xrba - I never said you didn't!! If you've taken some of my comments personally - well, I'm sorry but there's nothing I can do about that. Read my posts again and you'll see that not only have there been several of us asking for people who were there to tell us what happened, but that I've not once belittled the trauma that I'm sure you all went through. But hear enough conflicting anecdotes and you stop believing in them at all. Till now, Right Way Up is the only one to put his hand up and say he was there - now you have. I've said what I've said and I stand by every word of it. I have no doubt that you all suffered tremendously and for that you have my sympathies. But I still believe that it could not and would not happen again today in a company with strong union membership and a strong council. I hope I am not proved wrong.... I'm retiring from this debate now as it's starting to go round in circles - we're never all going to agree on everything, but it's not worth falling out over!!

Cheers all

I've heard that Astraeus have just had a good pay deal through the IPA/IPF
 

I've heard that Astraeus have just had a good pay deal through the IPA/IPF and that the most pilots are happy with the pay deal. And they managed to get it sorted very quickly.

May be we should consider this when dealing with paydeals.

Unions?
 

Was just wondering what choices we have regarding unions, obviously Balpa but is there an alternative and if so why would you consider taking it over Balpa?

Thanks in advance

G

Oh Gawd!!

Here we go again.

BALPA blah blah blah

IPA blah blah blah

Think of a new topic PLEASE

BC

shut it Brae, if the man wants to ask a question then let him.

BALPA - expensive but good. Have a lot of clout and have been very good in my experience when it comes down to the basics, T&C'c etc.

For the more serious personal stuff then theyre like nuclear weapons, you pray you may never use them but if you do need them then youre glad youve got them. I know of two instances were guys, non-BALPA members, have got into trouble and have tried to get BALPA help, only to be told to sod off.


DB....

As a practical demonstration of why a union is a good thing I would like to express my support for G-DAWG asking a perfectly reasonable question. Imagine if you had to personally negotiate lifestyle, pension, salary, benefits etc with someone with Brae's attitude every year.

Personally BALPA has been well worth my support. For starters I have inherited about £10K extra annual salary as a result of predecessors actions. They have since got me a £10K pension increase and thanks to them talking nicely to the tax man I get 2/3 of my subscription back in my tax allowance.

An absolute no brainer. Now if I should do something to upset my company I will absolutely need them.

Or should I just go it alone, save £120 a year and pocket the benefits gained by others. Might get a nice management job with that attitude. You decide?

Duff, Flying Tom,
I think you misunderstand my post. I am a staunch BALPA member of many years standing but I have seen so many threads on Prune turn into a BALPA v IPA debate that I didn't want to see another. All the previous re-runs are available via a search.

So shut it yourself!

BC

Sorry should have said that I've just sarted my aviation career and just wanted some pointers as I've had some contradicting advice.

I was under the illusion that pprune was a resource for information and not a place to be rediculed for merely asking a question and if said question evokes feelings of anger why waste your valuable time answering? If every question needs to fit into a nice little box conforming to your requirments, where would that leave pprune!!

Thanks guys for the positive posts, just the kind of info i was after.

Many thanks

G

I thought this thread was about unions?

Why is IPA being mentioned then?

IPA is not a union. It may be a sort of glorified PPL oriented employment agency/jobsite, but it is not a Union.

There is only one, and that one is hardly "expensive" if you regard it as Liability Insurance and protection from rogue employers over a whole career.

No brainer.

Agaricus

From the IPA/IPF website;

"The constitution of the IPA precludes it from becoming a trade union, however, with changing employment legislation many requests were received from members asking for representational activity of a union nature. In response to the requests of those members a sister organisation, the Independent Pilots Federation (IPF), was formed in 2001 and that body is a recognised Trade Union. The IPF is affiliated to the IPA and all ‘Full’ members belong to both organisations to receive the benefits each has to offer."

I am a member of the IPF. I have nothing against BALPA and they do a great job for thousands of pilots. However, I personally prefer the legal insurance scheme of the IPF which is an independent insurance policy rather than the BALPA system whereby they decide whether to support you.

Both unions have their advantages and disadvantages. However, the important thing is that we are all members of one or the other.

Airclues

Sorry Brae, I read your post out of context, should have looked back a few pages.

ATB FT.

Thanks Flying Tom,

I see the Mods have amalgamated the posts (good) but as you can see this topic has been running on this particular thread for over a year now!

I mean no offence to G-Dawg but I begin to suspect 'new' threads that appear essentially to ask the same question.

BC