CFAR,. .. .couldn't agree with you more mate!. .. .I have consistantly suggested that say every two or three years, ALL the AEOps (and it would work for other AA also) all get together with the PMA wizards, and we sit down and thrash out the next round of postings. After all, there arn't that many of us really are there?. .. .Like you say, many people want to stay at Kinloss, and many don't. There has to be a better way of improving the quality of life by sensible negotiations. I have heard recently that a posting to Cranwell is regarded as a 'rest tour' for ex Kilo AEOps!! and yet when I speak to mates over on applied flight, they tell me they are working their nuts off! so whats that all about?. .. .Of course we will never please everyone, but it would please a lot, and at least those who don't get what they want immediately will be able to see that we are including a modicum of common sense into the posting equation, and it would give them some hope and encouragement.. .. .As for us old masters, well yes you are correct again. But the problem with masters however is (and you will be more familiar with this at Kilo that I am down here) that good old PMA decided on the composition of the Nimrod fleet and crews, and therefore, what do you do with a master who doesn't want to do a ground tour? Do you 'force' him into a ground tour or what? That negates one of your most valid points above, about forcing people into unwanted ground tours.. .. .I have done a couple of ground tours, and in the main I hated them, and did everything I could to get out of them. But, like pma say, where do you go after you have been a Nimrod B cat for 4 years and there are no slots available on any sqns?? It's a big problem.. .. .Sadly, this is now all accademic for me, as I have decided to call it a day and have pvr'd. A sad situation after 30+ years, but a necessary one I feel. . .. .Our problem has been that we have had no one at the top who has been prepared to argue our case. If you look at the way that the fighter controller branch have effectively 'taken over' the E-3D world, you can see just how invaluable it is to have someone high up batting for your side. We have had no one and, I regret to say it, I doubt we ever will. . .. .Having said that, someone will soon have to take the problem by the scruff and sort it out. We are approaching an interesting point in time, with lots of AEOps approaching 'decision time' and I fear that the majority of them will simply vote with their feet. Perhaps when that happens, and a few of your Kilo Sqn Cdrs reflect that in their stats returns to group, strike blah, maybe then will someone take a realitly pill and reverse this appalling trend.. .. .Take heart CFAR, things cannot get much worse, although I seem to remember having said that many times before!. .. .All the best. .. .MM. .. .any speeling misstakes is coz I is pi$$$ed