Skybus Airlines...Columbus,OH
 

:mad:Finally the pilots are waking up:D. Leaving that rat hole:eek: fasssssst. Skybus is a managment scam to fill their pockets with millions:=. Its a small industry..they will get whats coming to them.

Care to elaborate?

Numbers...
 

Six Capt gone from the start of this rat hole airline:eek:....5 more headed fareast:ok:...Cant get enough people to interview..looking at turboprop guys now...WOW...Nice...Take that to your investors Bill. That company is a sinking ship from the start. Use their :mad: asses for free A320 TYPE yal....I :)did....hehehehe

Albotross

you werent very smart to begin with by going there. but hey at least you got a free type. good luck getting a respectable job, now that you have sh!tbus on your resume

Yes you're right...
 

I already got a another job..thanks for your well wishes buddy.

Just MHO, but the best thing they could do for the industry as a whole is go out of business.

Skybus
 

Is there a reason that you are so mad? Is it at the pilots or Management?

Do you think that they will unionize because of the working conditions?

UNION
 

UNION...UNION...UNION...Every pilot & flight attendant knowns thats the ONLY way to stop all this madness thats is going on at that company. They have all the characteristics of a dog, except LOYALTY.....when you have a dog that isn't loyal..you put a leash on it.

Even a union wont make a silk purse out of a sow's ear:yuk:

Skybus...
 

What do you think? Smoke out some of those scabs out....yes.

Skybus...
 

Got the goods from APC.com on the pay and such, but I'm interested in hearing from anyone flying there as to how they like it? How is the relationship of the pilots with the management? Is the operation coming together?

Any insight is appreciated.

Skybus Airlines
 

I'll give you some sound advice on Skybus Airlines. You can take everything that Albotross says with the bitter grain of salt that he is still sucking on:=. He has left and yet still has Skybus on his sholder.....that sadly happens to all of us when we leave Bitter and with resentment. Skybus is not for everyone....that is for sure.

I can tell you that since I've worked here (Skybus), our relationship with Management is like a relationship with a red-headed stepchild. You know some day you will have to spank them....and you know that you will probably enjoy it. They change work rules to suit them, lied about our pay (only for the first 60 pilots, the rest they told the truth to....sorta), and continue to avert any of our concerns that will cost them $$. Sounds like a normal airline doesnt it? A Union probably will get voted in if the pay does not increase......no sooner than when we go public.

Bottom line. Most of us here came because of the hope of sucess. This model is a hybred of SWA and Ryanair in Europe....with the stock, there is is small chance that we can have good retirememnts; ask yourself if your A fund will be around in 15 years non the less 25?

Aviaition is nothing like it use to be...the pay, retirement, work rules and TAFB suck! At Skybus I am home every night....what is that worth if you have young kids? You might not like it here, you can take your Type and leave....as some do. For now, I get to do what I love to do and be home as well.

Average CPT are making $65K-$78K dependant on how much you want to work. I've seen $90K advertised as average pay...that is a flat out lie! Some Check airmen and people that work in the office are making that but they are few. The regular Joe is as stated $65 for sitting on your a%% AND $78 for the regular line pilot that want to make extra.

Average F/O is making 30K-40K and that is a fact as well.




Got to run.....have lots more for later.

Hope this helps.:ugh:

As they are using the point to point model, is Columbus (let alone Chatanooga) big enough to support their operation?

Every flight I've seen has been either full or almost full. I'm in class now and so far all I have to say is "so far, so good"

The pay thing will get sorted out over the short run by the free market I'm sure..

skybus
 

Yes, Skybus's operation is big enough. To understand what is going on here. Go and look at the Ryanair model and you will have a good understanding of what Skybus is doing. Our loads factors are on average 80% or more.

Chatanooga is not a pilot base GSO is. As far as if it will be one.....who knows. New destinations are comming.

We will get 1 new 319 every month for 60 months starting Jan. 09; you dont do things like this, or get the financing, unless you have a plan and the investors know it will make them money!

You can know that we will start some routes and they will not work.....then again some will.

""""""The pay thing will get sorted out over the short run by the free market I'm sure..""""""""""

Either us going public or the union will. Sadly this is what every airline has problems doing........treating and paying there employees properly. You will see once you get off OE and get a feel of what's going on here.

Sorry, meant Greensboro not Chatanooga.

I am very familiar with the Ryanain model as well as the original Southwest, the precursor PSA model, the jetBlue model and even the updated Southwest model.

They are all dependent on O&D traffic as well as an interest for the passengers to want to travel from point A and point B.

Southwest suceeded initialy suceeded by linking major metropolitan areas with inner city airports. The got past that mode with the momentum and size that they gained. Half of their business now is probably connecting.

Ryanair links tourist destinations that are a bus ride away. Their business model and website are point to point oriented. That appears to be the case for skybus.

As I doubt that most Americans would want to take a bus for 50 miles or rent a car for that distance, I cannot not see how the Columbusites (or whatever they call themselves) will be able to keep all the flights full, and the Ryanair business model is highly dependent of extremely high load factors.

This seems like WP all over again.

Desert Diner


Think about this: KCMH-KBLI (for example).

Large metro areas surrounding...SEA, PAE to the south and CVIC to the North. All withing decent driving distances.

Skybus tickets are from $10 to the average (I think $80). That is 40% cheaper than any other airline. AND some of our fares are 60-80% cheaper.

SO...you have a family of 4 (wife, husband and 2 kids):

80+40%=$112 on other carriers vs. $80/person on Skybus

112*4=448 (and I've seen more expensive tickets elseware)
80*4=320

I've personally talked to paX that have saved $1200 on tickets by flying on us.

you have to rent a car anyway when you travel dont you?
no connections at a hub.
Your luggage doesnt get lost
parking fees are cheaper at smaller airports
security lines are shorter and easy to get through
you dont have to be at the airport 4 hour prior to your flight..
Less stress on you and your family
NO FLOW or ground stop.
little to No holding
Direct routiing

Most say'd SWA wasnt going to make it....look at them now.


Do you get it?

I can only say what I see.........80-95% full airplanes (every day)....new destinations...new pilot bases.....airports paying Skybus to come and operate at their airport (when has that ever happened)....60 new 319 comming (firm)....growth that no airline in the US has ever had (including SWA).....


It's not for everyone but I can honestly tell you that it is working and we are selling tickets (90,000 in the first 24 hours of our operations). Something is happening.......who knows if it will last?????????????

Now to get the Pilot pay fixed!

Respectfully written.

This is the problem. I wish you all luck.

One thing though: What are your RASM/CASM figures like? After all, its not the full planes that keep you going but a positive RASM-CASM.

Thanks, for a respectful post. I'll post better numbers when I get them. Our CMH-BLI service is being canceled on Jan 5th because they've decided that they can use the AC better in another area. I've heard talk about seasonal service to BLI when we get more AC.

That is a number that is not release to us RAS/CASM, they tell us that it is lower than anyone else by a significant amount...

I simply cannot understand how anyone is applying at that place. To go fly a Bus for less than what a CRJ captain makes at MESA, Is a lack of respect to yourself and the profession:yuk:

Dont lie
 

The Dom,

Would you go and fly for SWA if they called you for a pilot position?

A quick check on the Skybus site shows CMH-BUR(LA) as $100 which translates to a RPM of $0.05/mile or 0.045 with an 80% load. Granted, they try to sell $390 fares. Even if they can manage to get their average fare at $200 this would still be $0.09/mile. The low costs were having a tough time keeping their CASM below that when oil was selling below $50.

Sounds like you have a good idea of what other airlines are doing. However, Skybus's model is not anything like other carriers.........they are an ULCC ( Ultra Low Cost Carrier). Their business foundation is designed for just that. All the other airlines, with the exception of SWA (and even that is taking a turn), must keep high prices to support their business model and foundation; there is no way to change ultimately to a different structure.

Skybus outsources EVERYTHING....ramp, maint, ticketing, fueling (OBV), has no call center (really), everything is done on line. In addition to that, Skybus has a "fixed" cost structure (excluding fuel) for the next 11 years and has the lowest employee/Aircraft ration in the business.....smart. Trust me when I say that the CAS/RAS is lower than you state.

Although I do not agree with all of Skybus's practices, I must say it has to be the smartest airline I've ever worked for when it comes to pinching a penny. Unfortunately, this is also at the cost of its employees; pilots mainly......for now.

Enough of that. We'll see how the rest of year 1 goes here; in the mean time, I'll repair myself financially so I can leave if things go south....ie our pay doesn't increase soon! Or if the IBT makes it in....I'll stay and stick it to them!!

Well if they have a fixed cost for the next 11 yrs how do you expect to get a pay raise?

Or if you get a payraise how valid is the claim for an 11 yr 'fixed' cost window?

Yhbfsm
 

Are you comparing the beginnings of SWA with that joke of a company? Your facts are twisted but if that makes you feel better

how old are you!
 

Few posts like yours warrent comments.....your isn't one of them. If you ever want to have an adult conversation about this airline (without childish jabbs and jaded ignorant comments), I'd be more than happy.

I wish you luck where ever you are...EOC

Good Question!

There is not doubt that we need and are pushing for pay raises...as for as that effecting the fixed costs.....too bad for them!

Giving us more money will not hurt them...it will help them. Some get the type rating and leave, this costs Skybus money in the long run.

I know The Dominican personally. There's plenty wrong with him, but he's not childish. Also, I have a feeling he's doing just peachy where he is.

If you say he has problems, so be it...I do not care. What I do care about, and feel is childish, is namecalling. If you think that this is a mature way to have a conversation, then so be that as well; I do not agree with you.

I do know that there are reasons for everyones actions ie. why people accept jobs that other's feel are unacceptable. Maturity always seems to hone the skill of understanding...for some at least. The Don the disrespectful, deficient of maturity in my opinion with his comments.....

I know a guy that got alot of crap for crossing a picket line........most people do not understand that this was approved by ALPA so he could keep his son in KEMO; a dam goood reason as far as I'm concerned!......Dom seems to be the type to shoot first then educate himself later. Even I have a good reason for accepting a crappy paying job at Skybus even amit strong opposition from guys like your friend.....and many others. SWA guys started the same way, 40% less pay than everyone else, they got crap too (I remember) and look at them now.

I suggest that people ask questions before they judge, and use this board in a respectful way.

Some will, some won't, it's just my 2 Cents.

Respectfully written.

Year 2 at American $151 for the 737
continental $153
Delta $140
United $121
USAir$123

These are current salary rates after the cuts from the bankruptcies and I don't have to explain that the salary rates back in 1978-79 compared to now (adjusted for inflation) where 40% higher, right? But for the sake of argument I'll play along with your theory, the pay rates at SWA where about 30% lower that what the average was back in those days (not 40%) and we already know that the average salaries where A LOT higher than they are now.
Your logic is flawed and I'm sorry to say that in my view, this is no excuse to redefine the bottom. You didn't accept 30% lower than the average stated above, you accepted what is paid at MESA to fly CRJ's:=

$123- $39 =$84 THIS IS STILL $20 DOLLARS AN HOUR MORE THAN WHAT YOU ACCEPTED

Shameful is what that is, I'm done with this thread.

They plan to cut a few more west coast cities according to The Columbus Dispatch today.

Dom,

I get this feeling that you are 21 years old...and I mean this; not as an insult but as an observation and conclusion of your posts.

The numbers are correct, but the human factors involved with taking any job is still going way over your head. You may not agree with Skybus or its pilots but thats not for you to decide; your understanding is narrow and your experience in this industry shows.

Respectfully written.

EOM

In the past downturn of the industry that took Eastern, Panam, Brannif. I went from a 727 to a cessna 402 and I was one of the lucky ones, thousands of pilots on the street. There are many factors that influence an individual to have to take a job that they don't really want, but the conditions of the market place now are not the conditions then. If Skybus would have not gotten any takers at that salary rate, would they have folded the tents and not go along with starting the airline? I don't think so. If pilots don't demmand a decent wage when the industry is on an upswing, when will they? That is the fact that still going over yours. I just don't see the need for redefining a new low at this time and I wish you luck in trying to fix that because it affects ALL pilots, not just you guys.

We are in the process of turning IBT cards in. There are more and more each month. If our management continues to ignore our requests for more pay, then I have NO DOUBT that we will be unionized by the end of "08".

Until then they are a great place to come and get a 320 type and split...some have....and there are more to come.

EOM

Way off, I mean, waaaaaay off.

Absolutely, Dom.

Skybus pilots should be ashamed of themselves. Flying an A320 for RJ wages drags down the pay standard for EVERY other narrow body pilot in the U.S.

Personally, I will not allow a non-Union pilot who undercuts my pay/benefits jumpseat privileges.

Mr. Owl,

In order to be considered as a “comparable airline” and hence change the pay for other airlines “during arbitration”, you must have a “certain percentage” of flights that overly “that certain airline” routs. Don’t know if you bothered to check this out before posting but considering this fact, no commuter or other airline will be effected by our crappy pay.

Or did you just post your comment out of complete ignorance.............


As far as your jumpseat, I am home with my family every night and you are not. At some point I will accept lower pay in trade that my family and I can spent every night together. What is "your" family worth or better yet, what have you sold your family for.......and you are still there arent you?


I do not jumpseat....and when I do, I will use the ones that we have agreements on (about 20 I believe) and probably not a commuter as they are hiring less qualified pilots now; some 500 hours! That is scarry and I avoid them out of safety concerns.

I can plainly see that all of you are just pissed and must resort to childish comments; I will not go there again....read my previous posts.

Respectfully Written but grow up.

And you think it's bad in the Middle East:rolleyes: