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Old 21st Oct 2004, 09:19
  #29 (permalink)  
Pilot Pete
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Egcc
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For what it's worth,

No, I wouldn't touch the Air Asia offer with a barge pole, the contract I saw was just far too weighted in favour of them. They not only want you to pay for the type rating, but they then want to pay you peanuts and hold back some of that and then want to in effect 'bond you' by putting restrictions on when you can leave and say that you have to give them double the notice that they have to give you! Where does it end? Just how far do you have to go to get into this industry? That smacks of a restriction of trade in my mind, but you wouldn't be under UK law if you signed up for it.............

I fully accept that the game has changed since I got in and also agree that it is market forces; all the time individuals are willing to accept these ever lowering starting packages then the business managers will keep lowering them.

The pay for a type rating argument has been thrashed to death on these pages and I have contributed to a few of those threads too. My feelings are that it is unpalatable, but fast becoming a necessary step. There are still employers who will take you on without a type rating and not expect you to pay, but these are dwindling. Some have different schemes where they pay you a reduced salary for a few years (so in effect you are paying), which I think is better (as long as the wage isn't rediculously low) as if you weren't working and hence earning anything and then you got this break, you can view it as though you are not paying, just at the bottom of salary table with a low starting point, which is a lot more than you are currently on.............!

Something I always shy away from advising is going out and paying for a type rating and then trying to get yourself a job. This is purely based on risk and it is inevitable that the individual is going to think that this will put them in a much better employment position, but I think the reality is not always the same. Sure, some take the risk, get the break and never look back, but others are less successful and another £20k in debt. As more and more airlines tie themselves to a type rating service provider, your chances of being taken on with your ('a.n.other service providers') type rating are perhaps somewhat slimmer than you had anticipated. Add this to the fact that a turbo-prop operator is not going to be impressed by your shiny 737 rating (assuming you went for the 'Holy Grail' jet type rating) and quite rightly perceive that you are going to be off at the first opportunity with a few multi-crew airline hours under your belt and your number of potential employers has been diminished even more.

This is why, when directly asked I always advise (which of course does depend on age);

1. Apply to every man and his dog when you qualify. Network hard alongside this (which you should have been doing all through your training.
2. Apply to CTC (as soon as you qualify)
3. Keep enhancing the CV by way of adding hours (be that instructing, para-dropping whatever), but DON'T still have 200hrs 12 months later/ 24 months later etc etc as you are less employable then than you were when you qualified.....and nobody wanted you then!
4. If you are not working in the industry, consider trying to get employment in an airline whilst you are looking for a flying job.
5. Consider type ratings, but be extremely careful and weigh up in your own mind the real chances of getting a job with it before you part with the money.

As regards point 5, I always recommend trying to do a type rating that has the chance of a job at the end of it (there will be no 'guarantee' of a job, no employer commits to that), but there may well be a strong chance of being taken on if you perform well and have the other necessary skills. You have to see through the marketing hype though as they are all going to tell you what a great chance you have of being taken on. You must 'excel' on the course as well, not just 'pass'. This is where something like the Ryanair scheme is better than paying for a type rating yourself on the open market (bet you never thought you'd hear me say that!)

Obviously the list above has to be re-ordered if you are older, as you might not qualify for direct entry due to age vs experience, or indeed you might already be too old for CTC and of course you can't spend too long being an FI etc etc, but the general order of priority (in my mind) is as listed.

Would I go to Ryanair if I had my time again? Who knows. Maybe I would have been a lot more niaive then and thought the same as many on these pages; I'll do a couple of years and then join a 'decent' employer. My posting was not to bash Ryanair, merely to try to point out that that argument is somewhat flawed as we see more and more employers being forced onto the 'pay for your type rating', lower starting salary bandwaggon in order to compete.

I would probably still go FI, build those hours, try to get some twin time and apply to the likes of BACE who will take you on direct entry with a year or so FI experience.

As I have already said, the whole thing comes down to market forces and the accountants are in the lucky position of having a supply of potential pilots that are;

A. Vast in number
B. So much in debt already that they have to stoop ever lower to try to avoid their investment being wasted.
C. Desperate
D. Want this job more than anything else in the world!

Time will tell, but I think the paid for type rating is here to stay, like it or not as there will always be individuals who will go that extra mile and accept the lower Ts & Cs to get on the ladder. Perhaps, and here's a novel concept, eventually the starting packages and the amount of debt one is expected to get into will see a slow down in the number of those opting to train in the first place, which, coupled to an increased demand for pilots may, just may, improve those packages slightly again. But that's just a theory and maybe a rose tinted spectacle one at that, it's certainly not going to be the case of the coming couple of years.

It all comes down to an individual's choice as to which way to go, but as long as Newbies make those decisions with all the facts then they might make the right decision (or compromise), but understand all the consequences of their actions, that's all I try to help with, not to say 'never pay for a type rating' or anything as blinkered as that.

Good luck to you all.

PP
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