pay after base training
 

do you kniw if you get paid at least the basic salary after base training.

once you completed the base training which is when you have the Type written on the licence you still need to do OCC and wait for the start of line training.

would be a good deal if you get paid the basic each month while waiting for line training, I guess like everybody I have some momthoy cost that needs to be paid.

but of is getting nothing, then between base training and start of line training can pass few months and that will be a problem.

any info on it ?

According to the last 2 posts of Xanderfly, the basic should be 23000pa, so I guess it should cover the basic needs, even if you have to wait for a few months.

Still, you have to cover yourself during the initial training - but hey, what happened(seems to be happening) is something i would never saw coming

Thank you Xander!

I have a few questions, that i think everybody wants to know more about.

Would you guys still take this ''new'' deal if you were expecting to leave after 2-3 years? ?

How about the salary, now that you won't get paid through your LTD company, wouldn't the taxes be much higher = lower income?

If you get employed on a Ryanair contract, i suppose you will still get paid when you're sick etc. etc. ?

Let's say you are based in Milano, you're paying taxes etc. etc. in Milano only, right?

Are there any pay raise? After 500 hours, after 1500 hours? like on the old contract.

It seems like alot of you guys are really good to give in depth answers, i hope this will also be the case now.
I hope i'll see you in the skies
Auf wiedersehen

[quote=carpentermichael

Hopefully this may help:

Would you guys still take this ''new'' deal if you were expecting to leave after 2-3 years? ?

[b]The whole point of the bonding is retention - if you are going to leave in that time frame - pay up the bond and leave.
Simple as that - there is a cost - you cannot have your cake and eat it. Sorry but there is no free lunch - they are a commercial company ...[/b]

How about the salary, now that you won't get paid through your LTD company, wouldn't the taxes be much higher = lower income?

:ugh:

If you get employed on a Ryanair contract, i suppose you will still get paid when you're sick etc. etc. ?
If you are employed by the company yes you would get paid when sick etc

Let's say you are based in Milano, you're paying taxes etc. etc. in Milano only, right?
most likely yes you will only pay tax in one country.

Are there any pay raise? After 500 hours, after 1500 hours? like on the old contract.
not sure

A lot of posts have disappeared from this thread?

From the horse's mouth:

The bond is for €25.000 reducing €5.000 per year to zero at the end of year 5

What contract will I get upon completion of Ground School & will I be paid during training?
You will get a Ryanair contract for the duration of 6 months and you will be paid during training from the day you pass your base training. For the duration of this 6-month fixed term training contract you will be paid at a basic gross annual salary of £21,000

You will also be entitled to receive flight expenses from the 1st of the month following your Safety Pilot release in the form of Sector pay at the rate of £16.04 per Scheduled Block Hour (SBH)

After the 6 months training contract, both UK end EU basic salary is just over £23.000/€23.000
Allowance is £5.500/€5.500
Productivity bonus £6.000/€6.000
Annual leave payment £2.800/€3.200-4.600 (base dependant)

Flight pay varies between bases. For 850hrs you can expect:
GBR £27.000 - IRL €33.900 - DEU €36.300 - BEL €32.300
PRT €33.100 - ESP €33.900 - ITA €33.900 - East EU €29.700

Can we have some pros and cons between each program, so it would make it easier for the cadets to choose. I'll start.

Self sponsored:
Pros = Alot higher earning potential than on the bonding scheme


5 Year bonding
Pros = Cheap T/R if you do all 5 years

Help me out guys, please.

nightfright;

:ugh:
The type rating costs Ryanair as close to zero. They earned hundred of thousands of euros with the pilots. But I've seen guys like you defending Ryanair like your life is depending on it. Let me tell you this. There are companies out there that actually pay your type rating and they pay you throughout the type rating. And they are commercial companies as well ;)
Basic salary of 21,000€ is a joke if you don't get a guaranteed amount of flight allowance. Let's say they pay you 50h guaranteed.
Get a grip man.

jonesyinthesky

Likewise I've met tons of ex Ryanair guys that are so glad to finally have made the move out of this stinky so called company. It's a kindergarden. And it's becoming worse and worse there. Who in the world would return with to them with the current management in place and the current so called "deals"? By the way there are other companies flying out of Dublin with 737s ;)

I will get a grip when you name me 1 of those "commercial companies" that will hire me with 250 TT and MCC

Luke258


I am not defending RYR but all I am saying is that it is a commercial organisation there to make profits.

Correct that the TR may not cost them anything - they do not HAVE to offer you that rating for free. They are able to charge what they like and make you work for kebab or for free.. IF you accept those conditions ... then fine.

Having a RYR on your cv and those hours will mean more opportunities even in a downturn hence ...

There are lots of companies which offer you paid TR although only starting recently. And pay you from day 1 - there is a reason for these .....

Loganair, Flybe etc all pay the TR but when you compare the TR, benefits of type and hours, versus the basic salary as you are comparing - then you will find a plus point on RYR

FlyBe, Loganair, Eastern etc all pay a lower salary than FR. yes albeit a perm contract.... but photos, hours and the rest do not put food on the table....... if you are lucky to have the support then great - many don’t.

I totally believe any company should bear its recruitment, training costs on fully and take the risk as well because without that they don’t have a business.......... sadly this is a profession which doesn’t because people have always been ready to work for a peanut in exchange for crap conditions - unless you are extremely lucky or well connected. Thus is why they can charge that - even if unfair. But it all depends on how desperate you are........

I am certainly not out their to protect companies that extort, treat its people like crap - but you have to understand they are not forcing you to apply - don’t apply or accept their conditions if you don’t.

Hope that helps

Thank you, but I haven't heard from DHL in the last 2 months, luxair is not hiring since end of December, eurowings is not hiring, ASL Airlines no vacancies at the moment, FlyBe is not at the moment, jet2 needs also JOC, and Cathay I've applied a month ago. So with what I've said in mind how bad is Ryanair currently offering me a job in my current situation? I know is always a big debate in this forums but for some people is not so easy to let go such and opportunity.
Edit: Loganair looking for experienced captains and first officers
As I mentioned there aren't so many when you are below that experience threshold

Aer Lingus recruits zero hour pilots with a frozen ATPL (MCC+joc).

Bonded for 3 years you don't pay for any training whatsoever and get paid from day 1 of your employment. Salary is equal to those on a permanent contract and mostly based on your basic so financially you are in a secure position.

I can't understand why a much more profitable airline such as FR wouldn't offer the same if not better recruitment offers.

Simple - they don't have to.

Aer Lingus have a cadet/non type rated salary for the first 2 (I believe) years. The trend these days is that you will pay for it, somehow. It might not be as ludicrous as 30k upfront, but you are paying for it.

There is a cadet salary at AL but the new joiners also get from day 1 a salary, final salary pension, sector pay, performance pay, uniform, carpark, all training included, food and water, overnight allowances, hotac accommodation, seniority list, union, working conditions etc etc. Incomparable to FR or any of the bottom feeders.

IMHO, that there are many airlines out there who recruit fATPLs and pay them better, at least initially. However, there are no airlines out there who recruit anywhere near the number of fATPLs that Ryanair do. Unless you include Easyjet, but they only recruit cadets from the space academies.

Anyhow, like it or not and if you can get over your anti-Ryanair fundamentalism, you will see that Ryanair has vastly improved and is no longer the bad guy on the block. There are many other employers out there that deserve everyones scorn other than Ryanair.

Here is the new deal.
Bonus of €6 000/yr will be paid if you dont have any sickdays (as far as I know)

These contracts are OK if you are young and healthy. As soon as something happens, you’re ****** with the basic salary

There is a cadet salary at AL but the new joiners also get from day 1 a salary, final salary pension, sector pay, performance pay, uniform, carpark, all training included, food and water, overnight allowances, hotac accommodation, seniority list, union, don't forget staff interline.

For an 'apprentice' scheme that seems pretty attractive, even if you have to contribute over 2 years.

Bonus of €6 000/yr will be paid if you dont have any sickdays (as far as I know)

If that is true I would expect the relevant XAA to take an interest as it suggests an incentive to fly when unfit.

Hi guys!

What about the APC programme?
I've been successful at the APC assessment and got an invitation to start the TR on 23rd of April, but I still didn't receive any contract and signed anything.

Do you know anything about that?

I don't dispute that, my point is that it's not quite as amazing a deal as P06T suggested and you are still paying for it, even though you also get what should be normal employment terms (but thanks to Ryanair etc are seen as perks).

Also, RAT 5 the deduction is for non TR people as well. I'm far from being an apprentice but I'm not airbus type rated so would earn a 'cadet' salary.

Wrong. EZY are also recruiting type rated AND non type rated direct entry Captains and FO’s. Don’t know if recruiting is finished for this year - probably is, as they are very busy integrating all the Air Belin crews - (300+) along with the usual 400+ intake.

A4

Good to know they are recruiting some real experience. In my previous post when I referred to cadets I meant 200hr fATPLs, in which case you only get into EZY through CAE, L3 or FTE.

If you join as a direct entry non type rated (fatpl) you will only spend 1 year on the cadet salary that you mentioned. During which you will have a comparable salary to that of FR’s bond (but you don’t pay 5k upfront) and as I previously mentioned your salary is not as heavily dependent on hours flown as FR.
But you certainly wouldn’t be paying them back 30k in a reduction in salary as you hinted.

On the second year your salary will increase considerably. So I hope this clears the air.


FR’s latest bond offer is a step in the right direction but it could be better.

hi anderse

May I know where you got the information from?

I worked for this company long enough to know that they haven't changed a bit. And you? Recently joined two striper, super proud and letting everyone on Instagram know that you're in Ryanair?
Let me understand please where they have "vastly" improved. As far as I'm concerned you'll get now 200€ more per month on average. So if at all the salary has been improved, which doesn't make them a nice airline to work for. You'll get that some day maybe.

Nowhere, as is not true.

Only unauthorised absence is mentioned. (ie. not following reporting procedure)
The company will recover those days by rostering some days off and the bonus will remain.

That's what they say. In the end they'll twist and turn it as they need to not have to pay you the money. Happend before already. Wouldn't believe a single word coming out of Eddie's or Michael's mouth.

Don't have Instagram account and no I don't work for them either, but would be happy to accept the new deal.

As for you, perhaps you'd like to live with my family in law in SE Asia, then you'd know what a hard life is :ok:.

Begging for flight hours to be able to pay bills. November salary was round about 500 Euros. You wanna know what a hard life is? Getting a credit by a bank to be able to pay your bills with a contract which is not worth the paper it is written on. Yup, I know what a hard life is. Thanks to people like you, that accept crappy deals like those, our profession goes down the drain. But suit yourself. the 200 Euros extra per month will make your panties wet, while others struggle to get a real contract with a fair basic salary. Others are fighting so this contractor model stops. You'd be doing everyone a solid by accepting this. Hats off to you.

What an arrogant post. How long are you in the company? I knew nothing about that "deal". Guess what, for a non native english speaker, knowing nothing about irish or english tax law or employment law, this whole set up was quite confusing. Were there some voices saying it's a shady deal? Yes of course. Were there many people saying take it? Yes of course.
So now us pilots are the ones fiddling the tax system? Never even try to blame the company eh? Shall we talk about the raids of german custom police? Almost destroying our careers? FYI I have the LP level 6 ;) How's your german, italian, spanish going?
How about you cut the BS? Over the year contractors do well? What about those close to bankruptcy because of two consequent months off? What about those being stuck just before line training for several months? Why are there even training costs? And you do know that deducting those training costs from social insurance charges is partly illegal?
I also read if and generally. Why does this contractor model even exist? I was offered a Ryanair-Contract, I've been in the third world (whatever that is in your mind) and I was a VC-member from the very beginning, fighting for us pilots and our profession. Where were you? Anything else?

Could not agree more... Usually they all happy to start because they can offset all the expenses, then complain when it suits them.

Beside McGinley is out the door anyway. (End of the year) Ryanair contracts are offered to all new joiners and are available also to current pilots.

Yup finally some positive news. Did you read as well maybe that the ryanair lawyer tried to buy ryanair out of this? After they said theyre not being investigated on? Too bad the Managers of McGinley told the State Attorney another story.
Btw I keep hearing expenses. Why are there any? Why should I be happy to pay my own hotels and transportation? You guys have a healthy mindset. Probably working on your off days before for free as well, right?

The funny thing is that normally all those that respond "you knew what you were signing" are usually the ones that a few years later come back crying to this forum :ok:... even more true for the case of RYR

Interesting human species...

By the way a friend of mine just joined Ryanair, he got one of those contractor contracts.... and no.... he doesn't have a clue of what he signed, his tax/social security obligations and so on

And I'm just going to throw a question: how many pilots in ryanair pilots file their tax returns in the countries they actually reside on (i.e. homebase country in >90% of the cases)? Because I know about a lot that do not...

Wow, that sounds just like it came out of Eddie's Mouth. Funny thing is, that even after years it was not even clear to the relevant tax authorities and tax advisors how to apply taxes and social insurance. But sure, it is the Pilot's responsibility to understand everything about it. I am actually happy that the charges will be dropped against the pilots, which makes your argument invalid.
Those guys that you are talking about exist, but as you just said, it was some of them. Most of the pilots that I know in Ryanair don't have any criminal intentions.

Of course I know about it. Have you ever been out of base on short notice where you had to go in the lousiest hotel just so you don't lose any money? Or even better you actually lost money? Well, I have been. I'd rather have the company sort everything out for me. By the way, per diems would be also applicable then, you should know that.

Historical ATPL costs? So as you said you as a pilot should know about tax law. In germany you can't deduct it from the taxes, unless you can proof it is your second education.

Everyone deducted the Type Rating as you might know. Deducting a Type Rating, for which the company doesn't pay, just so you earn a decent salary. How ridiculous can it actually get?

It doesn't add up? Have you thought about the possibility that I have left the company and been offered a contract to stay? Doesn't cross your mind? My salary in November was less than 1000Euro. Sure the financial benefits were awesome...You're one bright mind aren't you.

Guys like you, accepting everything by the company and praising them, are one of the biggest problem this company has. Strike breaker on top probably. I have friends that flew all over the world and they were shocked by the stories they've heard from ryanair pilots.

Can I ask you again, how long are you in the company?

Of course i fixate on winter pay slips. There should not be any major difference in your pay throughout the year. Things change significantly because finally the prosecutors are tightening the noose on them. They don't offer contracts because they are nice. You should know that being several years in the company. Don't get me wrong, i am more than happy that this contractor model seems to end soon for them. this is what i was fighting for. that they will not get any advantage over fair paying airlines anymore. That they play by the same rules. otherwise our profession goes down the drain. My news are not that old by the way. And yes one thing youre right about. I have left. Together with many others. That's the only language that they speak unfortunately. Good luck to you as well, if you are still there. I am still hoping for the best for everyone there.

Stockholm Syndrome

I have my reasons, just like many others. Again, you seem to have lived behind the moon or just have been hired from flight school.
What's unhealthy is up to you to learn. Contracts like the mcginley one for example are unhealthy. But you'd probably fly for free. And don't worry about my career. I made a big step ahead and I'm enjoying every bit of it at the moment.

Volltreffer:ok: