Shobdon light aircraft down.

[G-CPTN]

BBC report a light aircraft has crashed near Shobdon airfield.

[G-CPTN]

Microlight Aircraft Crashes In Herefordshire Killing Two Men | UK News | Sky News (http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/Microlight-Aircraft-Crashes-In-Herefordshire-Killing-Two-Men/Article/200904115255895?f=rss)

[DX Wombat]

I fly from Shobdon but am at home at the moment. I do not mean this to sound selfish as it is dreadful for the families of the deceased, but I really hope they aren't two of the people I know .

[liam548]

Really not been a good year so far for aviation has it! :(

[Lightning6]

BBC link here (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/hereford/worcs/7983935.stm)

[englishal]

Really not been a good year so far for aviation has it!
People say that every year, and at the end of every year it turns out to be no worse than the year before.

[liam548]

People say that every year, and at the end of every year it turns out to be no worse than the year before.

Good point.

[Mariner9]

Terrible news. DX- if it helps, I understand the a/c and pilots involved were not based at Shobdon, but can't elaborate at this stage.

[GOLF_BRAVO_ZULU]

An interesting paradox; the "picture" isn't narrowed down to save the worries of nearest and dearest while the rest of us, with just the "big picture", worry like buggery!

[BoeingMEL]

If anyone has information about the aircraft type Iwould be most grateful to know. Many thanks, bm

[DX Wombat]

Thank you very much Mariner that's all the information I need and it does help.* Still dreadful for the families involved.
*It was a year to the day that Gary Key, whom I knew from my days as a student at HGFC, flew into Cairn Gorm - the memory of discovering that bit of information is still fresh in my mind.

[Rod1]

I too would be very interested in the aircraft type (PM would be fine).

Thanks,
Rod1

[wsmempson]

A bit more here

BBC NEWS | England | Hereford/Worcs | Two killed in microlight crash (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/hereford/worcs/7983935.stm)

Says they came from Gloucestershire.

[BoeingMEL]

...according to BBC news 7th April. Tragedy. bm

[poetpilot]

Names now released on BBC.

Mark and Rex were well-known to me, and Mark in particular introduced me to the local flying crowd at Eastbach Spence when we moved to Gloucestershire 2 years back. Great guys, good pilots both and meticulous and careful in their approach to flying. I still can't believe that we've lost them.

RIP

[chessman]

Aircraft type was an Escapade Jabiru

[Pull what]

DX- There was a FISO on duty at the time of this accident according to the AAIB report.

http://www.aaib.gov.uk/cms_resources.cfm?file=/Escapade%20912%281%29,%20G-CDLE%2001-10.pdf

I always thought FISO were supposed to keep a lookout for traffic within the ATZ, it seems a tower visitor was more vigilant in this case

[Mariner9]

I take issue with this part of the report:

Since this type of geared engine will not continue rotating if power is lost (ie loss of fuel supply or ignition function will cause the unit to cease rotating whilst the aircraft is at any normal flight speed)

That is certainly not the case with my 912ULS powered Pioneer. It windmills readily and requires me to slow to about 40 kts to get it to stop when I'm doing realistic (engine-off) PFL's.

[Pull what]

You actually shut the engine down for a PFL?

[Dont Hang Up]

I always thought FISO were supposed to keep a lookout for traffic within the ATZ, it seems a tower visitor was more vigilant in this case


Unfair I think. We have no idea what the FISO workload may have been with radio and other traffic. An aircraft that should have been well above circuit height until crossing the runway centreline would not normally be a a candidate for close observation (the tower at Shobdon is always dead-side and not best positioned for such observation anyway).

[Mariner9]

You actually shut the engine down for a PFL?

Yep. Quite a difference to the a/c glide between idle power, no power windmilling, and no power prop stopped.

[Pull what]

Ok-but dont think it has a bearing on the accident

[Pull what]

True but a vistiting aircraft needs more observation & care than a locally based aircraft, especiually where a non standard procedure exists, as this accident proves. Accidents are usually the results of error chains despite people not being able to understand that chain. Admitting the existence of the chain rather than a single cause can improve aviatiion safety. This is not the first time this type of accident has occured in a circuit (Hamble early 70s) without ATC.

An aircraft had just taken off at Shobdon with another joining surely this warrants some special visual attention from those charged with the safety of the ATZ traffic

[Whopity]

I always thought FISO were supposed to keep a lookout for traffic within the ATZ,2 Responsibility of FISO
2.1 The FISO has the following specific responsibilities:
a) issuing information to aircraft flying in the aerodrome traffic zone to assist the
pilots in preventing collisions;
b) issuing instructions and information to aircraft on the manoeuvring area to assist
pilots in preventing collisions between aircraft and vehicles and obstructions on
the manoeuvring area or between aircraft moving on the apron.
c) issuing instructions to vehicles and persons on the manoeuvring area;
d) alerting the safety services;
e) initiating overdue action;
f) informing aircraft of any items of essential aerodrome information.Even if a FISO was to keep a lookout for traffic CAP 410 states:However, with the exception of issuing instructions to aircraft on the ground under the
conditions described above, FISOs must not issue instructions of their own volition
or exercise any form of control over aircraft. It should be noted that neither the
aerodrome authority nor the FISO can prohibit an aircraft from entering the aerodrome
traffic zone.

[Pull what]

No point in having windows in a tower then!

[dont overfil]

AGCS radio (I know it is not quite the same), according to CAP413 Chapter 5.2.3 does not need a view of the airfield as all traffic information passed is based on position reports from other aircraft.

However if said operator does have a view of the airfield and he does see an impending incident he would act under his duty of care.

Having the benefit of windows does show up the limitations of the usefulness of the minimum standards required of an AGCS or FISO at airfields.

D.O.