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Old 18th Jun 2017, 22:08
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Phantom Driver
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Singapore
Posts: 320
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From what has been said in these forums in the past, obtaining clearance from ATC to circumnavigate is not very easy in China - even for the locals! ATC is not as flexible as other parts of the world. Then, there's also the culture and saving face mentality of Captains, especially the ex military guys. I recall my ATC days when western carriers would avoid build ups whilst some Asian and Eastern European carriers simply ploughed through what must have been the tiniest of gaps!
Really ? From my recollection (before hanging up the old headset), getting Chinese ATC clearance to deviate around wx was not a major issue . Maybe in past days , but with the opening up of Chinese airspace , certainly not the headache it used to be . They could be more accommodating than some western controllers . LHR controllers told me off once for deviating back (after a cleared deviation) back towards airway track, about 5 miles away, passing Epsom, while maintaining 6000 ft cleared level . Lot of traffic on TCAS above and below , but nobody infringing the Dover departure. Lots of heavy purple stuff on the radar and equally nasty looking out of the window.

Reason for being told off ? I didn't request the deviation (back to track) . Reason for no request ? Unable to get a word in on the usual RT mayhem out of LHR , exacerbated by the wx complicating things.

Not blaming LHR departures ; they were stressed , as everyone else .

Re "ploughing through tiny gaps". It may look dicey on an ATC radar , but in the air , the opposite is often the case . Going into DFW one day , the controller was clearly quite nervous about our chosen course of action . But he was not seeing what we were seeing ; lots of blue sky in between the buildups , confirmed by the radar . (old saying- "one peep is worth a thousand sweeps") . Smooth ride through with nary a bump.

Then, there's also the culture and saving face mentality of Captains, especially the ex military guys.
I have to express my objection to that statement Haven't met many ex-military guys who would knowingly and willingly fly through a CB with a load of grannies, grandads, kids . moms etc etc riding down the back.

By error , maybe....
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