But let's keep an open mind. Let's ask the questions and wait for the answers. There's no need for pre-judgement or insult.
Nor should this become an anti-French/anti-English issue.
This is however exactly what it has become, so do be a blessed puppy and give me a break.
Emotional post ?? Beg pardon !!!??
You can't have it both ways gents, clearly cross the line of decency ( I'm not only refering to this thread ) and change the rules reversing to the tight upper lip attitude when it suites you. I have seen far more abusing posts on this forum in all the time I've been watching it. By the look of it, no one on this forum can claim the medal of verbal restrain. Your culture doesn't own the quality of having the control of oneself and the scores of football supporters that you are kind enough to send out to our shores are a loud example. So sorry if I've hurt your sensitivity but I'll react in the very same way every time I see the need to.
I just cannot obide Christian Marty being compared to this KLM guy all those years ago as well as the smirk behind the " super hero within his compagny " remark.
Now I'll answer WHAT I KNOW and will not pretend I was on the board of investigation.
Capt Marty was the rostered skipper and no one chickened out. The initially rostered F/O however called in sick ( welllllll before sign on ) that day and F/O Marcot replaced him coming from Haut de Savoie where he lived.
May I just remind you that however slacky you would like to portray us, Air France didn't pull out this fuelling procedure out of its sleeve but with the Aircraft maker's blessing. Might I be as bold as trying to wisper British Aerospace ??? and yes Aerospatiale. Wether on this particular flight or others, this is the way it has always been done not implying in any way an overweight take off.
Is it a culture to encourage breaking the rules ??
Well, if you stick to the " Allo, Allo " picture of the french, then most certainly yes. If you're talking real world, which I trust you are, then bloody oath no !
Does this mean that, as I am typing someone is not breaking some rules and getting away with it, I'm not taking the bet.
Sorry to hit below the belt, but what about this BA crew who was caught on candid camera pissed out of their brain in Barcelona at 5 am just before operating a flight ? In my wildest dreams I would never imagine that this is compagny policy to have its pilot have a little drink before sunrise. Was worth mentioning I think.
All I know is what I see, every day. The pressure of ontime, maxload etc is there and beyhond compagny policy it's up to every Captain to take his reponsability knowing what he'll have to face if things go wrong.
Christian Marty would have faced his responsabilities hadn't he died. I have no clue as to wether he knew about those ( 200 kg ??? )overweight.
What caused the fire ? Well, you know, according to the official report a piece of a possibly Continental DC10 that had taken off minutes before. The runway had been inspected routinely like it should have that day. Why did it take fire that time and not the other time in 1976 ? Probably because we were lucky then and had it caught fire you very well know that in the context of the time ( taking off from Washington ) it would have meant the end of Concorde.
Why did the F/E shut number 2 without being asked ? I don't know. Is this standard AF CRM ? Nope, it is not.
Why did capt Marty try to gain altitude against speed ? What do you do when you lose an engine, actually 2, can't retract your gear and are awfully close to the ground ? My bet would be that he tried to stick to V2.
Why didn't he make it to le Bourget ?
How many of you take off from 26 L ??
Going off to England you always get the northern runway so I don't think you really get a clear picture. To think that anyone could make it to le Bourget at the kind of speed they were and barely manoeuvering is ludicrous. I leave from that runway 80 % of the time and even with my " fly by wire " wheelbarrow I would have a lot of trouble making it at max weight.
Why didn't Air France retro fitted the landing gear with that protection panel ?
Most possibly to either save money or because they didn't think it necessary and in both cases, if proven, they were wrong.
Guvernor
I praise your " compagny " patriotism, but didn't you people smash an aircraft because the F/O retracted the flaps witout being asked ? It must have been around your time.
Only arrogant fools can think and be sure they belong to the ultimate flawless outfit
I would hate to know one of them is at the helm when going on holliday.
Spare me the " Lordy Lord " shocked tone of voice when you're caught playing dirty. Most of your posts so far have rather been on the pompous and xenophobic side of the fence.
Have a nice one mate.