Aeromexico lands at wrong airport

[Noxegon]

Interesting story here:

Aeroméxico flight to Monterrey lands at wrong airport (http://mexiconewsdaily.com/news/flight-monterrey-lands-wrong-airport/)

Landing in the wrong place is bad enough, but taking off again after just ten minutes seems incredible to me. I don't know how they'd have managed their performance calculations in that time...

[JammedStab]

Del Norte International Airport - The most user friendly airport in Mixico (http://www.adelnorte.com.mx/eng/index.html)

6000 foot runway. No problem for an Embraer.

[lomapaseo]

new meaning to touch-n-go

[underfire]

touch...get a good long feel...and then go?

[Denti]

I don't know how they'd have managed their performance calculations in that time...

Performance calculations take about 10 seconds, so where is the problem there? More problematic would be a correct flight plan, but then, our dispatch is exceptionally slow in unusual circumstances...

[Wageslave]

How exactly would arrogance lead a crew (an arrogant crew??) to land at the wrong airport?

Fatigue, complacency, habit, carelessness I can see, but arrogance (or training for that matter) seems pretty left-field reasons to put it mildly.

Despite rumours to the contrary the report only says they've been suspended pending investigation, no mention of being sacked. Even so, why the heck not sack them? What else to do with them? Do you retain a doctor for the fluffy treatment when he's just removed the wrong leg?

How the heck does anyone mistake a 1400m local strip for a 3000m international airport? Perhaps someone can post pics of the two for comparison, they are so very different. The only similarity seems to be both have a Rwy 29.

Baffling.

[kilomike_19]

I suppose that this "responsible" crew will be fired... isn't?

[Denti]

I wonder, has anyone ever heard about the concept of "just culture"?

[de facto]

Visual approach to save fuel and time into a non familiar airport gone wrong..

[Piltdown Man]

Performance from a 2,000 M runway will take a few minutes tops. Flight planning for an airfield 9 nm distant can be done on the back of a fag packet. The loadsheet from the initial departure will show no limits will be broken and depending on its format, may even spit out the trim setting, if required. So what next? Backtrack - set up - brief - blast off. Next?

The big issue is the treatment of the crew. Which numbskull will tell me how sacking them will fix the problem? The problem was that it for some reason this crew believed they were at the correct airport. When that had been answered, you then set about fixing the problem. Sacking people sends only sends the message that if you ever screw up you will be punished. And then your problems as a company really start. Because from then on, the management will be running a totally safe airline. There will be no reports, no ASRs, CVRs will be "erased", FDM recorders "disabled", etc. Furthermore, your aircraft might now be flown to inefficiently that you might find the company's existance is in jeopardy. In addition nobody will own up to anything, just in case what they have done will be perceived as a mistake. The result will eventually be a totally shocking smoking hole in the ground. One that could have been prevented if only they knew they had a problem.

Punishment of people who were trying to do the right thing is a halfwitted, myopic, ill-considered course of action taken by stupid, ignorant bullies.

PM

[Hotel Tango]

Wageslave

They also both have a runway 11. One would assume that they were on a visual for 11 and thus saw Del Norte first. As for identifying one airport from the other in terms of size I would suggest that may not be as easy as you seem to imply, certainly from a distance. As the aircraft gets closer I would also imagine that the crew are concentrating on the runway (PF) and instruments (PNF) for call outs, and not admiring the surrounding scenery. Of course it would be interesting to know if they had set up their instruments for say an ILS or other type of approach which would have warned them that something wasn't quite right, but I don't know what aids the airport has.

Note: Del Norte Runway 11/29 is reported as 5049 feet long - though still ample for the Embraer.

Edit: From what I have found 11 has an ILS and there's a VOR-DME on the airport.

[vancouv]

Piltdown Man - where did you hear they were sacked? The article linked here says they're suspended while the investigation takes place which seems a reasonable approach to me.

[Steve6443]

Piltdown Man - where did you hear they were sacked? The article linked here says they're suspended while the investigation takes place which seems a reasonable approach to me.

3rd paragraph from the bottom from the linked website.

The airline hasn’t issued an official statement regarding the incident, but has announced that the two pilots —whose names haven’t been disclosed — would be dismissed today.

[muti]

I take it they don't fly "company routes"

[Wageslave]

Punishment of people who were trying to do the right thing is a halfwitted, myopic, ill-considered course of action taken by stupid, ignorant bullies.

PM

There are times when the half witted, myopic ill considered uber-fluffy "pilots can do no wrong" attitude here really grips.
Or should we wait for the official report to be published before we discount the possibility of a hitherto unknown knurled flange-bracket failure or alien invasion causing these people who "were trying to do the right thing" (we know this for a fact, do we?)
to screw up so uncharacteristically?

Some things are so clear cut and beyond the pale that there is no alternative. Find out why by all means, but do the public deserve to be flown around by people capable of such gross and inexcusable error as landing in the wrong place? Apart from that, what do you imagine Aeromexico's insurers are going to say? Imagine they do the fluffy no blame thing? Imagine again.

I doubt the public would agree that this is a time to let people off with a with counselling or tickling with a fluffy stick PM. There is perhaps sometimes a time and a place for the zero blame culture but this does not seem to be it. There is a world of difference between "shall not" and "should not". This is most definitely the latter, and in spades. This is an airline operation where Professional standards apply, not a council office.

It clearly wasn't an instrument approach so just how the heck can you even begin to justify landing visually at the wrong airport? Clearly you cannot.

ps. You's better go look up the meaning of bully, because I don't think you've quite got it...

[Piltdown Man]

The public deserve to be safely flown by pilots who know what they are doing. That means proper training appropriate to their function. The knowledge of what to train pilots depends on their background, the type of operation, the terrain over which they fly and their environment - topographically, economically & politically. So unless you have clear knowledge about these I can not see how anybody can ask for their dismissal.

I also didn't talk about no-blame. These pilots should be accountable and quite rightly so. But that doesn't mean you sack them. It appears Wageslave might like to have them flogged as well. That would send an even clearer massage. But the sensible thing to do is use these guys to help build a safer world.

And while we are talking sanctions Wageslave, do you have a retribution scale? Say hard landing = one month's pay, burst tyre = weeks suspension, overspeed = sack. Punishment is the past, the future is trying to prevent incidents. And we do that by fixing things before they break. People with your approach will clog the arteries of information flow. And if you are indicative of your airline, god help your passengers.

PM

[de facto]

I believe in second chances...after that,it may be an accident waiting to happen.

[Lonewolf_50]

gross and inexcusable error Seems a bit of overstatement.

Embarrassing to be sure, and one of those things that fit into "how did you get that wrong?" but let's consider this:
nobody got hurt
a few extra pesos spent on fuel (maybe a few extra pesos spent for a landing at a place they don't have an arrangement with?)
pax got to their destination a little late, which can happen with a weather delay, or a divert due to weather ...
This is a mistake that didn't get anyone hurt.

Yeah, the chief pilot needs to sit down with the crew and go over just how one manages to get to the wrong place with all of the help available nowadays to not get lost. Some time in the penalty box probably due.

This isn't the first crew that ever did that.
(EDIT: latest report is that they took off without clearance and without a flight plan. If true, then it's no surprise if they got sacked. The company can't have their pilots doing that).

[Parson]

I believe a private jet taking Jenson Button from Monaco to Bristol a few years back landed at Filton instead of Lulsgate. I only know as I enquired as to the owner of a rather shiny motor with a private plate parked at BFC...

[kilomike_19]

Unfortunately, they had been fired

Despedidos pilotos de Aeromexico Connect que se equivocaron de Aeropuerto ? Transponder 1200 (http://www.transponder1200.com/pilotos-de-aeromexico-connect-despedidos-por-equivocarse-de-aeropuerto/) (in Spanish)

[flight_mode]

Did they get fired for the initial error, or what they did when they realised?

On Apr 5th 2016 Mexico's Pilot Union (ASPA) reported that the flight from Del Norte to International Airport was performed without a flight plan and therefore was illegal. In addition, the flight departed from Del Norte without clearance by Air Traffic Control.

[bloom]

Wrong airport but nothing else wrong ? In the US ho harm no fowl.

Depart again with no "numbers"? Fuel required, field length, weight and balance, speeds, etc?

You are toast!

[ManaAdaSystem]

Performance from a 2,000 M runway will take a few minutes

Really? Even if you don't have any performance data for that airport?
There is more to performance calculations than just the runway lenght.
If the airport was on their route network, fine.
If not, it would take a lot more than just a few minutes.

[DOVES]

Apart from the pilots dismissal which I consider lousy
One more time I fully agree with ManaAdaSystem opinions.


Performance from a 2,000 M runway will take a few minutes
Really? Even if you don't have any performance data for that airport?
There is more to performance calculations than just the runway lenght.
If the airport was on their route network, fine.
If not, it would take a lot more than just a few minutes.]

Regardless of the fuel calculation, weight and balance, flight plan, notams
Maximum take-off weight
Never heard of:
- Brake cooling
- Maximum braking energy
- Minimum Quick Turn around
- Obstacle limitations,
- One eng Out procedure

Fly Safe

[sabenaboy]

Landing at the wrong airport after a visual approach?
Stupid, but under "just culture" perhaps it wouldn't have cost them their jobs.

Taking off ten minutes later?
Now that's REALLY stupid! Getting fired is probably justified!

[RAT 5]

Captaincy is all about judgement, quality of decision making based upon that. Was this good judgment and a good decision? In a war zone, perhaps; otherwise..........

And that's not including how & why the error in the first place. Remember Nixon got toasted not for the bugging, but the cover up.

[Piltdown Man]

It is reasonable to assume that this crew had this airport in their performance book (or laptop etc.). If not, I'll agree this data can take ages to obtain. As for quick turnaround and braking cooling factors, I haven't a clue. I don't fly this aircraft therefore they may or may not be a factors. I'm also clueless about flight planning rules in Mexico. So it's fair to say, I don't know much. I am not in possession of all the facts. I'll also not be told about the other niff-naff and pointless trivia that some people think is so necessary for flight. Yes, I know what we need.

So without facts, how can anybody possibility come to the conclusion that this crew should be fired? So my initial annoyance was the "hang'em high" vigilante squad attitude expressed by some posters who had the same lack of information as I had. Furthermore, as I said above, if you want to run an unsafe operation, the quickest and surest way to do so is starve yourself of information and especially bad news. You achieve that by punishing staff who appear to have made an error.

So with that in mind, who do you want to fly with? The airline with the squeaky clean flight safety history and a record of harsh staff treatment or the one with a more interesting history and more humane staff treatment? I certainly know which airlines I'd like my mother-in-law to fly on.

PM


ps. And on what little information we have, probably not the soundest of judgement calls. But I wasn't there.

[DirtyProp]

According to the Art. linked in post #21, the 2 airports are MMAN and MMMY.
SkyVector shows a 9 NM distance between them, so my guess is that they simply got confused.

I think they are over-reacting to all this:

Miguel Peláez Lira, titular de la DGAC, informó que las licencias de ambos tripulantes han sido suspendidas temporalmente, y aseguró que después del dictamen arrojado por la investigación, podrían ser suspendidas de manera definitiva;

The pilots could lose their licenses for good.

[kilomike_19]

I don't understand how a Mexican crew, who normally there are familiar with the Mexican airspace and the Mexican airports, landed in the wrong airport... I'm sure that they fly to Monterrey many times ago in the past, so they should recognize that they was landing in another field... overall doing a Visual APP !

Anyway, I'm really sorry that they can lose their license. Losing the license is one of the nightmares of any pilot.

Cheers :)

[Lonewolf_50]

I don't understand how a Mexican crew, who normally there are familiar with the Mexican airspace and the Mexican airports, landed in the wrong airport... I'm sure that they fly to Monterrey many times ago in the past, so they should recognize that they was landing in another field... overall doing a Visual APP !
Well, I don't understand how Ameerican pilots who understand American airports and American airspace land at the wrong airport, but here are two examples of that happening.
One by Continental
Continental Grounds Pilots Who Landed at Wrong Airport - latimes (http://articles.latimes.com/1997-05-13/news/mn-58355_1_wrong-airport)
One by Southwest
SW Pilots who landed Airplane at wrong airport have been removed - KiiiTV.com South Texas, Corpus Christi, Coastal Bend (http://www.kiiitv.com/story/24432887/airplane-lands-at-wrong-airport)


I am pretty sure there are others. I don't think the pilots lost their licenses, but I also think they fessed up.

[Heathrow Harry]

the USAF managed it in a C-17..................

[Aluminium shuffler]

And Boeing in a Dreamlifter. It happens a lot there because use of automation and navigation equipment is contemptibly poor airmanship, something only crap Europeans and Asians do... :} That much said, I remember Eirejet landed at a disused ex military station instead of Londonderry, which is also ex military and both had the old triangular layouts, though different orientation and in very different positions relative to the coastline.

[Rwy in Sight]

Delta airlines did it back in the late 80's and a French airline landed in a airport in a wrong country in the Middle East at around the same time.

[AtomKraft]

A Saudi 747 landed at the very differently aligned and much smaller military airfield at Tambaram some years ago, when it was widely expected to be landing at Madras..... Hard to see how they managed to get those two mixed up.

The warning remains on the plate to this day.

[Tinribs]

So many pilots landed at Northolt instead of Heathrow in the bad old days when pilots new the way that they painted NO on top of a nearby gas holder
So I don't think we can blame modern nav systems and pilots for these errors

[DaveReidUK]

So many pilots landed at Northolt instead of Heathrow in the bad old days when pilots new the way that they painted NO on top of a nearby gas holder

Though they managed to keep all but this one under wraps ...

http://malander.webspace.virginmedia.com/northolt/_wp_generated/wp7e4afe61_06.jpg

[Hotel Tango]

Every time we get a wrong airport event (yep, it's happened quite a number of times), all the old stories come out once again. Perhaps there should be a Wrong Airport sticky thread :E;)

[pattern_is_full]

Happened in San Juan PR also. 757 inbound for TJSJ (SJU - map lower right) landed at TJIG (map upper left).

Evening, on the ILS, saw some lights......hot brakes, damp seats. Passengers bussed, plane flown out light the next day.

http://sanjuanpuertorico.com/wp-content/uploads/san-juan-puerto-rico-map-tourist-areas.jpg

Crew should have put themselves in "time-out" as soon as they stopped at the first airport - and I wouldn't want to fly with anyone who thinks otherwise. Other than that, I have no comment on discipline and regulatory response, until the facts are better known.

[FullWings]

Crew should have put themselves in "time-out" as soon as they stopped at the first airport - and I wouldn't want to fly with anyone who thinks otherwise. Other than that, I have no comment on discipline and regulatory response, until the facts are better known.
Exactly. If I ever found myself in this situation, I would fess up then await instructions. Trying to “make it better”, although instinctive and laudable, does not go down well with flight management these days.

Don’t dig yourself deeper into the mire. Put the park brake on and go off duty.

[tdracer]

And Boeing in a Dreamlifter.


Not to nit-pick, but that wasn't Boeing. The LCF/Dreamlifters are operated by Atlas.

[Airbubba]

An updated list of wrong airport landing incidents is posted here:

http://www.thirdamendment.com/WrongWay.pdf

[Hotel Tango]

:ok: Great stuff finding that Airbubba.

[MichaelOLearyGenius]

They didn't list me landing my Cessna 150 at the wrong airport in San Diego. Good thing is you don't need PPR in the USA :-)

There was also the case of a BA 747 about 150ft away from landing on the M4.

[innuendo]

Read your list twice Airbubba but could not find the BOAC 707, (been over at Cartierville :E), that lobbed in at Cartierville instead of Dorval in Montreal.
Bit of a sucker trap that one if you were trying to go visual through the murk as Cartierville was almost on the nose if you were going for 24R.

[Airbubba]

Read your list twice Airbubba but could not find the BOAC 707, (been over at Cartierville ), that lobbed in at Cartierville instead of Dorval in Montreal.

I think Air France and Pan Am both landed 707's at Cartierville but I believe the BOAC was a Bristol Britannia:

I don't know the year, but it must have been in the late '50s or early '60s. On the day in question, runway 28 (8800 feet) was closed for repairs so the active was 24 (less than 4000 feet). I gather the weather was marginal VFR and out of the murk appeared a BOAC Brittania on short final for 24. The plane landed and managed to stop at the intersection of 24/28. Bristol Britannia - circa 1958 Quite a feat if you've ever seen the approach to Cartieville's 24. The threshold is about 150 feet from St. Laurent Blvd. There's the four lane road, a chain link fence, some grass, and there are no approach lights. At any rate, Rene was the tower controller and realized that this was a major deal. He arranged for the pilot to park the aircraft in front of Canadair's Plant 1, called the local police to keep the curious at bay, called Customs, and sent the tower vehicle to pick up the captain and bring him to the tower to avoid the press.
When Montreal Terminal knew from Rene that the BOAC Britannia was safely down at Cartierville, Brian McDowell, a terminal controller with a rather dry if not bizarre sense of humour, immediately called BOAC and pretended to be a United Press reporter. He was enquiring about the new Britannia service between London and Cariterville and wanted to know the cost and schedule. They had no idea their flight was in Cartierville. Two days later the captain did his last flight for BOAC. With absolutely minimum fuel on board and no baggage, and likely no seats. he and the flight engineer flew the Britannia from Cartierville's 24 to Dorval's 24R. It was all over in less than 5 minutes.

Stan Madore writes: "BOAC did indeed land a Britannia at Cartierville. ...AND it landed long, naturally, thanks to the threshold impediments. At the time, runway 28 was being lengthened to accommodate the F104's. 28 has a pronounced hump in the middle, so you can't see one end from the other. F86's did use the old end of the runway and controllers usually gave the pilots position information on the big Miron trucks that were hauling dirt. The pilots, hearing the obvious hints, would keep it low to give the truck drivers something interesting in their lives. The drivers gradually got used to, or at least inured to, these events. As it happened, When Birdseed (ed note: Stan's lifelong name for Speedbird... ) landed, there was a Miron truck crossing the button of 06. Seeing the big bird coming at him, its engines roaring in reverse thrust, the driver did the sensible thing and, in panic, stalled the truck. Rene told me that when he got out to the scene, the driver, still seated in his cab, said to him: "You thought you could scare me, eh?" "You thought you could scare me, eh?" over and over. He had to be assisted out of the truck. There's more to this story..."

Ed Lesage writes: "... As you know, a Dorval tower check out required a controller to spend a cycle in Cartierville tower. So I too had the privilege of working there for a week. One came away with a whole new respect for that type of VFR operations. An experience that one could never fully appreciate working in Dorval tower. Where else in the world would a control tower have the ability, or the necessity to turn a red traffic light on a rural road! I remember relieving Ray Henry in Dorval tower one very early morning. He gave me the picture and as he was about to exit the tower, he said, very matter of factly; "Oh, by the way, there is a BOAC Britannia sitting in Carterville that will be coming over here today, after they strip it down". I guess I hadn't heard about it before then. Man was I surprised! I didn't know if he was joking or if this was for real."

Rob Millikin writes: "... I was not working when it happened, but can tell you my memory says it was in the 1961 or early 62, because I was living at the Mercroft Hotel on bord du lac, Dorval. One of my buddies was the base engineer for BOAC. He showed me copies of two BOAC teletypes addressed to the same person. I forget the guy's name but let's say it was Henry. I remember the content; 1st one said; "Capt Henry will fly Brittania G----- from CV to UL." 2nd one said; First Officer Henry will await the arrival of a Captain ... in UL." Sort of swift company reaction I think. You are correct, my buddy said the guy was canned when he returned to the UK (ed note; Rob's wording must be read carefully as chronologically; "... one minute he is a Captain, next minute he is a First Officer, and the last minute he is walking the street").

CYCV - Cartierville QB (http://www.winnipegacc.org/pages/index9_cv/index9_cv.html)

[ExSp33db1rd]

...............but could not find the BOAC 707, (been over at Cartierville ), that lobbed in at Cartierville instead of Dorval in Montreal.
Bit of a sucker trap that one if you were trying to go visual through the murk as Cartierville was almost on the nose if you were going for 24R.

That wasn't a 707, it was a Bristol Britannia 312. Until recently I could have given you the name of the Captain but Random Access Memory is now insufficient to recall.

( Sorry, was writing this when you posted the above - my recollection was that he wasn't sacked, but then it was a long time ago ! )

There was also a story going around that a private pilot approaching Cartierville saw the Brit. landing and thought BOAC can't be wrong, it must be me, so went and landed at Dorval ! Can't confirm that, but it made a good story in the bar.

Following a prior incident the then Flight Manager had issued a notice explaining that the next Captain to land at the wrong airport would be sacked. Shortly afterwards he landed a Stratocruiser (?) at the USAF base at Burtonwood near Manchester, instead of Ringway. He didn't sack himself ( and no one else did, either )

A BOAC VC-10 landed at Sharjah instead of Dubai. I don't think that Captain was sacked either ?

[UK019]

Probably apocryphal, but I hope it's true: the Cartierville Tower controller is reported to have said "Speedbird XYZ, what are your intentions?"

Speedbird XYZ: "Start a chicken farm in Kent?"

[Danny42C]

Done it myself (I plead extenuating circumstances !)

Whole sad story on "Military Aviation" Forum ("Gaining a RAF Pilot's wings in WW2"), my Posts (Page 188, #3752/3).

I throw myself on the mercy of the Court !

Danny.

[Airbubba]

Probably apocryphal, but I hope it's true: the Cartierville Tower controller is reported to have said "Speedbird XYZ, what are your intentions?"

Speedbird XYZ: "Start a chicken farm in Kent?"


As often cited here, a similar claim was made about the 1960 Pan Am 707 landing at RAF Northolt:

The Captain of the Pan Am B707 which landed at Northolt instead of Heathrow was (allegedly) asked by ATC for his intentions. "I guess I'll take up Chicken Farming" was the reply.

http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/528264-boeing-747-dreamlifter-lands-wrong-airport-4.html#post8165751

Back to the Aeroméxico flight, this was a code share, not a mainline flight, right? It's an unfortunate aspect of the branding in my opinion. The passenger is tricked into thinking that they are flying on the larger carrier but are ticketed on a commuter plane with quite possibly different training and standards.

Decades ago I had some military colleagues line up on the wrong airport in Italy while doing a night visual approach. They realized the mistake just before doing an unbriefed touch and go followed by a recovery at the correct field. After apologizing to both control towers and a rug dance for the Skipper the matter was closed as a learning episode.

An acquaintance was a passenger on the Piedmont F-28 that landed at Jacksonville, NC back in 1988. He said the dispatcher was trying to cut the captain some slack and suggested that they call the Jacksonville landing a fueling stop due to unforeseen traffic delays at the intended destination of Wilmington, NC. The captain wisely decided not to compound his error with a fabrication.

Another former colleague, now retired, was the flight engineer on a B-737 that landed at the wrong airport in Utah years ago. He repeatedly questioned whether they were aimed for the right piece of pavement but was told as a probationary newhire to shut up, watch and learn. In the modern era I suppose he would be hanged at the hearing for not being assertive.

[Rwy in Sight]

the flight engineer on a B-737.

I did not know there was one (the B-737 requires two crew upfront).

But I loved the last two phrases of your message!

[Airbubba]

the flight engineer on a B-737

I did not know there was one (the B-737 requires two crew upfront).


Well, now you know. :D

Many airlines, including I believe some European ones, initially operated the B-737 with a three person crew due to union work rules.

United, Wien, Aloha and some other ALPA operators used a three person crew on the B-737 in the early 1970's. ALPA opposed the two pilot crew on the 737 but said it was OK on the DC-9 of the same era. After lengthy arbitrations and a couple of costly strikes (e.g. Wien Air Alaska) the B-737 flight engineer was gone except in some military versions of the plane.

We've recently discussed the use of a flight engineer on a two pilot aircraft somewhere on another PPRuNe thread. Some operators of the B-767, A306 and A310 used FE's years ago. The duties were essentially do the outside preflight, handle the logbook, watch for traffic and read checklists.

[Piltdown Man]

I also believe a certain 747 crew mistook St. Athan for Cardiff. But it was perfectly OK because the were management pilots.

It happens

PM

[UK019]

Airbubba, I never knew that about the PanAm at Northolt - but I actually saw it on the approach and saw the subsequent take-off. I lived about 5 miles from Northolt. I was 11 years old.

Not only that, but ten years later I got to know the radar controller at LHR who handled them. He told me that they were landing on RW23 that day, and he asked them if they had the field in sight - after the affirmative reply, he handed them to the tower and concentrated on the next arrivals. The first he knew about the Northolt landing was when he received a phone call from an irate Northolt ATC who said - to slightly paraphrase the actual remarks - "One of your festering 707s has just landed here!"

Excuse the thread drift ....

[ExSp33db1rd]

There was a large tank gas-holder ( gasometer) positioned North of Heathrow, more or less lined up with LHR 23R, and following the PanAm episode it was suggested that 2 arrows be painted on the top, one labelled Heathrow, and one labelled Northolt, and pointing in the relevant directions !

I was once approaching New York Kennedy airport from the N.East, i.e. radar vectors off Deer Park for runway 22L. ATC gave us a vector, but then asked if we could accept a visual approach, I agreed and was then told that I was cleared for a visual approach to Rwy 22L, number two to a Clipper ( PanAm ) - did I have the Clipper in sight ? Affirmative, OK, continue and call Tower on xxx.xx

We had the airport in sight, and as we approached the centre line of 22L expected the Clipper to turn left in front of us, but no, it went straight on, and on and on. We made the turn on to final and requested landing clearance, which was given, and just after that we heard " er, Kennedy Tower, Clipper XXX, requesting assistance to final ? "

We were delighted that the "home" airline couldn't find their field !!

We later learned that it was a San Francisco based crew, presumably unfamiliar with New York ? Didn't lessen our delight tho', after all, if a Limey from across the Atlantic could find New York ..... !!!

[A0283]

FYI ...

The C17 that landed at the wrong airport was AMC C17 tailnumber 88199 landing on Peter O'Knight instead of MacDill AFB. So just across the pond. If I remember correctly it was on or before Feb 12th 2016. When I measure the runways from a photo the difference is about 1 : 3. Both fields are on a peninsula. Have not heard about a report, but would be interesting to learn more. The plane came to a halt on top of the runway number 22. One or more days later it was turned 180 and took off from almost the same spot.

In the Southwest case a senator wrote an inquiring letter about it to Mr Huerta of the FAA. So there should be more information about it for those interested.

[Heathrow Harry]

(from Flying Mag)

Cause of C-17 Landing at Too-Small Airport Revealed

Air Force reveals the reasons behind the incident.

By Pia Bergqvist (http://www.flyingmag.com/authors/pia-bergqvist) Posted January 25, 2013

http://www.flyingmag.com/sites/flyingmag.com/files/styles/small_1x_/public/import/2013/sites/all/files/_images/201301/C-17.jpg?itok=IsUIwrnc (http://www.flyingmag.com/news/cause-c-17-landing-too-small-airport-revealed) C-17

** Photo by Bill Thornton**



The Air Force has concluded its investigation into an incident last July when a C-17 Globemaster III landed at the wrong airport (http://www.flyingmag.com/pilots-places/pilots-adventures-more/video-c-17-accidentally-lands-small-ga-airport). And the reasons for the mistake, according to a report that resulted from the Air Force investigation and published by the Tampa Bay Tribune, went beyond simple human error.
Rather than touching down at its intended destination — the MacDill Air Force Base (KMCF) in Tampa, Florida — the large cargo airplane landed at the Peter O Knight (KTPF) general aviation airport. KTPF is located about five miles northeast of KMCF on a similar albeit significantly smaller peninsula. The runway heading would have indicated to the pilots that they were approaching the right airport as both airports have the same Runway 4-22. However, it is surprising that the pilots of the heavy jet didn’t notice the difference in the runway lengths. KTPF’s runway is only about one third of the length of MacDill’s.
The report showed no record of who was in charge of the airplane, nor does it indicate whether any disciplinary action was taken against the crew, which was a part of the 305th Air Mobility Wing based in New Jersey. It does, however, state that in the days prior to the incident the crew “flew into complex airfields, dealt with multiple mission changes and flew long mission legs with several stops each day.”
The mission for the botched flight, which originated in Rome, had been changed several times before the final assignment of MacDill came about one hour before the Globemaster departed on July 20. Several factors, including previous time zone changes, contributed to the pilot and copilot not operating at full mental capacity. The report stated that the pilot was acting at a 79 percent cognitive effectiveness and the copilot 89 percent. In comparison, a 0.08 percent blood alcohol level reduces the cognitive capacity to 70 percent.
A third crewmember, also a Globemaster pilot, assisted during the mid-air refueling -- a requirement for the flight that lasted nearly 12 hours. It appears that the three crewmembers were the only people onboard the C-17 capable of flying the airplane. Fortunately the long flight ended in a safe landing at the 3,500-foot runway at KTPF, where the copilot was forced to apply “maximum effort braking” to get the airplane stopped in time. The final, short leg of the transoceanic flight was completed later the same day.

[phiggsbroadband]

The reason for the disciplinary action, would not be for the navigational error, but the fact that they must have landed without a Landing Clearance.
This flight could have also been in conflict with the circuit traffic at the wrong airfield. We don't know the full safety implications yet.

[Hotel Tango]

The reason for the disciplinary action, would not be for the navigational error, but the fact that they must have landed without a Landing Clearance.

They didn't knowingly land without clearance. They most likely did have a landing clearance from the TWR of the airport they thought they were landing at.

[Airbubba]

A colleague from the C-17 Air Force Reserve community says a senior Marine General onboard the plane went to bat for the crew at the hearing and they did not have to fall on their swords for the mistake:

But in an e-mail to the Tribune on Tuesday, the head of U.S. Central Command at MacDill, Marine Gen. James Mattis, acknowledged he was on the plane. Mattis, whose responsibilities include running the war in Afghanistan, also said he sought leniency for the crew. "It was just human error," Mattis wrote. "I've made a lot of mistakes in my time, and some were real doozies (worse than landing at the wrong airstrip). The Marine Corps kept their sense of humor throughout my checkered career and allowed me to move onward and upward."

More information including details of the timeline leading up to the C-17 wrong runway landing here:

Air Force blames wrong airport landing on fatigue, human error | TBO.com and The Tampa Tribune (http://www.tbo.com/list/military-news/air-force-blames-wrong-airport-landing-on-fatigue-human-error-614036)

[fisher22]

The flight was operated by Aerolitoral dba Aeromexico Connect, a wholly owned subsidiary.

Don't expect any actions taken against the pilots, just to give you an example back in 2000 a mainline DC-9 touched down halfway down the runway on a rainy day in Reynosa, the plane went off the runway killing 4 people, and three years later another DC-9 flown by the SAME captain had another runway excursion during landing, this time in Monterrey, luckily with no casualties.

That's how things go down in good ole' Mexico :bored:

[Heathrow Harry]

I seem to remember Nigerian Airways running three F-27's off the end of Enugu runway in a week - two on the same day IIRC............... usual - thunderstorms, wind shear, poor visibility, idiot pilots..................

[ZOOKER]

One which is missing from the list posted by Airbubba is a South American-registered Viscount, which landed at Wymeswold instead of East Midlands, mid-1970s i think. I'm not sure, but that may have happened more than once.
Before EGCC was considerably expanded, we had several 'incidents' with folks positioning to EGCD, and a couple of chaps in a B737 had a go at Stretton
On a smaller-scale, the late Keith Emerson landed a Cherokee? at Odiham instead of Blackbushe while doing his PPL. It's in his autobiography, 'Pictures Of An Exhibitionist'.

[RAT 5]

Don't forget the LoCo a/c that landed at Gerona thinking it was Barcelona, or Weeze thinking it was Dusseldorf. It could happen to anyone.

[Airbubba]

Decades ago in the U.S. Navy if you landed on the wrong carrier you would get a great graffiti makeover on your plane:

http://www.navsource.org/archives/02/cv-32/c01b.jpg

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/35/F2H-2_of_VF-62_on_USS_Wasp_%28CV-18%29_1952.jpg

http://www.usscoralsea.net/images/cva431956randolph1.jpg

https://tacairnet.com/2014/01/09/wrong-ship-sherlock/

I believe the U.S. Air Force used to 'zap' squadron decals in the past to mark their territory.

If you did any of these pranks today someone would find a way to take offense and heads would roll. Not that there is anything wrong with that etc., etc., etc...

[DirtyProp]

Holy crap!
Love the writing "Must be Air Force"! They certainly knew how to embarrass the poor sod...

[Airbubba]

Love the writing "Must be Air Force"! They certainly knew how to embarrass the poor sod...

And the phrase was very much an insult to a Naval Aviator I must add. ;)

But the point is that in the past, an honest landing mistake was often punished somewhat informally and with a sense of humor.

[Aluminium shuffler]

Those Navy photos are great. And at least they have the excuse that their runways all look the same and move about.