US Reservist takes bullet for British Colonel
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Whatever medal(s) are awarded and he most certainly deserves them, at the very least one would assume theres a barrel or two of the finest malt on the way to the lad courtesy of the Colonel.
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As the BBC clip demonstrates, the GC is for valorous actions not in the face of the enemy. This soldier saved a British officer's life and should get the VC, regardless of foolishness about precedent. Simples!
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Thread Starter
Authorised Foreign Military Decorations of the US Military
United Kingdom
Victoria Cross
Distinguished Service Order
Conspicuous Gallantry Cross
Distinguished Service Cross
Military Cross
Distinguished Flying Cross
Air Force Cross
United Kingdom
Victoria Cross
Distinguished Service Order
Conspicuous Gallantry Cross
Distinguished Service Cross
Military Cross
Distinguished Flying Cross
Air Force Cross
I disagree with nutnurse's statement. It is tempting to say - "Give him a VC", but The Victoria Cross is our highest award and is treated with the same reverence as is the Medal of Honor by the Americans. It has very stringent conditions for its award, and quite rightly so. If it were given out wholesale it would soon have no more cachet than the Iron Cross or the Croix de Guerre.
There are very good reasons why this very brave soldier should nevertheless not be awarded the VC. Although the assailant certainly had murderous intent, he probably could not be considered "the enemy" within the meaning of the original warrant. A good comparison is Northern Ireland, where Captain Nairac, who was murdered by the IRA, was awarded a posthumous George Cross, not the Victoria Cross, as the IRA were not considered "the enemy", strange as that may seem.
As I outlined above for the VC, the George Cross is restricted to UK nationals and those of commonwealth countries (previously colonies). You would therefore have to amend the warrant before you could award a George Cross to a foreign national, although of course that may be a good thing.
Certainly he otherwise seems to qualify under the terms of the warrant which state:
"It is ordained that the Cross shall be awarded for acts of the greatest heroism ... in circumstances of extreme danger..."
Not much doubt there, I would have thought!
There are very good reasons why this very brave soldier should nevertheless not be awarded the VC. Although the assailant certainly had murderous intent, he probably could not be considered "the enemy" within the meaning of the original warrant. A good comparison is Northern Ireland, where Captain Nairac, who was murdered by the IRA, was awarded a posthumous George Cross, not the Victoria Cross, as the IRA were not considered "the enemy", strange as that may seem.
As I outlined above for the VC, the George Cross is restricted to UK nationals and those of commonwealth countries (previously colonies). You would therefore have to amend the warrant before you could award a George Cross to a foreign national, although of course that may be a good thing.
Certainly he otherwise seems to qualify under the terms of the warrant which state:
"It is ordained that the Cross shall be awarded for acts of the greatest heroism ... in circumstances of extreme danger..."
Not much doubt there, I would have thought!
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Read my post 7 , that US soldier stepped in front off a Polish Officer and took the blast of a suicide bomber, he got the Silver Star.
The other one in NI was Michael Willetts who won the GC
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Willetts
TTN, see post 20 re a GC awarded to a US citizen.
The other one in NI was Michael Willetts who won the GC
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Willetts
TTN, see post 20 re a GC awarded to a US citizen.
Good point Nutloose- then I assume that there must have been an amendment to the warrant which allowed for this award, something I dont have a record of. In that case I think there is a strong case for a recommendation for the George Cross, but not the Victoria Cross
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Depends on what the others did.
This guy not only got shot multiple times, he managed to return fire with both his rifle and his service pistol.
Sounds like a well rounded individual.
This guy not only got shot multiple times, he managed to return fire with both his rifle and his service pistol.
Sounds like a well rounded individual.
Evertonian
With respect, arguing over what medal he should get belittles what he's done to some extent. Someone as selfless as that wouldn't even enter the discussion.
(Sorry, I'll put the soap box away now)
(Sorry, I'll put the soap box away now)
Someone as selfless as that wouldn't even enter the discussion
But to suggest that arguing over what medal this particular individual deserves belittles what he is done is wrong (again, IMHO). Sometimes gallantry such as this needs a bit of a 'nudge' in the right direction to get the reward they justly deserve (and perhaps alert those journalists who peruse this site who have column inches to fill...) - I haven't read back through the thread on the campaign to knight Simon Weston (that I believe ended up in Jet Blast) to see if you made similar comments there...
What is really belittling, however, is that with the football season underway again here in UK the words hero and bravery will soon become so overused as to make them meaningless.....
Evertonian
I'll save you the search time WM, I made no comments there because I haven't read that thread.
Anyway, to each their own I guess. Maybe I'll move on once we've sorted out where to hold the ceremony & what music the band will play...
Having said that, your last point...well, don't get me started!
Anyway, to each their own I guess. Maybe I'll move on once we've sorted out where to hold the ceremony & what music the band will play...
Having said that, your last point...well, don't get me started!
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I have no knowledge of medals and how they are awarded other than the Operational medals such as the Afghan medal or the Iraq medal for example, but this guy is definitely a hero.
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Reis Leming was awarded a GM at Hunstanton not a GC. The point is to reward this reservist quickly or risk bringing the whole system into disrepute. The GC isn't on the US list of approved decorations. One lot of bureaucrats (e.g. UK MoD) nit-picking would lead to unacceptable delay. Two lots (i.e. including US DoD and/or DoA) would be a geometric progression towards infinity with nothing actually happening. I take the point about the VC. Surely, there can be no argument and should be no delay about awarding him the DSO? (And I don't consider it relevant whether or not the US or any other country awards him a decoration - in part, I suggest it's a matter of gratitude.) 
Last edited by nutnurse; 21st Aug 2014 at 11:58. Reason: typo
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This poor Lad came up a bit short for the VC.
He only took on 30 of the Taliban.
Hero Gurkha handed bravery medal by Queen said: 'I thought I was going to die... so I tried to kill as many as I could' | Mail Online
He only took on 30 of the Taliban.
Hero Gurkha handed bravery medal by Queen said: 'I thought I was going to die... so I tried to kill as many as I could' | Mail Online
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A fine distinction, perhaps, in Cpl Pun's case ... he did not deliberately place himself in danger. He had little choice but to fight, with everything he had at his disposal - which he did, heroically and with determination and skill.
