Climb via the SID...
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
From: North America
Climb via the SID...
A recent scenario: on the ground in LAX we were given the LADYJ SID (that has a top altitude of 8000’) with the amended stipulation “climb via the SID except maintain 5000’”. No problem.
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 481
Likes: 58
From: USA
A recent scenario: on the ground in LAX we were given the LADYJ SID (that has a top altitude of 8000’) with the amended stipulation “climb via the SID except maintain 5000’”. No problem.
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
sure you weren’t given higher somewhere else along the way? I would’ve done the same thing at 5000’ if I hadn’t been told otherwise.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
From: North America
No clearance for higher was specifically given. It was implied that Climb Via meant the 5000 was no longer valid and we should go to 8000 with no further explanation necessary. That’s how it is on Descend Via on a STAR, so it makes sense, but somehow the stakes felt higher with crossing traffic above!
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 88
Likes: 12
From: usa
A recent scenario: on the ground in LAX we were given the LADYJ SID (that has a top altitude of 8000’) with the amended stipulation “climb via the SID except maintain 5000’”. No problem.
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
at the big airports worldwide..If in doubt, ask..
Fly safe,
B-757
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
From: USA
A recent scenario: on the ground in LAX we were given the LADYJ SID (that has a top altitude of 8000’) with the amended stipulation “climb via the SID except maintain 5000’”. No problem.
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
Also at LAX, watch out for many SIDs that have a speed restriction "maintain 250 knots until advised by ATC." No shortage of ASAP reports with crews accelerating above 250 knots passing 10k, only to be yelled at by controllers.
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 286
Likes: 10
From: Europe
A recent scenario: on the ground in LAX we were given the LADYJ SID (that has a top altitude of 8000’) with the amended stipulation “climb via the SID except maintain 5000’”. No problem.
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
On departure we were switched to SOCAL departure who acknowledged our check on and said “climb via the SID”. I was expecting to hear an altitude along with the clearance otherwise I assume the 5000’ is still governing...the approaching mountains of Santa Monica were enough to get me to double check however.
The condescending tone of the controller telling to climb to 8000 VIA THE SID gave me the “argh should’ve known that” feeling, but it is still unnerving climbing without a clearly restated altitude when you know you are crossing the arrival paths of heavies on the arrival. I thought the altitude was usually restated in both Climb Via and Climb and Maintain clearances. Guess I learned something. Thoughts?
I usually do the same as you do, I keep asking them(even assuming they ment climb NOW). They are only humans and do many mistakes(as we do but we have the advantage in having a backup on the flightdeck), sometimes they even admit it and say "thanks" if you ask.
