Thomas Cook
 

Hi guys anyone know anything about the Thomas Cook potentially merging with Lufthansa ? what does this mean for the flight crew ?

Lufthansa has been shopping for partner airlines to expand the Eurowings brand for some months. The kick start into long haul with Sun Express is not going as fast as they want and they need established long haul players to get any sort of traction. Sun Express Deutschland is rumoured to be concentrating on the traditional 737 based model as it will need crews to keep the airframes coming from Turkey utilised over the summer months and possibly longer as the Turkish markets are hit badly by the terrorist events of recent times. The whole Lufthansa/ Condor/ Thomas Cook thing seems to be coming full circle. Effects on crews? probably none, other than those hoping to swap from SH to LH than may be sidelined if trained crews are up and running already. Bases? its a guess!

LUFTHANSA Continues To Shop For An Airline.....Next Up, Condor - Lufthansa Flyer

As a veteran of several airline mergers and takeovers I can assure you that the aircrew will be the very last to know anything about it and are unlikely to be consulted beforehand.
Anything that becomes "known", "understood" or "believed" of the entire business (inc what is reported in the meeja) before and during the takeover process will be bunkum, guesswork or rumour unless it is promulgated officially by the purchaser and rest assured there won't be much of that. Takeovers happen in conditions of hermetic secrecy.
As pilots you will be the last to know anything. Adopt mushroom mode and wait it out, there's nowt else you can do. Even if BALPA are involved you'll learn nothing until the bombshell memo comes out that explains everything as a fait accompli, and then its like it or lump it.

Sorry.

Still, Thos Cook to Lufti might for once be a positive change. I hope so.

ps. Part of the fun is inventing feasible sounding but controversial, even shocking scenarios (eg new company hub in Stuttgart or Prestwick for tax reasons, or all aircrew required to speak fluent German due to Lufti rules - courses will be provided, no wages until passed) and dropping them into a conversation with a known gossipmonger or just in a general crewroom conversation and waiting to see how long it takes them to gain traction and how much they've grown in the telling. A really skilful operator can have two or three of these running concurrently and much subversive fun can be had to liven up a grim period. ;)

Best of luck guys!

Thomas Cook sold most of the fleet in a sale and leaseback arrangement a few years ago. We were strapped for cash. Lufthansa may well be interested in gaining control of Condor as it is a different model to the rest of the group airlines. Lots of scheduled slots in Germany and lots of previous history.

I cannot see them wanting any other part of the business. Certainly not a tour operator with a load of shops on the UK high street.

As for the Daily Mail article, total rubbish. Nothing new there though...

wageslave , your scenarios are hoax.
one example: Lufthansa Italia like 5 yrs ago had Italian copilots. when it went out of business they were given the chance to move to fra/muc into real Lufthansa contract (compared to BA about 30% higher salary, short haul about 15 days off a month, long haul 17). one requirement at that point was german language proficinecy. but not before that with ops in Italy. many took the chance , learned for 6 months , and were integrated in the main seniority list.

Thos Cook Lufthansa Possible Line Up
 

Wageslave, Great post & of course you are absolutely right in all you say. Definitely, in many industries & certainly in the Airline world, the Crews & other loyal staff, are the very last to hear just what is going on, or likely to happen.
As an aside, I wonder if Lufthansa are also looking at the new slim line Monarch operation?
Regards.

Or indeed the following, which has also been referenced in the Daily Mail, but I'm thinking about it a little further:

Lufthansa take the Condor aircraft.
Monarch take the TCX aircraft.

Despite the initial scepticism, and newspaper reporting about Monarch actually being up for sale, which seems to have been wrong, this would be an ideal opportunity for Monarch to expand and consolidate with a competitor.

Assymetricdrift I think you are spot on, it would make sense for both airlines

There you go Wageslave.... your first silly rumour is up and running!

(At least I hope it's only a silly made-up rumour :eek:)

Well that explains all the chemtrails I've been suffering from recently.

To immediately be painted orange? ;)

I heard Stelios didn't want anything to do with Monarch? ^^

Stelios doesn't have operational control of easyJet and hasn't for many years. There's been plenty he hasn't agreed with!

Apologies for continuing the thread creep but why would Easyjet want to pay any money whatsoever for Monarch?

Monarch don't own any of their aircraft and Easyjet already have access to the majority of airports that Monarch operate out of.

As per when BMI Baby went under other airlines just cherry picked what they wanted/needed to expand their own networks.

Easyjet could just sit and wait and get what they want without the hassle of taking on another airline and all of its staff.

Sound harsh but I think this is more likely the scenario.

This thread is about Thomas Cook! Why has Monarch crept into it? What relevance has poor BMI Baby's demise got to do with it? Honestly any excuse to endlessly pontificate what ifs and maybes..... :rolleyes:

Monarch are doing just fine thank you - unless you work there you really have no idea! ;)

Or perhaps the first reports are still correct - you could view this as greybull talking themselves up thus presenting Monarch as a better proposition to potential suitors

Ryanair dont need to, they just buy NAS. You heard it here first..

Ha! That one will never get past the EU!

Hi does anyone expect any recruitment at Thomas Cook this year? PPJN says recruiting for 16/17

There is a Chief Pilot and he's been there for a long time, the DFO is new because the previous UK one moved up to group level.

Recruitment is likely though I'd say more like 20 or 30 people, not like the 130 or so hired in the last 2 years.

Unless you are a low hour wannabe , it would be a brave move to join TC with the likelihood of significant downward corrections in the european leisure travel business. Read contraction.

5 5am reports in a row doing 4 sectors? Nope, not true and not allowed.

So...tell us how it is then?

As far as I am aware, if the CI is before 6am local you can only fly two sectors, I stand to be corrected

I wished you were right!

Day 1 you cannot report before 6am. Day 1 and day 5 should not be elongated duties, there shouldn't be consecutive 4 sector duty days through the week. I've just done a little AMS and back. All week I have only 2 sector days and not particularly long. For August during reserve month and no leave, I'm not even doing 65hrs (I am scratching my head as to why it's so low mind, not high on hours).

Apart from the day 1 early start that cannot be earlier than 6am, crewing may try it on with lots of 4 sector days, especially LGW. If they do file a fatigue concern that they're not following FRMS guidelines, sometimes it's changed sometimes not, if they don't and you're tired go fatigue.

EZY is a different airline depending on where you are based, I wouldn't want to be at LGW. I'm regional base and do approx 700-750 hours a year.

The 5 on generally is a mixture, a double domestic isn't a particularly long day and is over quickly, don't work very hard during the winter, again it depends on what base you're at.

I bet TC is a cushy number, for me at a regional base and LHS with no real want to go LH, I find EZY hard to beat, some things are annoying like all airlines and days can be long, find me a company in this day and age who don't want to get the max out of you.

Having experience of working for both TCX and ezy as flightcrew, and while TCX is not the perfect Airline to work for (Mcgoo Air would have a roster that would work you once a week on a short sector reporting 10am and off duty mid afternoon for double pay - like all employers, airline or otherwise, you can find plenty to have a bitch about with any job and wish things were improved) that in the role of flight crew then my own opinion is that there is a substantial gulf in working for the two companies. TCX is a different proposition, and in my own case much better for time at home and salary. Dont get me wrong ezy wasnt truly awful

Long haul isnt an option at ezy, so that cannot be considered in any relation gauge, however if you compare apples for apples, and make a straight comparison of for example LGW V LGW short/med haul or NCL V NCL short/med haul then my view would be id rather be sat in the flightdeck of a TCX aircraft over an ezy aircraft any day of the week.

The one area Id consider that ezy do have it better is that the home every night means always home before midnight and TCX often means 3am. Id also consider the training teams of both to be excellent too so in my own experience they would dead heat on training. Other than that Id take TCX for every other reason that we hold dear to our hearts

Ive flown for both and its an opinion from operating out of several bases for both.

The obvious rider is that this is just my own opinion. However that said, Im not the only pilot I know who has flown for both, and although third party reporting isnt the way to go, I know others view is of a similar vein to my own. Although I am sure there are many happy folk working for ezy

Who knows what the future holds for all of us in the industry, hopefully a decent future for all. It is becoming apparent that TCX are expanding into flying to the US which looks a good plan in todays situation in the industry.


Safe flying and happy landings to all.