Swanrider - my oversight, you're absolutely right and I stand corrected. The best way forward for the pilots in the antipodean Virgin empire is to join ranks and be represented by a common organisation. The advantages are many - carreer path progression for ALL, so that CRFO's in VA can get sticktime in a narrowbody jet and it will be worthwhile to persue a widebody carreer for those currently plying the skies in domestic or shorthaul Pacific ops. Theres currently a poll going in the internal VA staff Website regarding this issue and whilst I have greater belief in VIPA (as it has had less time and opportunity to become corrupted by the power of "representation"). the most impportant part is to get everybody in line for the next EBA negotiations.