Kaptain M
Whether 89ers or heroes/returnees, the trends set by both camps in recent years disappointing. 89ers in Virgin Blue have done very well in management positions and for the rest it's nice to be home; the cost young pilots robbed of their money paying for training and relatively poor pay.
J* returnees have little choice in some respects, the unofficial blackbanning of them in the better airlines abroad and Virgin Blue, has played into Dixon's hands. He has started an Airbus airline with the cheapest baulk Airbus labour in the world.
jakethemuss
A little cheeky don't you think? The QF role in AN's demise convincing- political lobbying of life lines and foreign & Australian governments. AN staff had a taste of QF Management expertise too- Trevor Jensen & Gary Toomey. The former worthy of a long thread!
Howard Hughes & Low Cost Friends
I did read your post but the half time siren sounded. I asked the question about QF pilot's pay to see where you were really coming from- and your response answered my question.
Your prognosis is seriously flawed because of the precedent low cost pilots have set and your acceptence of a changing industry which though undeniable, certainly fleeces the pockets of senior pilot management and above.
This original topic was how the lowest paid pilots in the region are undercutting each other- needlessly the consensus of outsiders but low cost pilots such as yourselves launch into a long justification of your present circumstances forgetting this present undercutting another serious pilot battle about to be lost!
Insiders tell me a training/checking airmen in J* on A320's makes 135K a year. Like Virgin Blue pilots at parties a few years ago, stories of 180K are bandied about- base + super + allowances + loss of licence insurance + whatever they can find to boost relative meagre earnings.
135K a year for an Airbus Check Airmen is way below world standards- look at Flight International if you please. Booming India, China, MidEast etc will further pressure the premium. Where in the world does a check airmen on Airbus make so little? You name Bhutan I will name three others in excess etc.
I never put a figure of pay on cockpit professionalism. I did put into question are professional pilots who let slide, without any pressure, conditions of service for future generations just dropping the p out of professional? J* pay for your training is robbery considering free manafacturer training credits and taxation write offs but are you doing any lobbying as professional group to stop it? etc etc
Sadly, your allright as are a cadre of Virgin Blue pilots who received quick commands in a convenient period of industry change. But a legacy now remains- normal promotiom, pay fo your training and poorer conditions.
The greatest travesty of all is low cost pilots have only ever seen themselves bettered by undercutting others. So now, subject of the thread, Jetstar, National Jet and Jetconnect, regionally and by international standards underprivileged pilots, undercutting to the bone for an unclear professional improvement.
It all goes in one side and out the other, because as an outsider looking in I see the real pattern for low cost pilots as follows. EBA's won't realise any significant conditions of improvement. What can you give up? The lesson low cost pilots have learn't is to undercut. The next big payrise for J* will be to fly the PAcific at rates of pay equating a senior QF S/O or a junior QF F/O- and won't that teach 'em!
So your prognosis of a creep of low cost pilot conditons toward that of the incumbant QF's rosey IMHO. There is no precedent or professional effort to suggest other than a further gradual deterioration in real economic terms!
Keep up the good work.
