@ HighLow:
I agree, I have misread your comment, and I thought you were saying the mini legal is 500fpm, as a lot of pilots think it is...
Initial Descent to the Airport
you are certainly not making any friends with your fellow pilots dawdling at -100fpm, whilst others are commencing their initial descent to an airport, and there you are blocking ALL the levels, and creating headaches for the all concerned, pilots and controllers.
If my initial decent is given 50 NM away from my TOD, I do use 100 fpm, IF the ATC call me back to increase, I do, but most of the time they don't, they just want me to leave this level for a 1000 ft separation with an incoming traffic...
DO NOT create law or expectations that doesn't exist, if the ATC want you at a minimum ROD, he will tell you... so why not managing your descent?
and as mentioned by another poster:
a pilot requests descent, controller gives clearance
pilot descends, EASY
Agree, that doesn't mean with a mini given rate...
i
nstead of (what seems an increasing occurance of) whereby
a pilot requests descent, controller gives descent clearance
pilot waits another 20 miles before starting down....
(EM NO ! you are supposed to start down once you receive the clearance.
AND you guys and girls know who you are, so stop this ridiculous practice).
Agin, I agree!
DESCEND WHEN READY... in that case stay up there at your cruising level till the HOLD I don't care, but if a controller gives u a descent clearance, DESCEND !!
Again, I agree, i have never said the opposite, this is a rule!
Holding
@AirTaxiDriver, you mention "in other states, you are allowed to use 100ftm till the ATC ask you another rate for their separation." really? good luck with that one ! the controller will not be ASKING (as you put it) for another rate, he will be DEMANDING another rate (at least 1000fpm)
WRONG, as there is no such rule for minimum ROD (except US, Australia and UK (last 1500ft)), ATC is not expecting you at a mini 1000 or 500 fpm or else, I have used many, many, many times 100fpm to descend if I am far from my TOD, they barely question me. Times to times in Italie to pass over the traffic into France, or to Switzerland, or in Germany they pass you a clearance to descent with a mini ROD... other than that... no problem at all! Should you try!?
You see, that is the expectation from your fellow professionals;
rather than wait until prompted, give the controller what he/she expects..
frees up the frequency too! 1 call instead of 2 (an added bonus)
He expects nothing, as there is no rules... again, do not create rules that doesn't exist...
Vectors (Downwind / Base / Final)
From having a chat with Approach controllers over the years, I understand there is an expectation that a pilot would descend at least 500fpm when been vectored, (once out of any holding pattern) and also (for sure I am open to correction on this one), 300fpm is acceptable below 6000ft aal.
First time ever I can read that!!!
Where it is written a controller is expecting you to descent at 500fpm, 400fpm, 300fpm? why not 675fpm as per a controller at 6am, and 425fpm as per another one at 6pm...
If they want you to take a mini ROD, they will tell you.
Or it will be either:
- written in an AIP as per a local rule, shown in an AOI,
- written in the local regulation text (e.g.: FAR) reflected in the LIDO GEN...
Why do you want people to expect you doing something not written, this is stupid, one controller would expect you to descent at one rate, where another would expect you to descent at double this rate...
Stop creating rules and expectations that do not exist for god sake!