Attention: Airline managers, Chief Pilots and HR Departments
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: lapbandland
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Reality.
Aviation is fun, interesting, a challenge everyday and rewarding
for some.
Most jobs are never any of the above. So lots of people try to
join the fun.
It's called supply and demand. In fact my guess would be that
for every employed pilot around 200 wannabees hope to
join the fun.
Reality.
Luck is a greater factor in joining the fun than any form of
planning or management. Again, my guess would be it's 90%
luck 10% management.
Sadly, most pilots nowdays will not achieve a lifelong career.
Reality.
People are ruthless when it comes to survival.
How dare anyone criticise another for trying to stay in the game.
The game is fun, the secret is out, people will do it for nothing!
Sure, eventually if we all do it for nothing, the game will change.
Thats where the industry now stands. What happens next is
not up to unions or airline managers.
The aviation industry is becoming more competitive.
Thats simply
REALITY
Aviation is fun, interesting, a challenge everyday and rewarding
for some.
Most jobs are never any of the above. So lots of people try to
join the fun.
It's called supply and demand. In fact my guess would be that
for every employed pilot around 200 wannabees hope to
join the fun.
Reality.
Luck is a greater factor in joining the fun than any form of
planning or management. Again, my guess would be it's 90%
luck 10% management.
Sadly, most pilots nowdays will not achieve a lifelong career.
Reality.
People are ruthless when it comes to survival.
How dare anyone criticise another for trying to stay in the game.
The game is fun, the secret is out, people will do it for nothing!
Sure, eventually if we all do it for nothing, the game will change.
Thats where the industry now stands. What happens next is
not up to unions or airline managers.
The aviation industry is becoming more competitive.
Thats simply
REALITY
Join Date: Jul 2001
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boofta,
agree somewhat with what you are saying, however:
Aviation is exciting and we all go through the "glue-to-any-aviation-book" and "stick-around-the-airport-all-day" phases, but at the end of the day, it is our bread and butter, which we need to feed our family.
I don't agree about the challenge every day thing. Reality is, that after a few thousand flight hours one needs some other activity besides flying to keep the brain limber. Most experienced pilots I know, have their own side-business, have at least attempted to establish one, or are involved in Flight-OPS of their company, etc.
People are in deed ruthless, when it comes to survival, provided they know what they are doing. Jobsearch is ruthlessly trying extinct himself as well as others. The choice is his and he will pay the price, eventually.
agree somewhat with what you are saying, however:
Aviation is exciting and we all go through the "glue-to-any-aviation-book" and "stick-around-the-airport-all-day" phases, but at the end of the day, it is our bread and butter, which we need to feed our family.
I don't agree about the challenge every day thing. Reality is, that after a few thousand flight hours one needs some other activity besides flying to keep the brain limber. Most experienced pilots I know, have their own side-business, have at least attempted to establish one, or are involved in Flight-OPS of their company, etc.
People are in deed ruthless, when it comes to survival, provided they know what they are doing. Jobsearch is ruthlessly trying extinct himself as well as others. The choice is his and he will pay the price, eventually.
One unique problem here in the US must be put into context. Some of the retired military pilots are already getting a retirement paycheck from the Air Force, Navy, Marines, Army or Coast Guard (DOT) etc, and some of them don't really feel that airline pilots deserve the present salaries, especially before the 9/11 disasters, which led to fewer monthly hours and/or reduced hourly pay rates.
This can be put a bit into perspective when a person already receives some of his/her income as a result of working hard for twenty plus years on active duty.
After jumpseating about five years ago on a Fedex (widebody) A-300, the Captain told me that some of the retired military FEDEX pilots stated that they would do their jobs for a good bit less than they are being paid. He strongly resented their attitudes, and told me that "...this is my ONLY retirement!" Is it any surprise that good old Fred won't pay them the same as UPS rates or hourly/monthly guarantees/trip/duty rigs etc?
Now, this is not an attempt to generalize about retired military folks, however there are such individuals who don't quite understand the principles of a market economy, or the obvious fact (to me) that with an airline they are not management people.
This can be put a bit into perspective when a person already receives some of his/her income as a result of working hard for twenty plus years on active duty.
After jumpseating about five years ago on a Fedex (widebody) A-300, the Captain told me that some of the retired military FEDEX pilots stated that they would do their jobs for a good bit less than they are being paid. He strongly resented their attitudes, and told me that "...this is my ONLY retirement!" Is it any surprise that good old Fred won't pay them the same as UPS rates or hourly/monthly guarantees/trip/duty rigs etc?
Now, this is not an attempt to generalize about retired military folks, however there are such individuals who don't quite understand the principles of a market economy, or the obvious fact (to me) that with an airline they are not management people.
Last edited by Ignition Override; 17th Dec 2002 at 03:56.
Join Date: Jun 2002
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Self-Correcting
Now, now mates, don't be harsh on a guy that is willing to undercut others in hopes that once he has screwed over others that he can then get his, well he will, and as I say, don't worry his type and sort are self-correcting, they will soon learn that by racing to the bottom, they stay at the bottom, even surprsingly more bitter than before, thank God I won't be there to see that pathetic sight. Race on, baby, race on!
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I personally cant stand falling into line with the ideals of others just because Im in the same group. Unions bother me! I dont like them....but I need them.
Jobsearch, I can understand your propensity to devalue us all if you were a wannabe.....your not! your qualified, just like the AME who wrote out your last medical. I bet he/she didnt bid for your business in the same pre-industrial revolution "market demand" fashion that your so intent on doing.
Many posts compare us to doctors and lawyers in the remuneration(and respect) departments......folks such as yourself make sure that we dont fit that fold in the eyes of management.
They know your worth less than the rest of us because you just told them.
Jobsearch, I can understand your propensity to devalue us all if you were a wannabe.....your not! your qualified, just like the AME who wrote out your last medical. I bet he/she didnt bid for your business in the same pre-industrial revolution "market demand" fashion that your so intent on doing.
Many posts compare us to doctors and lawyers in the remuneration(and respect) departments......folks such as yourself make sure that we dont fit that fold in the eyes of management.
They know your worth less than the rest of us because you just told them.
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IMHO, a great many pilot employers would only be interested in putting bums on seats, regardless of anything more than minimum acceptable ability, if costs could thereby be reduced. Safety would almost certainly suffer.
It's therefore up to pilot unions to prevent a watering down of competancy and safety, not to mention salaries, as would result from a wages free for all.
It's therefore up to pilot unions to prevent a watering down of competancy and safety, not to mention salaries, as would result from a wages free for all.
