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Old 20th Feb 2008, 10:45
  #152 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 101
One small leap for (a) man but a massive leap was made by PAF


I think you better read my post again because at no point did I say anything about you living in a ďprotected paradiseĒ. Those are your words not mine. I also never said I thought you were on great wages. (Seriously, how did you come to this conclusion, and a few others, from what I actually wrote?) Iím quite happy where I am and have no desire to join you in the ADF. Because you bought it up Iím also very happy with the life decisions Iíve made. What I did say is that the area of negotiation with Airline management and consultants such as Oldmeadow is one you have not been exposed to in much the same way as I have no idea about how the ADFís infrastructure works. Itís not being critical of you saying this, you just havenít experienced it yet where I have. My other point was that I disagree with your criticism of people using Unions to negotiate T & Cís with these people. I believe it would be foolish to not use the people who are qualified and experienced in these matters and to go it on your own would be at your peril. Study history and look at the conditions that existed post WW2 in airlines before pilots became unified.

Within reasonable terms I disagree with your statement that the number of jobs is dictated by the wage a pilot is paid. The market dictates the number of aircraft required and the airline has to crew them. I think youíre seriously overstating our influence if you think our wage affects how many aeroplanes an airline flies between two places. I havenít seen any outrageous wage claims being made by anyone that would seriously even show on an airlineís bottom line. To answer your last question the price an airline asks for a ticket is certainly not dictated by a pilotís wage. Airlines ask the highest price they think they can on any flight with a balance always being made between this and how many people will buy them. It seems like a bit of a black art to me but they have whole departments that deal with this ĎYield Managementí. At the end of the day airline management is trying to maximise its profits and managers are paid obscene bonuses to achieve this. Even when an airline is making record profits, like Qantas is, they will still try to reduce their staff wages as much as possible. Thatís their job. The thing is most of us expect this (it really is an adversarial position between airlines and staff when it comes to T & Cís) and thatís why we choose to negotiate together as a group to achieve the best result for us all.

Back to the original subject of the thread I really hope the Group Opportunity List can eventuate in the Qantas Group soon to secure a future for ALL Qantas Group pilots. It can ONLY be a good thing and anyone saying otherwise is spreading misinformation. Thereís always a few di%^heads in any group that will write stupid crap on forums. IGNORE THEM! They certainly donít reflect the opinions of the greater majority of guys I fly with. Good luck to the Jetstar guys with their EBA vote. I hope you can at the least get the better terms and conditions you deserve but will be much happier if the offer is voted down and we can finally get a unified pilot group in this country. It can only be a good thing for ALL of us.

Nuthinondaclock is offline