WWW - (can we have an emoticon for "no daggers drawn here", please?).
I have to counter with - cut/past from my earlier posting...
Whilst on the subject - if I were a JAA PPL Wanabee, and knew what I know about training - I would stay in the UK and do the PPL over as many months as it takes...despite the costs and bad weather.....but for those in a rush (for whatever reason) - or those on a budget, then the USA training market has the goods to offer....and remember, they have been individually approved by the UK CAA - to an extent far greater than any school in the UK has.
I fail to see how recommending that the JAA Wannabe should train in the UK is "protecting my own commercial interests" when I live and work (for MY OWN COMPANY) in the United States.
I'm not even convinced that I have a personal commercial interest....so in answer to Barry's question (on the other thread) about personal agendas.....
From a totally personal and mercenary point of view, I don't give a stuff where anybody trains - or even if they do train - what I do care about, however, is the fact that some schools in the USA are prepared to gamble with the finances and reputation of the potential student.
It seriously p****s me off when I see students being shafted by the schools - they come out here with a dream in mind. They want that PPL that they have (probably) saved and struggled for.
There are three schools out here that have gone to the time, trouble and serious expense of getting visa approval - the others have not, and now, thanks to 9/11, they are hurting. But what do they do about it?? Britannia said that they couldn't 'hand on heart' encourage students to come across and risk "running the gauntlet" at the Immigration counter - so they ceased trading and closed the business, they were alive and well - very busy - but couldn't do it.
The other schools, however, don't care. They will happily recommend to you that you cross the Atlantic and attempt to lie your way into the Country if they meet an INS officer that is doing his or her job properly.
Dozens of students have been turned back from Orlando - at least one was prevented from boarding at Gatwick - passengers have reported to cabin crew that somebody was reading a flight training manual (Trevor Thom) on an airliner, the crew reported it to INS, and the student was on the same aircraft back across the Atlantic. Now, of course, he was some £300 or so poorer, had lost his dream about learning to fly, had probably just trashed three weeks leave from work, had a big stamp in his passport saying "Entry To USA Refused" and had been arrested by Immigration - had fingerprints taken, had mug shots taken, and now has a police record.
What difference does it make to the schools?? NOTHING!! They haven't lost a thing - they may as well encourage you to come across the Atlantic. If you get through, all well and good, they will get 40 to 50 hours of flying out of you and make a few hundred extra dollars on the side - if you get turned back - so what...they haven't lost anything. They may not make such a big profit at the end of the year - but they'll get over it.
The big Pprune battle?? Probably Captain Richard at Naples (visa approved) and Captain Fisher (not visa approved). Each one of them seems to want nasty things to happen to the other (there is a lot more going on in the training World than meets the pages of pprune).
Naples have written great postings (with Danny's approval) about the requirement for visas - every time Fisher gets one through the system you get new posts about it. Fisher just wants to rub Captain Richards nose in it!! (as the saying goes). I mean, please, Father Dougal - apparently doesn't subscribe to Pprune at home (if he does, why change the name when posting about not needing a visa??). He gets into the USA, goes to his commercial school (there is only EFT and IFTA doing commercial training - although OFT is approved for it) and then decides - presumably of his own accord - to register to a bulletin board, wait the few days for "clearance from Danny" and then post a message saying that nobody needs a visa to train here?? Oh, come on - give us some credit. Primed, or what?? And you then accuse ME of protecting a commercial interest.
For Father Dougal I am truly pleased that he got through the system - not because he shouldn't have, not because I hate the red tape, not because I have a commercial interest to protect, not because I want Captain Fisher to stay in work, not for anything other than 'Dougal' has spent a lot of time and money in getting to Florida to do his training....and I'm glad he will get away with it.
As I've said a few times before that Captain Fisher does have a very high respect from the examiners who go there to carry out the CPL flight tests - let me expand on that a bit...the examiners have a very high regard for the standard of training given (which is a different thing).
All I really care about is the student not being ripped off. I agree 100% with BEagle about the standards of US training - this is nothing to do with the FAA/JAA "who best" battle - it's just that the two Countries have different ways of looking at things and I'm pretty sure that Joe Public coming over the pond wants to learn to fly a UK AEROPLANE IN UK AIRSPACE - but nobody - at PPL level - will teach him that. Every school here - with the probable exception of Comair in Sanford (with which I have NOTHING to do - but I have visited for a "look round") attempt to teach in any way, shape, or form for the JAA PPL. They all teach FAA.
Entry number 1 in the log book. Excercise 1 to 10. Duration 1 hr 10 minutes. Entry 2 - touch and goes. Entry 3 - night cross country. Entry 4 - Basic Instrument Flying duration 1hr - "hood time", 1 hour. What b******s.
Saw one recently, student had an aircraft come to collect him from the airport of entry - journey to school was a night flight (first flight in a light aircraft) - then, at the end of the course, tried to claim it as part of the five hours towards a night qualification.
Despite the proliferation of the Internet - I have yet to see anybody looking at a Lapform (214 or 215). There are schools here with a full copy of the ANO, AIP and AIC's - untouched. Bang up to date - never been read. Instructors don't know what it is or how to read it.....why?? There isn't really any groundschool out here - it's just read your Trevor Thom and get on with it - the bl**dy confuser will get you through the writtens - you don't actually need to know this stuff - just learn the answers.
Naples is the only place I know that tries to get some semblance of order with the European R/T (at the moment) - of course there are R/T examiners out here, but they have a very difficult time with the candidates having been taught to repeat every single word said by ATC- and "request a frequnecy change"....and I feel sorry for them (the examiners, that is).
Back to BEagle - his main argument over the years I've been reading Pprune seems to be "basic attitude flying" - the pilots out here just don't have a clue about it. I was working with an FAA examiner last week - he was giving a flight safety lecture to a group of pilots and said "since the FAA encouraged integrated training" (meaning using instrument indications to support visual references when VFR) "nobody ever looks out of the window anymore".
I had an opportunity to fly with a JAA student over here a few months ago - cruising along merrily in his Cessan 150 - at 65 knots. Nose high in the sky, couldn't see where he was going. Guy was quite happy with this - he was, after all, straight and level. I asked what speed "the book" said for S&L, covered the ASI, lowered the nose to the right place and uncovered the ASI - the look on the guys face when he saw the correct speed was amazing. Did it again with climb and glide - every one, bang on - student was aghast...."How did you do that??"
Was speaking to a flight test candidate recently, who had made his own decision to abandon a flight test in a twin because of an excessive mag drop on one engine (outside limits - only just, but outside limits). He brought the aircraft back from the run-up point and snagged it. Two engineers spent about an hour changing plugs, doing ground runs etc. before deciding it was still outside limits and would need deeper research. Candidate declared to his examiner "test abandoned" - examiner agreed. Five minutes later, manager of flight school was talking to examiner saying "oh, it's probably the gauge - the left mag is always a bigger drop than the right one - the mag drop is smooth, no "rough running" - it'll be alright, it doesn't need fixing - now go off and fly it (not forgetting it was going to assymetric circuits and single engine go-around).
I've also said before, that I work with the FAA - doing the equivalent of CAA Safety Meetings (those nocturnal meetings, that those who care, attend in the pub for two hours - brilliant night out, highly recommended). I probably spend in the region of US$4,000 in a year out of my own pocket - all to promote flight safety (yes, it's tax deductible) - and none of it is in the pub.
There are two schools out here that are trying to do it right - for PPL level - and two others that DO do it right for CPL level and FIC work....and I am NOT employed by any of them. Three of those four are visa approved - the rest just want you to risk your money and police record on beating the system and going to them for training. If anybody wants guidance as to where I would recommend for training (having seen ALL the schools [though VERY limited on the one we are not allowed to mention] that are doing [or have done] JAA training in Florida) send me an e-mail. Despite the accusation that I'm trying to protect my own commercial interests, what I really care about is that YOU - the paying customer - get what YOU want, at the right price, no hidden extras that you were not told about when speaking to "marketing" and that you ENJOY the course - even before you board the aircraft in the UK to bring you out here.
PS - "Notice" - I work for myself. I have my own Company. I am not employed by any one of the flight schools. I hold two ATPL's - one for each side of the Atlantic Ocean....and do not need to do any instruction.