Who said I was comparing? I would happily take my €9 and fly a big shiny jet every day and someone on here complains that he 'only earns' €35 an hour when loads of people would gladly grab his shoes.

Well shiver, why not do it???

It really is that simple according to the tone of your post.

Let me know how you find it....

Shiver - Well the problem are people like you, willing to work for nothing!

I also challenge you to spend £60.000 - £100.000 on your training, and be happy to make 9 Euro an hour!

Please tells how that really works out for you! :p

if you don't like it, just QUIT !

Shiver is a nobody just trying to wind you up - dont take the bait.

Maxthepilot - I can assure you that many would "just quit" however unless you are a total retard your mind will stop you unless you have made adequate preparations, as I did.

Very true vexed. Its a bit ironic that the type of people that do not support their colleagues and a union are the type that will wish to go to an Airline where pilots before them risked there jobs for the conditions that they will enjoy..... Its the way a spoilt brat behaves..

The reality is we have a choice in Ryanair now more than ever to organise our labour and achieve collective bargaining, It is our right to organise our labour rather than be divided into individual bargaining that doesn't exist...

To be fair to MOL he plays a very good game of being "the big bad CEO" ...the enemy. In fairness the pilots of Ryanair who do nothing, fail to join a union, fail to support each other and will be responsible for further degradation of T and C's in Ryanair are a far greater issue. :E:E MOL he is only a distraction until the 'fence sitters' of the Ryanair pilots get their/our respective acts together...He can call me what he wants when he pays me what I want !!!

Very interesting
 

Thanks for posting this - it's very interesting and I was genuinely surprised by how charismatic and intelligent he is. If you didn't know how he abuses his employees and what a cold arsed bastard he really is you could be forgiven for thinking he's a good guy.

I actually think the fact he is a smiling assassin makes him even more deadly. You guys in Ryanair had seriously better get your act together and get union representation, not just for the sake of yourselves but for the sake of the whole industry in Europe. The truth is that many of you thought that by keeping your head down, accepting being treated like !!!!! for a couple of years you could then leave and move onto something better. The trouble is that those airlines that once offered richer pastures are either shrinking because of the competition from Ryanair or they are changing their employment terms to resemble those at Ryanair. If you let this guy railroad terms and conditions for another 10 years there will simply be nowhere left worth going that is still hiring.

I don't believe making pilots pay for application screening, sim ride, selection, type ratings, uniforms, water, food, hotels, or required business travel is ethical. I don't believe upsetting people's family life by forcing them to move base every so often or making all your employees contractors in order to avoid the costs of holiday, sick pay and pensions is ethical either. Make no mistake these things are normally offered to those who are employed by reputable and decent organisations and all of them can be yours if you join together collectively in a union.

The only person with anything to fear from unionisation should be Michael O'Leary. You can shaft one pilot but you cannot shaft 2000 joined by collective agreement.

Even less 3000 . . . . the problem comes when 78% of them are contractors, with a high percentage only interested in looking out for #1, that is what always has, and sad to say always will, hamper any progress.
Standing by to be proved wrong. . . . . . . . . . . . (for 10 years now & counting)

Can anybody answer me this - I was told by one of the RYR F/O's the other day that the new Storm McGinley contract incorporates a clause that makes pilots financially responsible for any downroute fines, for example extended use of APU's...if so, I'm astonished...if anyone takes up such a contract, then I've also met the pilot that I WOULDN'T support. Any truth in it?

Apathy is the main problem hampering progress. People are scared for their lives. The 'I don't want to be the guinea pig shouting for change' brigade. This group is large - most pilots in the company.

Ryanair have very cleverly over the years instilled the 'policy' of immediate base closures should union recognition be voted in. They have convinced grown men of this policy via propaganda in pigeon holes and management base visits.This creates division. Enough division so unity is almost impossible.

What if all the bases had a ballot? If 4 vote yes and everyone else votes no,then what? People fear Ryanair will shut up shop and move elsewhere to 'punish' the 4 yes bases.

I know its mind boggling that people are so intimidated. Almost hard to believe but this is the reality.

after watching the whole interview on Irish Television, at the start he commended the pilots, (of course - a gesture made due to the reported on-going pilot shortage within the company), but back to his usual rant and showed his contempt towards these safety critical employees.

Inferring pilots are simply just Glorified Taxi Drivers? what an insult !!

if anyone is a glorified taxi driver, it is the person who purchases a taxi plate in order to beats Dublin traffic on his way to work>,Smart maybe, but Michael, if anyone is a Taxi driver, it is you !, oh of course not, Michael O'Leary CEO of Ryanair, simply bought the taxi plate and gets someone else to drive him....

Michael O Learys claim that Pilots work 18 hours a week ? ....RYR pilots working busy summer months, if this were true, 2 days into their 5 day rostered week, pilots would be simply walk off the job, and leave aircraft stranded at out stations....


going on Irish Public Television and making such an inaccurate statement, will only increase workforce contempt towards the company and management, a company who are at this time, desperately trying to solve upcoming staff shortage issues for the summer. These off the cuff remarks made by their CEO on public television certainly does not help the situation....

Its all very frustrating - constant inaccuracies bounded around.

Most of the viewers do not know the slightest thing about aviation.Unfortunately in Ireland MOL is lauded as a saviour and held in high esteem amongst the public because he slags off our incompetent politicians constantly. His ryanair propaganda photo shoots are 'gas' and a 'great laugh'. People honestly believe every word he says.Thats why he gets away with being such a fool.By in large only people with aviation knowledge know he is a liar and bull!!!!ter.

Now ill get constant questions from people regarding my amazing roster and lack of work each week. Ill be labeled a dosser on an 'easy number' getting 'amazing' pay ( but sadly 30% behind competitors. The net money is very weak after accountants,bank transfer fees and all the things that should be provided like STBY pay,holiday pay,sick pay,medicals,uniform,LOL,hotel and accommodation at the sim twice a year,even the 2 sims are at least 3500 euro a year taken from your pay,significant petrol costs when you are rostered on a ground transport day in order to position to a base or sim centre and unpaid SEP days,winter ops days,changes to procedures days etc etc etc !)

The amount of times people say (seriously without a hint of irony or joking) :

'So when are the toilets being removed?'
'When can I stand for a fiver?'
'When are you becoming the pilot?' (people presume co pilots are not pilots ,do nothing at all of value and they are similar to cabin crew,who can easily assist the pilot instead because O'leary says so)

Its all getting very tiresome,embarrassing and expensive ( the longer you stay under the Brookfield spell the worse your career becomes versus similar colleagues building seniority elsewhere in proper jobs). Cant wait to leave.

Correct me if Im wrong, but is cutting these costs not what has made Ryanair so profitable?

From a business and shareholder point of view Ryanair are a huge success story. MOL is a shrewd businessman who capitalises on opportunities in order to cut costs and expand the airline ( hiring redundant pilots,going to distressed airports and the now famous cheap boeing deal )

There are 2 ways of doing business. Ethically - following specific codes of ethics and unethically. Ryanair are morally bankrupt and unethical. They treat passengers disgracefully,staff with impunity(cabin crew destitute on unpaid leave around xmas for between 1 and 3 months - in contrast easyjet get champagne and a 2 week bonus ) and airports aggressively. I'm all for cutting operational costs(hedging,fx,bag charges,bulk buying etc ) but their is a limit on the staff side of things. If you go too far - people will vote with their feet and you create a whole new set of problems. 75% of Ryanair pilots are now contractors. This is to cut the cost base but also to bust the unions.Very dangerous having such an disloyal workforce who will walk out instantly and not think twice about it.

Ryanair is a fantastic BUSINESS but an awful AIRLINE. In the most recent annual report it specifies that the average length of service of a pilot in the organisation is only 5 years and average age of early thirties. Says it all really. The attrition rate is definitely near or above 10% now. What goes around comes around

Ryr will run out of pilots very soon.Staying in Europe is just not the place to be aviation wise.Chinese are paying double what that Irish :mad: is and feeds,gives uniforms,paid sim,well treated and above all respected pilots.I moved here 8 years ago and have never looked back.We have a few ex Ryr pilots and the hatred they have towards MOL is very real.I know be professes not to care but how sad to see what Herb did and completely .... it up.Hundreds of pilots resigning every year as opposed to a handful at Southwest.

Comparing FR pilots to taxi drivers is an absolute insult ............. to taxi drivers!

Smith
 

And what would you really know? You'r not a pilot. Last time I checked they did the same job as me. I just work for a different carrier.

Clown.

Frankly MO'L's comments regarding his pilot employees are never worth the "column inches" they propagate on Pprune. Clearly pilots are a commodity,the cost of which he intends to suppress to the greatest degree possible for as long as possible by any means available including underselling their abilities, work ethic and importance to a safe industry. Don't take it personally, he certainly doesn't. Bottom line is that he is a good businessman but a very bad boss. Shame.

To be fair, he said that pilots fly 900 hours a year. He then explained this as a weekly average. He added that however that Ryanair pilots actually are very hard working.

However, the comment on taxi driving was unfortunate as was the complaint pilots are the least productive of all the employees because they are restricted. However, the host looked a bit puzzled and also pulled MOL up on some of inconsistencies, so kudos to him.

Spot on Built4Speed!

Pathetic, a thread 4 pages long with people crying like little children about something 'bad' MOL said!

MOL must be very pleased with himself and the psychological tests the recruitment team uses: employees that are just smart enough to push the correct buttons, but obviously way too dumb and selfish to get organized! :D

p.s. how is that big exodus (i.e. RYR pilots selling their @ss to some Middle Eastern slave driver in return for a bigger and shinier jet) going? :p

Yeah, FR pilots do the same job as you but THEY accepted the conditions they work under. There is enough info on this site regarding the conditions at FR so, fair enough, accept the job offer but don't then start bitching about it. They went in with their eyes open ............. I hope?

Judging by how any ex RYR guys I'm running into, both ex skippers and F/O's, I'd say that EK is doing a nice job of attracting ex O'leering employees. Now that we are doing the initial interviews and sims back up in the UK and Europe, then even a max of 3 days off in a row is enough:E

On the flipside, I continue to have ZERO sympathy with the whingers and moaners on here who sold their souls and then decided it was all a bit unfair, what utter hipocrisy and self-centered bilge.
You all signed on the dotted line and took your chances, just like us here in the ME, moaning and wailing now just proves what a bunch of selfish and foolish twits a large majority of you are:hmm:
At least the REPA and Ialpa boys have got a pair and are trying to do something about it.

O'Leery on youtube, although more from the SLF point of view than as an employer -

Unbelievable really, who would write and spend the time to do a song like that?

Terry and Jim?

"no income tax, no VAT, no money back no guarantee" was the original lyric.

Sums up life for 'employees' and SLF

The only happy people I know personally, run their own businesses and have control over their lives.

Yes they've had ups and downs but they are now all looking forward to early retirement twenty years earlier than most employees. Some of them were financially self sufficient in their 30's. And retirement for these guys doesn't mean sitting in the local library in their slippers waiting for God. One guy I know is busy skiing, traveling ( proper traveling where you can enjoy where you go ), mentoring young entrepreneurs, attending top name concerts etc, etc. And all this when he wants to do it, not when screw-control let him.

It's not difficult or a mystery how to screw money out of people, just a mystery why so many people are happy to have money screwed out of them. MOL has simply stumbled on a good way to do it.

They don't teach how not to be gullible in schools I gather. What a pity.

Signing up to work for Ryanair is like joining the army. Nobody really cares if you get your legs blown off ( metaphorically speaking ). You wear a uniform, you do as you are told. I wish I had realised that twenty years ago, but now it is too late !

"Comfortably numb"
 

Instead of reading a stupid interview with MOL, people would be better off reading this: Paychecks, Perception, Propaganda & Power.

I know it's a lot of reading, especially for today's generation who want instant gratification and an immediate upgrade when they have 3-4000 hours, but it's an eye opener of how the system, i.e. FTL's, data monitoring & propaganda ("pilots only work 20 hours per week") is used against us pilots.

Download it for your iPads, laptops and what have ya's, and read it on a long(er) flight! :ok:

Its great he knows the facts about CAT2/3 operations. Approach speed of 500 miles per hour in Ryanair, impressive.

Maybe that's why they have such an impressive on-time performance record.:}:}

I think he was talking about the taxi speed

You'r probably best off not thinking.

O to be a fly on the wall when one of his cabin crew ( that he plans to train to fly his planes ) lands on his office in Dublin Airport in a strong crosswind:}

Maybe his pilots should all go on strike, simultaneously and see if that changes his opinion on the matter:E

RYR do plan to approach at 500kts cos everyone will be bursting for a P**s

We know Ryanair management don't care about pilots or cabin crew and engineers for that matter. However that's in their nature. Who allowed them get away with this- we the pilots did! 10 years ago the basic salary was over 80 grand. Now it's less than 60. Contractors new contracts get rid of the concept of home base. Now your home base is anywhere you are sent for three weeks or more. Reliable Information has it that now if you want leave in summer you got to "buy" it with another leave day - 5 days in summer will cost you 10 days. 4/3 rosters are on the horizen. Cabin crew in certain bases are been told only 9 month contracts available in your base now, if you want 12 months pay you have to move to another part of the world. They don't need us for 12 months, just think about that and where it will lead.

And things are going to keep getting worse. They are looking for the " floor". And if you are thinking- things are not too bad, at least I am OK - they will get around to you. That's what they guys 10 years ago said, how many of them are left on a proper contract? Probably 1%. Each contract is worse than the last. We now have a management team that tell us they don't care if we leave, they don't really care what we do. Our lack of resistance has meant that a management team that once was quite innovative and market leading have become lazy and arrogant. Instead of innovative solutions they now have only two solutions to every problem- cut wages and charge passengers more hidden charges. Time to wake them up or ship them out. They are they ones pocketing easy money from our complacency and laziness.

I am not a fan of IALPA or unions. When i hear union i keep thinking of Bob Crow!
That said I believe we must organize ourselves. This is last chance saloon. Next year expansion stops, they will be able to cover the roster. They will continue to attack us unless we stand up and fight. Don't expect this journey to be easy or pain free, it won't. MOL will fight tooth and nail and make no mistake he is good. Don't expect IALPA to fight for us, they union is only a framework, the fight must come from Us.
MOL will never like us, we can live with that. He doesn't respect us and we deserve that but we can change it. We have previously folded at the first obstacle management put in front of us and sold out our colleagues. See where it got us!!
You want change , you want respect? Earn it, stand up and be counted. Join your union and fight for our career.

Great post Beernice :D

The best so far. Anyone doubting that collective representation is necessary in RYR - or any airline for that matter needs to read it.

l believe l`m right in saying this - l can`t find the newspaper reports - but

MOL bought a 6k euro cab licence for his limo so that he could use the

bus lanes in Dublin to avoid the plebs in rush hour traffic.

Normal protest about anything is unlikely to work with this man, and

don`t forget, he introduced the £50 c.v. levy, £150 interview levy, etc.,

within 3 weeks of 9/11, to milk the hundreds of qualified and current pilots

out of work and on their ars*s.

That is the reality.