Skybus...

[MIIVJ]

That is a number that is not release to us RAS/CASM, they tell us that it is lower than anyone else by a significant amount...

[The Dominican]

I simply cannot understand how anyone is applying at that place. To go fly a Bus for less than what a CRJ captain makes at MESA, Is a lack of respect to yourself and the profession

[MIIVJ]

Dont lie

The Dom,

Would you go and fly for SWA if they called you for a pilot position?

[Desert Diner]

A quick check on the Skybus site shows CMH-BUR(LA) as $100 which translates to a RPM of $0.05/mile or 0.045 with an 80% load. Granted, they try to sell $390 fares. Even if they can manage to get their average fare at $200 this would still be $0.09/mile. The low costs were having a tough time keeping their CASM below that when oil was selling below $50.

[MIIVJ]

Sounds like you have a good idea of what other airlines are doing. However, Skybus's model is not anything like other carriers.........they are an ULCC ( Ultra Low Cost Carrier). Their business foundation is designed for just that. All the other airlines, with the exception of SWA (and even that is taking a turn), must keep high prices to support their business model and foundation; there is no way to change ultimately to a different structure.

Skybus outsources EVERYTHING....ramp, maint, ticketing, fueling (OBV), has no call center (really), everything is done on line. In addition to that, Skybus has a "fixed" cost structure (excluding fuel) for the next 11 years and has the lowest employee/Aircraft ration in the business.....smart. Trust me when I say that the CAS/RAS is lower than you state.

Although I do not agree with all of Skybus's practices, I must say it has to be the smartest airline I've ever worked for when it comes to pinching a penny. Unfortunately, this is also at the cost of its employees; pilots mainly......for now.

Enough of that. We'll see how the rest of year 1 goes here; in the mean time, I'll repair myself financially so I can leave if things go south....ie our pay doesn't increase soon! Or if the IBT makes it in....I'll stay and stick it to them!!

[misd-agin]

Well if they have a fixed cost for the next 11 yrs how do you expect to get a pay raise?

Or if you get a payraise how valid is the claim for an 11 yr 'fixed' cost window?

[The Dominican]

Yhbfsm

The Dom,

Would you go and fly for SWA if they called you for a pilot position?

Are you comparing the beginnings of SWA with that joke of a company? Your facts are twisted but if that makes you feel better

[MIIVJ]

how old are you!

Few posts like yours warrent comments.....your isn't one of them. If you ever want to have an adult conversation about this airline (without childish jabbs and jaded ignorant comments), I'd be more than happy.

I wish you luck where ever you are...EOC

[MIIVJ]

Good Question!

There is not doubt that we need and are pushing for pay raises...as for as that effecting the fixed costs.....too bad for them!

Giving us more money will not hurt them...it will help them. Some get the type rating and leave, this costs Skybus money in the long run.

[flyboyike]

Originally Posted by MIIVJ

Few posts like yours warrent comments.....your isn't one of them. If you ever want to have an adult conversation about this airline (without childish jabbs and jaded ignorant comments), I'd be more than happy.

I wish you luck where ever you are...EOC

I know The Dominican personally. There's plenty wrong with him, but he's not childish. Also, I have a feeling he's doing just peachy where he is.

[MIIVJ]

If you say he has problems, so be it...I do not care. What I do care about, and feel is childish, is namecalling. If you think that this is a mature way to have a conversation, then so be that as well; I do not agree with you.

I do know that there are reasons for everyones actions ie. why people accept jobs that other's feel are unacceptable. Maturity always seems to hone the skill of understanding...for some at least. The Don the disrespectful, deficient of maturity in my opinion with his comments.....

I know a guy that got alot of crap for crossing a picket line........most people do not understand that this was approved by ALPA so he could keep his son in KEMO; a dam goood reason as far as I'm concerned!......Dom seems to be the type to shoot first then educate himself later. Even I have a good reason for accepting a crappy paying job at Skybus even amit strong opposition from guys like your friend.....and many others. SWA guys started the same way, 40% less pay than everyone else, they got crap too (I remember) and look at them now.

I suggest that people ask questions before they judge, and use this board in a respectful way.

Some will, some won't, it's just my 2 Cents.

Respectfully written.

[The Dominican]

Year 2 at American $151 for the 737
continental $153
Delta $140
United $121
USAir$123

These are current salary rates after the cuts from the bankruptcies and I don't have to explain that the salary rates back in 1978-79 compared to now (adjusted for inflation) where 40% higher, right? But for the sake of argument I'll play along with your theory, the pay rates at SWA where about 30% lower that what the average was back in those days (not 40%) and we already know that the average salaries where A LOT higher than they are now.
Your logic is flawed and I'm sorry to say that in my view, this is no excuse to redefine the bottom. You didn't accept 30% lower than the average stated above, you accepted what is paid at MESA to fly CRJ's

$123- $39 =$84 THIS IS STILL $20 DOLLARS AN HOUR MORE THAN WHAT YOU ACCEPTED

Shameful is what that is, I'm done with this thread.

[rewfly]

They plan to cut a few more west coast cities according to The Columbus Dispatch today.

[MIIVJ]

Dom,

I get this feeling that you are 21 years old...and I mean this; not as an insult but as an observation and conclusion of your posts.

The numbers are correct, but the human factors involved with taking any job is still going way over your head. You may not agree with Skybus or its pilots but thats not for you to decide; your understanding is narrow and your experience in this industry shows.

Respectfully written.

EOM

[The Dominican]

The numbers are correct, but the human factors involved with taking any job are still going over your head

In the past downturn of the industry that took Eastern, Panam, Brannif. I went from a 727 to a cessna 402 and I was one of the lucky ones, thousands of pilots on the street. There are many factors that influence an individual to have to take a job that they don't really want, but the conditions of the market place now are not the conditions then. If Skybus would have not gotten any takers at that salary rate, would they have folded the tents and not go along with starting the airline? I don't think so. If pilots don't demmand a decent wage when the industry is on an upswing, when will they? That is the fact that still going over yours. I just don't see the need for redefining a new low at this time and I wish you luck in trying to fix that because it affects ALL pilots, not just you guys.

[MIIVJ]

We are in the process of turning IBT cards in. There are more and more each month. If our management continues to ignore our requests for more pay, then I have NO DOUBT that we will be unionized by the end of "08".

Until then they are a great place to come and get a 320 type and split...some have....and there are more to come.

EOM

[flyboyike]

Originally Posted by MIIVJ

Dom,

I get this feeling that you are 21 years old...and I mean this; not as an insult but as an observation and conclusion of your posts.

your understanding is narrow and your experience in this industry shows.

Way off, I mean, waaaaaay off.

[White Owl]

Absolutely, Dom.

Skybus pilots should be ashamed of themselves. Flying an A320 for RJ wages drags down the pay standard for EVERY other narrow body pilot in the U.S.

Personally, I will not allow a non-Union pilot who undercuts my pay/benefits jumpseat privileges.

[MIIVJ]

Mr. Owl,

In order to be considered as a “comparable airline” and hence change the pay for other airlines “during arbitration”, you must have a “certain percentage” of flights that overly “that certain airline” routs. Don’t know if you bothered to check this out before posting but considering this fact, no commuter or other airline will be effected by our crappy pay.

Or did you just post your comment out of complete ignorance.............


As far as your jumpseat, I am home with my family every night and you are not. At some point I will accept lower pay in trade that my family and I can spent every night together. What is "your" family worth or better yet, what have you sold your family for.......and you are still there arent you?


I do not jumpseat....and when I do, I will use the ones that we have agreements on (about 20 I believe) and probably not a commuter as they are hiring less qualified pilots now; some 500 hours! That is scarry and I avoid them out of safety concerns.

I can plainly see that all of you are just pissed and must resort to childish comments; I will not go there again....read my previous posts.

Respectfully Written but grow up.

[Desert Diner]

Personally, I will not allow a non-Union pilot who undercuts my pay/benefits jumpseat privileges.

And you think it's bad in the Middle East