East Herts Flying School FIC

[buzzc152]

Does any one have any info/views/opinions on East Herts' FIC course ?

I see in the back of one of the flying mags they are advertising for FIC wannabes to go on their course and get a 12 month job with them in to the bargain. What do you think ? At £4999 it seems a good deal cheaper than most other places.

Buzz

[GusHoneybun]

I suggest that you do a search on this forum for a lowdown on what the instructors thinks of this school. And although the FIC seems cheap, if you end up working at that school, then you may end up forking out for a psychometric test, plus a check out in all the different aircraft varients at your own expense. Soon all adds up.

Out of curiousity, who did they get in the end as an FI Instructor?

[Crosswind Limits]

I know of someone who looked into taking an instructor job at Panshanger quite recently but as I haven't seen him in over 2 months I don't know whether he took the position or not. The place certainly isn't everyone's cup of tea!

[wobblyprop]

buzzc152,

There was talk of an FI course there some years ago. EHFS can only be described as something to miss. The course might be ok (hope the owner isn't teaching it). I wouldn't want to work there.

I don't know exactly where you live but Andrews Field do a cracking course. Similar price, too.

[EL SID]

As far as I know EHFS are not approved to do FI(R) courses, neither is the owner/CFI approved to run them.
Trade descriptions may be invoked here if they are advertising things that they cannot provide.
As to the contractual side of working there, I understand no one stays for very long so it may be someway of keeping otherwise very reluctant employees to stay. Someone once mentioned they would rather work for the Muhadjadin on a previous post.
Caveat Emptor and all that anyway!

[unfazed]

I can definitely give facts and opinions about this operation as I checked them out and experienced first hand what a thoroughly unprofessional and unpleasant outfit they are......aircraft are naff, owner is egotistical nutcase who treats people like dirt, high turnover of staff, rip off! rip off! rip off! - instructors are treated with disdain and tasks include cleaning the tables etc when not flying, oh did I mention processing all of the usual admin tasks as well. Pressure to operate in poor weather etc etc etc - If you learn here you might think that all of the this is the norm - Believe me it isn't ! There are plenty of professional outfits out there who will train you to professional standards.

[Crosswind Limits]

I know of a guy who fairly recently started working there as a full-time FI. I hear he's still there so perhaps things have improved a little! Didn't realise they could run a FIC though!!

[EL SID]

unfazed is right - leopard doesn't change etc. Crosswind limits your friend is probably some sort of masochist as I hear nothings changed. Yes they do have FIC approval!!! Personally I'd not send my worst enemy there, but on second thoughts I've just realised he's already there!

[HappyTrails]

Maybe you should take another look, EHFS is very professional with the usual fleet of PA-28's, in addition it has added a decent cafe and pleasant surroundings in the shape of a large fish pond.
During the winter they have a blazing log fire which is most welcome if you arrive at 10:00 on an icy Saturday morning.
Leopards may not change their spots but humans are rather more genetically advanced (well most of them anyway!).

[Send Clowns]

I know of someone who looked into taking an instructor job at Panshanger quite recently but I haven't seen him in over 2 months ...Sounds like the start of a Dracula movie ...

[porridge]

Bird flu is about, but that is nothing compared with the lunatic at at EHFS.
Leopards can, but bananas can't.
After him I have some sympathy with Hamas! Not much, but some!

[unfazed]

I heard recently that the name had changed to North London Flying Club ? Now why would you change your operating company name ? Possible reasons might include - terrible reputation, need to dissolve due to financial reasons, avoiding litigation from disgruntled staff, customers or tax man ?

If you wan't to give £5k to an organisation like this ask yourself why ? ???

Why not invest the money in an organisation that will give you the training and career start that you need to get a decent job. Remember that you are investing in yourself and you should demand the very highest standards of training. Also there are many jobs out there at the moment for FI's as many are gaining those long awaited airline jobs and moving on. Do not be swayed by dubious sponsorships or "guaranteed" jobs where you have to pay money to bankroll a dodgy outfit.

;)

[LEVC]

Happy trails, you seem to know the place very well, can you tell me something else about the place?

[porridge]

Yes it's changed it's name to North London Flying Club see: http://www.northlondonflyingschool.com/. Not much on the website except the one page. Name may have changed but I guess it is still the SOS as before.

[Professor Plum]

in addition it has added a decent cafe and pleasant surroundings in the shape of a large fish pond.

GREAT!

Where do I sign up?!

[porridge]

Hate to be the spelling police, but there seems to be an unnecessary “l” in “pleasant”.
Didn’t want to be picky, but………….

[sawotanao]

:} £250 for an assessment...the're avin a giraffe!:eek:

[Send Clowns]

From the website:We have been approved, by the UK Civil Aviation Authority, to conduct the training provided by the JAR Professional Pilot Training Package and the Individual JAR Modular Training CoursesDoes anyone know what the "JAR Professional Pilot Training Package" is? I have worked for two different approved FTOs and have never heard of it. According to the CAA list (http://www.caa.co.uk/application.aspx?categoryid=33&pagetype=65&applicationid=11&mode=detail&id=1211) North London Flying School is not approved for any courses, and under the old name of East Herts they are only approved for various flight instructor courses, none of the professional pilot training courses. The list is dated 14 February 2006.

Anyone know what is going on there?

[RVR800]

:cool: The laminate flooring in the canteen is nice.. Whos the cool dude in shades stroking the bell end of that airplane?

Seriously what all this psychological assessment stuff - its seems an unneccessary financial burden at £250.00

[No_Speed_Restriction]

thats because the one conducting the assessment is a good friend of the owner plus keeps his aircraft(s) there.

[redbull21]

The FIC course is run by the CFI, Hiam Merkardo, though I've heard that he seems to be getting bored of this new venture and another older instructor there is being groomed to take over the teaching of FI's.

£4999 may be cheaper than most and you are given a 12 month contract after successfully passing the course and as most intructors are just passing thorugh to build hours before securing an airline job then you can probably make do with low pay and crap conditionc for a year or so.

However, what do you get for your money, well I've spoken to a couple of the instructors there and it would seem that the lastest FIC's going through the course are extremely disgrunteld about how the course is going, or more to the point is not going, one of them has taken nearly 6 months to complete. Of course the weather plays it's part and you can't expect to get much training done over the winter period but from what I've heard the CFI just does it when he feels like it.

There would appear to be no course structure, god knows how they got that past the CAA!! and students spend hours at a time in the class room listening to the CFI go on about psychology and the universe and what is the meaning of life rather than actually being taught to be a professional flight instructor.

One would be instructor has just had to fly the CFI out to Germany as part of his course (for which he is paying) in one aircraft and then fly himself back so the CFI could pick up his extra 300 and bring it back having being serviced. I imagine that must have eaten about 5 hours of the student FI's course time and what did he learn??? how to fly and patter straight and level for 5 hours.

It would appear that the instructors think the CFI is taking the p**s with FIC courses.

Having said that, I have met a number of their instructors and they all seem to be a good bunch and I've had no issues with my training but the school is not for everyone. I have been considering doing an FIC course but having listened to some of the comments made by the present instructors and seen some of the things going on I wouldn't be in a rush to do it at panshager, I will take my business elsewhere and get my FIC done properly when the time comes.

[146fixer]

For what its worth I finished my PPL at Panshanger and all though the instructors were great the owner wasnt.I will never set foot on the airfield while that man runs it.

[No_Speed_Restriction]

when did you finish your ppl?

[porridge]

146fixer - regretfully you will never set foot on the the airfield again, as when he goes, so does the airfield - into a housing estate. Anyway goes for me too unless it's to see the first sod of the new estate being turned!
redbull21 - check your PM's please

[146fixer]

No_Speed_Restriction,I finished my PPL in 2001 and porridge I think you could be right.Shame nice little airfield.

[No_Speed_Restriction]

then i probably know you as i used to instruct there until Dec 2000.

[edd2000uk]

In response to some of the previous threads, I would like to give a different perspective on the FIC course. As one of the last students through the FIC course I've found it very beneficial and the CFI has done a good job with me, especially considering I had a break from flying in the year preceding the course. I'd also like to say that anyone who has spoken to me about the course knows that I have not been "disgruntled" at any stage, as has been suggested by a previous poster. From what I gather the other recent students are happy with things also. I found that the course was just right for my needs and was tailored around me leading to a pass of my FIC test (I happen to know that this is not the case at some other more well known schools, one of which I have had previous training with).
One last point, prior to signing up for the FIC course, I looked at several other places and none could give any positive indication of a job at the end.

[unfazed]

edd200uk

Is your other name Hiam ? If you are a real newly minted FI who has been through the indoct..... sorry !, I mean training at Panshanger , well done for completing and the best of British luck to you. Hopefully someday soon you will fly something airworthy !;)
I would like to say that there is a normal human tendency to think that the place where you trained and the person who trained you are the bees knees so I am not surprised to hear that you support the school (very loyal).

What I am interested to know is what you are going to do with all of those extra skills that you must have picked up such as cleaning the floor, wiping the tables, driving the rundown relic of a fire truck, etc etc etc

If tou can put up with the biggest ego and most opinionated person I have ever met then you cannot be "banannas"

[redbull21]

Well done on passing your FIC course and I'm glad you found the course to be good and tailored around your needs, however this forum is about letting others know about facts and experiences of establishments, people, types of training etc so that they are armed with some knowledge before making important decisions about thier training and spending thier hard earned money.

Although you seem to be happy with the service provided by EHFS in terms of the FIC course for which you paid £4999, you fail to mention the additional amounts you've paid before starting your FIC course, so to be fair to those considering where to do such a course do you not think it fair to let them know how many more hours you did (at whose suggestion) before you started the FIC course and therefore the total amount paid to EHFS for the FIC pass!

Good luck with your instructor job.

By the way you're not really expecting me to believe that the student instructor who flew the CFI out to Germany to collect his Extra 300 was not disgruntled are you !!!

[porridge]

Unfazed - you missed out cleaning the toilets, chopping firewood, burning the rubbish and toxic waste, doing the 'Z', gardening, running errands and fetching the Cmdt a chicken, cleaning the fish pond out and many other wonderful skills.
edd2000uk as regards a 'job' at the end of the course you couldn't have looked too far as quite a few FIC schools will offer you a job at the end of the course these days. As regards 'job' the form of job we are used to at said establishment was abolished in the British Empire in 1833 mainly thanks to one William Wilberforce.

[No_Speed_Restriction]

i will say one thing, when i was an instructor at panshanger, i managed to rack up alot of hours quickly.

[IMC007]

I would certainly agree with No Speed restriction regarding clocking up hours at Panshangar, when I taught there I knocked up a little over 700 hours in 11 months.

I too did the FIC course there and although I passed it's not what I expected and I have told the CFI that at the time. As for the other stuff about additional duties, all true I speak from experience.

Edd2000uk, I felt the same when I had passed my FI test, felt over the moon and didn't think the school was too bad however months of 'Hiamenation' can grind anyone down and although the school is good in terms of location, students, instructors and not forgetting the engineering guys, the set up is let down by one individual!

I am now instructing at another school and I tell you what, I am spoilt rotton, at least I feel like that and it's not until you go somewhere else that you can make a comparison. At this other school everything is done for the instructors including fueling, tie down and even lunch provided, a million miles away from what Panshagar was.

To be fair though my time at Panshagar served it's purpose, great deal of hours in little time.

If I was asked by a prospective FI student whether they should undertake an FIC course at Panshangar, I would say No, go do it somewhere professional even if it costs a few quid more and then come back and apply for a job at Panshangar as the hours are great.

[No_Speed_Restriction]

i worked solid and clocked up over 1200 hours in 18 months.as for chopping the logs, i always found an excuse to get out of it.

[unfazed]

Advice for potential FI's on the subject of hour building

Quality is important, not just the quantity !

Sounds like some real world views are being passed along here so please check out the other options available before parting with hard earned cash !:ok: