Wow, which TP are you flying, no autoflight or FMS? The latest generation of glass cockpit TP`s have autothrottle, CAT III and RNP capability.

As we speak today, many operators in Canada operate turboprops: jetstreams, kingairs, metroliners... no autopilots, no fds, in a crew environment. Works perfectly fine.

I,ve done it sereval times in the metro and later in the 737-200. Both seats. No big deal. But I agree that my life is easier now on the NGs vs the old 200/metro.

Lets be honest. A plane is a plane. You pull the yoke and the plane goes up, puss the yoke and the pane goes down. And if you pull the yoke to much the plane fist goes up up up and the goes down very fast.

Ph: I will take a TP pilot any time to fly jets. No doubt.

I went from ATR to B737NG, trust me the medium/heavy turboprop is much more work on board and do require more "pilot" skills (climb sequence, eng flame out after V1, icing, landing, non RNAV hold pattern, non precision approach with a lot of mental math to do, etc). The only reason why airlines take only young teens with no experience is because today's modern jet are very automatic and reliable and today's pilots are just there to press buttons and take selfies during cruise with their smartphone. Sad but true.

SSS

You missed the fundamental reason, that they will work for peanuts. Jeez if your gonna sell yourself for beer snacks, at least make it cashews :}

And there it is, the chip on the shoulder of all TP drivers: jet drivers can't actually fly. If you can't fly a NP approach I crosswinds up to the limit of your aircraft, you've no business being in a cockpit.

It's an inane generalisation. I flew TPs without autopilot or FMS. In fact, my first 3,500 hours were all hand flown, 1,500 on TP. A large percentage of my instrument approaches were NDB approaches. A good pilot remains current with all aspects of flying and should be able to carry out a NP approach as and when required. Request it next time.

I use autopilot as and when the situation requires. High density airspace? Autopilot, ease the workload off the pilot monitoring, for instance. On the flip side, hand flying a visual is much less taxing than hand flying an IFR approach. Try descending in the stack in Manchester, with ATC speed control frequently changing, level changes, etc... It requires a lot of concentration to maintain precise speed throughout when flown manually, and this is exactly where AP usage can expand the overall capacity of a crew.

No one wins by propagating bitter falsehoods, at the very least it shows a ignorance of automation and its benefits.

I'm currently doing the transition from Q400 to B738 and so far I have to say, once you've got to grips with all the gizmos it seems like the jet will be the easier life generally. However with no time yet on the actual aircraft I shall leave the verdict to those more experienced than I. Certainly I think I will miss the hooligan aspect of having a very adept machine to dig me out of a poor energy profile in order to achieve stable approach criteria. However, that reliance seems to have bred a culture of ambivalence in some less experienced TP pilots in that they know that facility is nearly always there, (barring a significant TWC or high weights or both,) so they get in the habit of being 'hot and high' as they know that 9 times out of 10 they can get away with it.

So there seems to be good and bad in both. I know from my 4500 hours in Betsy that there are a huge number of very adept aviators in the TP community, it's just a matter of convincing HR types to bloody well hire us! I've had to move to the sandpit to get my opportunity. Much as Betsy was kind to me, only time will tell if I miss her long term.:ok:

I agree with flyingcamel, some of guys coming from TP to jet don't switch from TP "mentality" to a jet one.

While I guess descending in a TP at flight idle at fixed speed wouldn't be a pleasent experience for pax, this is normal ops in a jet. And since handflying in a busy environment is not really a good idea (unless you don't have a choice), one should be inimately familiar with automation - how to achieve desired outcome with timely and correct actions. I've seen unstabilized approaches from people forgetting to reduce MCP speed while extending the flaps, or speedbrakes + V/S 1000 + 70% N1, etc.

Regarding the speed debate... OK, TPs can be very fast during the approach as well, but - let's say you have a 2500m runway. Which aircraft will have higher total energy over the fence - a 20t turboprop at 120 kts or a 60t jet at 145 kts? And which of those will have lower margins to stop? Now do the same excercise, this time with a wet runway and one reverse inop.

Everything being said, I think it all depends on the specific person. Some guys can fly anything from the start, some need more training and still make it eventually and some can't fly at all - being a TP or a jet.

The last two points sum it up perfectly, a competent pilot, given the opportunity can transition no problem either way with some slight adjustments to their approach to operating the aircraft and there is no question someone with 4500 hrs on ANY aircraft should be able to get to grips with a new type if given the chance.

FlyingStone makes an interesting point, and I know from various Trainer's comments over the years that the idea of thinking about the flight in terms of energy is sometimes lost on even relatively experienced TP pilots. Thinking exactly in those terms has saved me from embarrassment a few times over the years. When you have the facility to slow down on a sixpence, I know from personal experience that one can get a bit lazy.

That said a good turboprop pilot should be front of the hiring queue to my mind, but then I'm biased! Ha ha

Whitemonk: even an old git like me?

I should have included a disclaimer, I strictly speak from my own experience. Seeing people coming from business jets all the way up to the heavies like 747's and MD11's, back on to this little TP and completely messing up.
As for inane generalizations, you seem to have that covered in your first sentence by tarring all TP drivers with the same brush ;).