Access to PA46 in SE England

[hegemon88]

Hello All,

I would like to ask if anyone has heard about any PA46s for hire in a reasonable distance from London.

Background: I am a PPL without CPL ambitions, but on the right path to IR(A), usually flying PA28s, from a Warrior to a Dakota. Some of my potential trips in the near future are longer than others and some of my pax would like more cabin comfort than others I started considering stepping up to a PA46 at some point, a Matrix/Mirage initially but give it another 1-2 years of flying and I'd start eyeing up the turboprops i.e. Meridians or JetProp conversions. Of course, that leads to a lot of questions and concerns, including whether my naive thinking that it is a path for me, makes any sense.

• It's all very nice to daydream about flying around Europe in a turboprop: going high and fast, burning cheaper fuel and not being overly concerned about the fanstop any more. However, if I don't fly for a living and as such, fly much less frequently, does it make any sense? Doesn't a turbine engine require so much more skill and currency that my 6-8 longer trips a year (and some local flights every now and then) simply won't be enough?
• Leaving that concern aside, how does one actually fly a PA46 (piston or turbine) without buying it outright? It would make most sense for me to find a PA46 for hire or a group with available shares and low fractional ownership - but where the hell are they? Google's lips are sealed.
• Another thing I imagine is that finding the craft is not everything, is it? Unlike with C172s/PA28s, the owner/operator may require more than a single check-out flight to let me set off in their PA46, especially a JetProp, correct? (even assuming I'm TR'ed and hence have some time on the type)

It is all a little far-fetched but I thought I'd do some basic research before I think of the type rating. I am researching both piston and turbine variants, even though I may later decide that turboprops are an overkill. Any help, thoughts and information will be greatly appreciated. Not to mention a test flight

Thanks,



/h88

[AdamFrisch]

There used to be at least two based at Lydd when I lived in England. One was a N-reg and the other was a G-reg. One was for sure part of a group or at least possible to rent, because I tried to myself. This is closer to 4 years ago, so things change obviously. Maybe someone with more current info can help? As for turboprops being harder to fly, I would think they're easier, rather. Much less management than a HP piston. It's a constant fiddle with piston engines. That said, the TP's not only burn more, but you're relegated to the higher levels if you want to see much economy with them.

My neighbour at my mechanics in the US just had his TBM700 PT6 overhauled - north of $300K! You can overhaul a lot of twin pistons for that price and only get marginally better performance... I started a thread some time ago comparing the case for the new single, turbine or not, vs. an older twin in regards to economy. You'll see that almost never is the new single a cheaper option. But if you want something new, and don't mind the excess that will cost you, then obviously I have no argument. Anyway, here it is:

http://www.pprune.org/private-flying...lder-twin.html

As for the Matrix - the feature I like the most with my Aerostar is the pressurisation. Don't leave home without it.

[hegemon88]

Thank you everyone for all the replies so far

AdamFrisch, you have raised a number of very good points, thanks for that. Good to hear someone second my prior thinking about pressurisation, and yes, I have come across your single vs. twin thread previously.

For a turboprop the cost of engine o/h, hot section insp. etc is likely to be a killer, and a completely different ballgame than for a piston engine. This is one of the reasons I am thinking about other ways of access than owning/co-owning. If a group of suitably experienced pilots forms, willing to fly a PA46TP, do you think that such group can dry-lease the aircraft instead of jointly buying (and maintaining) it?

Might be a good idea for me to visit Lydd by air (never have) and see those PA46s from close distance...

Regards,


/h88

[chevvron]

Several N reg examples based at Fairoaks and all of them spend a lot of time in the hangar.

[hegemon88]

Thanks, chevvron. N reg is no good for me at the moment but maybe by the time I gain necessary experience, I may well realise that a piggy-back FAA PPL is a nice-to-have and get it. I'll have a look, thank you.


/h88

[S-Works]

Unless you have an IR I would leave the PA46 well alone. I have many hundreds of hours in them both piston and turbine variants and they are an incredible IFR touring machine. I flew the ones based out of Lyd.

For low level VFR work they are a not ideal, poor view out the window and very quick which makes VFR flying tiring work.

They are also very thirsty low down.

As they are a type rated aircraft you would need to gain the relevant experience and knowledge to be comfortable with the operation of them and you need to fly them on a very regular basis to stay current enough to be safe.

[hegemon88]

Thanks, bose-x, I am far from underestimating the PA-46 family and am not going anywhere near them until I have IR(A). I'm just beginning my research early, put it this way...

Needless to say, a very good point about them being unsuitable for low-level VFR bimbling. I sat inside a Matrix (on the ground, sadly) and must agree that the outside visibility isn't great. I had no chance to test other points, e.g. fuel burn at low level, but it all makes perfect sense.

[hegemon88]

Let's take a different approach

Hi again,

Suppose I wanted to find a TRI with a PA46, who would be happy to sell me a single trial lesson, where should I look?

Thanks,



/h88

[S-Works]

Denmark. Currently the only place that I am aware of.

[Hugh Mann-Facteur]

Still thinking about this?

Hi hegemon88.

Are you still thinking about this? I'm Shoreham-based and thinking along similar lines.

I'm a PPL with 225 hours, seriously thinking about CPL/IR. I co-own an R44 for local and short/off-field stuff. But I'm interested in co-purchase of a PA46 at some point in the next couple of years.

PM me if you want to chat off line. If nothing else, it would be interesting to compare notes.