PPRuNe Forums - Thomas Cook CCQ 330

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Thomas Cook CCQ 330

Saw the recent ad for 320 to 330 ccq with thomas cook and iago .

How when TC have just laid off 43 pilots and are demoting more can they give sectors to pilots who are paying ?

A 330 rating with no experience is worthless , and there not likely to be offering you a job after training .

Agree with you!
But this is capitalism as we know it.

TR without hours is actually of use for EASA license holders who´d like to make the jump to Hainan, Air China or Korean...........

Your right about the capitalism !

But your wrong on the type rating without exoerience , all those airlines require 500 hours on type .

Not if you´re coming from the A320.
Korean for example requires you to get the rating endorsed beforehand at own expense. For JAR/EASA license holders this would be difficult as ZFTT with Korean would be impossible and basetraining would be hard to acquire.
TCX and IAGO now offer a tailored solution for that.
Ain´t pretty but I guess there is a demand.

Air China and Hainan

Maybe for korean but the chinese won t touch you , so its a waste of 15k .

Is this TCX UK or TCX Scandinavia?

TCX Uk ,

My point is not is it worth doing , but how can you lay 43 guys off , demote numerous captains and then give sectors to pay to fly guys ???

...because the airline is struggling financially, they are being pressurised from the low cost sector, they've done it before on the A320, countless reasons but broadly; money talks. They're also aware that some sap will happily sign up for this deal.

Quote:

My point is not is it worth doing , but how can you lay 43 guys off , demote numerous captains and then give sectors to pay to fly guys ???

By turning yourself into a profitable flying training school :sad:

Think carefully about what you are doing. You may find yourself in 5 years time with a TR, a couple of thousand hours on type, and no job, and no seats available because they are all being filled by pay-to-flyers.

This is yet another kick in the slats for TCX pilots who have already been p*ssed upon from a great height and I, for one, deeply regret the arrangement.

Added later:

IF the deal includes line training. If it's only the rating, that's fine, of course.

Quote:

...because the airline is struggling financially

If an airline cannot afford to employ pilots, it raises serious questions about whether it should be operating at all.

P2F is bad enough, but to lay off your own crews and serve demotions only to employ(?) unpaid/paying inexperienced pilots (150h in a 320) to fly your long haul network is shocking.

IAGO Flight Training - Fly the A330 @ IAGO

Quote:

The Partner Airline: Thomas Cook Airlines
The Aircraft Type: A330
Price: From £10950 plus VAT (where applicable)
ETOPS sectors included during route sectors will attract additional charge- Price on application.
IAGOFT reserve the right to change or cancel the program at their discretion.
ALLOWANCES, EXPENSES & PAYMENTS:
For each of the 4 sectors of line operational experience with the Partner Airline, no basing or subsistence allowance shall be paid to the Student by IAGO FT.
For the sake of clarity, neither the Partner Airline nor IAGO FT shall make any payments to the Student during this period of Advanced Training
The Student shall remain responsible for the following costs:
o All accommodation costs and living expenses during CCQ training.
o All accommodation costs and living expenses at the nominated base;
o The costs of aircrew medicals;
o Any Regulatory Authority (JAA/CAA/EASA) charges for licences and ratings;
o Any additional insurances required by the Student in respect of Loss of life, Injury, Loss of licence, Medical or Personal possessions;
o Costs of an airport ID.
IAGO FT shall be responsible for the following costs:
o The cost of arranging the Student’s CCQ training, ZFT training and line experience with the Partner Airline;
Where Long Haul ETOPS sectors are undertaken down route operational related transport and Hotel accommodation will be provided via the partner airline.
THE SCHEDULE OF A320 to A330 CCQ TRAINING
Phase 1 TECHNICAL GROUND SCHOOL and SEP
11 working days including JAA Type Technical examination. All groundschool facilities together with Instructor throughout. TRTO final examination pass
Phase 2 SIMULATOR - FFS
12 Hours shared Full Flight simulator (3 x 4hr details per crew) including instructor. 5 hrs LST MPA IRR and OPC (per crew) including examiner
Phase 3 SIMULATOR – ZFT and LVP
4 hours shared Full Flight Simulator (1 x 4hr details per crew) including instructor
Phase 4 AIRCRAFT TRAINING
4 Training sectors to accomplish satisfactory standards of line performance as assessed by the Partner airline.

Thank you for that FL.

Hmm... ZFT and four sectors. Well, I guess that would not make much difference to the demoted guys/girls anyway.

Desperate times desperate measures !!!! A blanket boycot would do the trick !!

Have the TCX redundancies/demotions been confirmed? If so, great shame - some top people facing tough times.

Do BALPA have a comment on this?

I believe the min requirements are 500 hrs of which 150 are 320. This stinks of guys building hrs then paying for 320 line flying hrs and still completely inexperienced, once again paying to fly an A330. I can't bloody believe Tcx are letting inexperienced guys onto a 330.

If someone interested from the press got a hold of this they could have a field day !!!

Cabus

I in no way support the TCX approach to this scheme but i am interested in your comments about tcx allowing inexperienced pilots fly the 330. Can you identify any particular risk in this over and above allowing them to fly the 320? Aside of the seniority/prestige of internal pilots being thrown up against the wall, surely the risks and technical principles are the same as a low hour guy flying a 320?