you grow it, dry it an smoke it


PS when I read Loslyf or the Daily Sport I read it in private
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Old 8th Apr 2005, 12:17   #20 (permalink)
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Hi there B Sousa....

I agree that we are playing from the same music sheet...lol....the 'Racist' thing was just an example....nothing intended nor implied......I agree with the crew and thier actions....and with the comments and statements made by all the good pruners here. South coast...sorry mate ..opened mouth before engaging brain......;-)

Just again all I am saying is there is a time and a place for these things and the other key word comming out of this is 'Respect'.....

Take care all
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