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Old 8th March 2009 | 08:52
  #1805 (permalink)  
BOAC
Per Ardua ad Astraeus
 
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 18,575
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From: UK
Wow! Once again I awake to this. I will not comment on the main thrust I see above in order to (hopefully) preserve my post.

To try and refocus this thread on what we should really be looking at, I offer the following:

There appears to be an assumption that the loss of speed (back to approach speed) over, say 80 or so of those 100 seconds is not excusable. It is quite likely that the a/c was EXPECTED to be slowing during that time, that the throttles were EXPECTED to be at idle as I suspect the approach had some elements of being unstable early on. Yes, of course, if so the TC should have instigated a g/a or taken control (we do not know yet if he did)

There are 'assumptions' here that the stickshake represented the end of life as we know it and the a/c was 'doomed'. Not so - the stick shake is a warning, and at the time it started the a/c was flying quite 'adequately', and probably following the ILS precisely. No 'horrendous' rates of descent etc. It is at that point that things appear to have completely disintegrated.

There are 'assumptions' that no-one had a hand on the throttles - we just do not know!

Until, as several have said, we have more detail we cannot fully analyse the accident. In my view, however, at the moment there is an urgent need to review several things, including:
1) training and flying ability of airline pilots in general
2) 737 systems and the way they interact and whether some of the bells and whistles are really needed
3) re-emphasis and more training on low speed low level recoveries and upset recovery
4) T Captain 'training' and a reminder of the need to put safety above commercialism.

Please note, although I do consider the TC to be largely to blame based on what I know so far, that is a personal opinion and not substantiated. Reviewing the above does NOT need to depend on my being right.

As others have mentioned, I see an incorrect attempt to recover the stall as the primary reason for the crash. (Oh yes, there will be arguments, but I speak only as a pilot). It appears that whoever initiated it failed to disconnect the 'malfunctioning' autothrottle. The application of a load of thrust at low speed with an aft trimmed tail would result in a huge pitch up force, instinctively requiring a 2-hand push on the stick. At this point the throttles dutifully close again. Loads of forward stick now, big nose up, low speed and now a sudden large pitch down from the change in engine thrust. Presumably another rapid application of power by someone, the a/c rears up again and sinks, now stalled and pretty well uncontrollable, tail first. I do believe that a correctly handled recovery MIGHT have enabled a shaky crew to fly away and have another go.

Could I also endorse the plaintiff and unheeded requests from 'oldbold' for dutytime info too?
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