I must have come to the wrong thread, I thought this was about the plight of our colleagues in Monarch !

The deadline is today, get back on track.

When I read posts like the very good one posted by enzo999, it makes me absolutely furious when I hear of 'public sector workers' going on strike due to some measly 'grievance' trumped up by some politically inspired union. Not one of those public sector 'workers' face having to uproot their families to some culturally alien corner of the world in order to maintain them. Not one of them will have their wives crying themselves to sleep because of that. And the likes of enzo999 would have been paying an absolute fortune in taxes to maintain that public sector 'worker' in his cushy position.

To add to that there is not as much solidarity amongst pilots as many would like to think: many of those losing their positions and wanting to take up jobs in other UK airlines would face pilots in those airlines looking down on them and saying "We don't care about all your experience and expertise, take your place down there at the bottom of our seniority list and don't you dare think of threatening my cushy position". It is not only the bean-counters and managers that have no regard for experience and expertise, it is often other pilots too.

This is a horrible industry. It has fantastic safety records due to the experience, expertise and hard work of its pilots. But it turns and kicks them in the teeth without a second thought. And its not just the bean-counters and managers often doing the kicking, but also sometimes fellow pilots. I have seen many directly and heard of many, many more situations where pilots have had absolutely appalling disruption to their lives and heartbreak for their families. This is a horrible industry.

It can be absolutely fantastic flying on a lovely day, watching a beautiful sunrise or sunset, but this is countered by those nasty CBs, howling gales and snow-closed or foggy airports; not just in pure flying terms but also in the 'figurative' job security terms with bumpy employment terms, financial bad winds through the industry or closing airlines. This is a horrible industry.

Good luck everyone in Monarch*, and if you end up in a crew-room with me you are welcome, regardless of how much you have on your shoulders (literally and figuratively!).

Scallywag
 

This is the plight of our Monarch colleagues!
If Monarch adopt fully the LCC model then they will have to adopt the techniques employed by EZY and RYR re costs of FO crewing. They will have to compete

If Monarch does not survive they will be on the dole or heading for the Sandpit...if they are lucky.

I hope that things turn out for the better for the people at Monarch; I'm just not sure what that is?

Trossie, what a nice post. Thank you

Semi Skilled or Skilled?
The problem is one of perception. The general public is the 1950's through to the 70's regarded anyone who flew aircraft as a bit special. The golden years of a new and romantic industry in a time when Travel was something special and largely done by only an elite few. From there on we have become regarded as arrogant and overpaid in the 80's and now, finally, as little more than an overpaid train driver. The last, IMHO, is down to the impression that we do little other than stare at the screens and read the newspapers, automation has damaged our reputation by making the mundane part of our life, flying from A to B, appear easy, which it is compared to a pilot of the 1950's. But, on a dark and stormy night, with a failure and little excess fuel we become the highly skilled professionals that the public rarely hear about.( Capt. Sullenberger being the obvious exception) And we are worth a darn sight more than we are paid and deserve a darn sight more respect than our employers regularly show us.
It doesn't matter how OFTEN you have to use this skill, it matters that you have it ready when it is needed.

well the good news is we got paid last night so fingers crossed for later. Must make sure I take my visa with me on my flight today just in case I have to make my own way home :)

Line up ,

I agree with your post & many others on here but we need someone like Balpa to start & help us all out here.


If you look at how much Balpa are getting from pilots annually , it's an astonishing amount of money .


I have been on at my crew council but think we all need to push our own colleagues to get Balpa to talk pan company & do something to provide a framework for looking after our careers.


First Choice a couple of years ago made redundancies & went to great efforts to help the unfortunate few get replacements.


Wouldn't it be great if Balpa could actually DO something on our behalf particularly for those who , like the more senior guys at Monarch have a great deal to loose , if they were interested in helping they could perhaps negotiate with other companies who we know have a requirement for Captains & experience , to prevent these guys loosing everything when there's insufficient time to rebuild a pension fund or re-climb the ladder.


I hope Monarch don't need it but let's get on with it before its too late .

I don't know the answer I'm affraid Line Up but I do think more pressure on the CC to do more for the general pilot workforce would be a good start !

Monarch operating Business as usual tomorrow according to Twitter, so either the sale is completed or the CAA have extended their license. Going to announce the news in a few hours.

I thought an announcement was due by mid-afternoon? As we are now heading for close of play...
Does anybody know anything?

ATOL
 

The CAAs ATOL check function has just been taken off the air for maintenance. Might be an update on its way for COSMOS.....

Meaning the plug has been pulled ?

The route cause lies with EZY and RYR who have ruthlessly driven costs out of the airline model at every level to deliver "cheap" flying for the masses.

If the information is correct SWA have cheap prices and high salaries and happy crews and pax. If they can get it right why can not the copy cats?

I'm not a member of BALPA or IAPLA, but, I read your distrust and lack of expectations here, and quotes of past lackings. I'm curious. BALPA seem to do OK by BA, or am I wrong. How much of the 1% of non-BA airlines go back to helping their causes, and how much goes into the BALPA pot which is directed towards helping internal local BA causes? Surely there must be an audit of BALPA accounts and you will be able to see how much has been spent, and where, and see what return you've had on your investment/membership dues directly with your company. Equally, about 4 years ago there was a massive drive by IALPA to recruit RYR members. They must have had a massive influx of cash, easily over €1m, but what have the members seen for their contribution. Just where does all this dosh go? There seems to be a black hole, considering how the unions have allowed the industry to decline in economic standing for its members. Someone must know.

Have you ever seen the car park at Balpa House ? They don't have the uncertainty of the cut throat commercial World either !!!!

Sold to Greybull Capital

http://www.monarchholdingslimited.co...ybull-capital/

Completion at last!

The Monarch Group - Monarch secures ?125 million of permanent capital and liquidity facilities through sale to Greybull Capital
They better not let all those years of hard work, dedication and professionalism go to waste for the sake of short term gain. Monarch staff past and present have sacrificed SO much for the sake of a continued future. My best wishes go to all concerned.

So Monarch are gomg lo-cost and short haul only ,but Ryanair are thinking about selling holidays and Jet 2 are going into long haul to SFB next year with an A330. Seabury consulting are US based where charter flying does not exist so they come up with a plan for Mon to be a minnow against the lo-co big boys. The family meanwhile have invested £50m which is strangely close to the deposit for the B737 max which Seabury have decided the airline needs even though it is shortly to become a purely Airbus operator.Another part of Seabury helped in the sale of the company.
I wonder if all the ties lead back to Lugano or the Lady Marina?

As an ex Monarch employee I am delighted to hear the news.

I wish everyone at George VI Airlines every possible success.

However, is it realistic that this revamped operation can make money in the shadow of EZY and RYR. without their economies of scale ? whilst being saddled with a massive pensions deficit.

So sorry but if the spotty M is still operating this time next year I will eat my hat.

(PS four of the airlines I have worked for are no longer operating so I DO know how such things effect ever single employee at every level and the heart ache involved )

waco


"whilst being saddled with a massive pensions deficit"



As an ex employee, you obviously weren't in the DB scheme....otherwise you would have read the details of the pension in the email sent a few hours ago.

Suffice to say, Mon will not be saddled with any deficit.........:mad::mad: