Flybe recruitment.
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Flybe recruitment.
There is an article in today’s Sunday Telegraph about very low salaries being offered by the new FlyBe and confidentiality agreements that do not allow discussions of the t&c. I hope that Balpa put a black on this company .Pilots joining Flybe claim they are being asked to agree to unusually aggressive confidentiality rules as a condition of their employment as the regional airline prepares for a return to the skies.
Industry sources say new recruits have said that the carrier wants to prevent them from sharing information about working conditions with external parties, ahead of services restarting from Birmingham airport this spring.
They claim the restrictions are tighter than is normal for an airline.
Industry insiders also claimed that Flybe is also offering captains salaries as low as £50,000 a year, with first officers starting on as little as £24,000. Captains at other low-cost airlines would typically command a salary of around £100,000.
Cabin crew at Ryanair are paid up to £40,000-a-year, chief executive Michael O'Leary said last week.
Many pilots lost their jobs during the pandemic, as airlines cut their workforce in response to travel restrictions.
In recent weeks airline bosses have admitted to struggling to hire cabin crew. But finding pilots has not proven problematic, they said.
Martin Chalk, general secretary of the pilots union Balpa, said: “Pilots are key safety professionals who spend their entire careers seeking to turn the complex process of flying passengers, freight and mail to their destinations safely and efficiently.
“Over decades, by sharing information and collaborating with other aviation system professionals, pilots have contributed to the creation of the safest form of travel ever. Any airline who offers such restrictions as part of the employment of professional pilots has clearly failed to understand this, and will not go far in our industry.”
Flybe declined to comment.
Mayfair financier Lucien Farrell bought the assets of the collapsed airline from administrators two years ago.
His hedge fund was one of Flybe’s owners alongside Sir Richard Branson’s Virgin Atlantic when it collapsed in March 2020 after talks over a state-backed loan fell through.
While airlines are struggling to hire cabin crew as they step up operations, bosses have said that there are plenty of pilots available, giving them the upper hand in salary negotiations.
Industry sources say new recruits have said that the carrier wants to prevent them from sharing information about working conditions with external parties, ahead of services restarting from Birmingham airport this spring.
They claim the restrictions are tighter than is normal for an airline.
Industry insiders also claimed that Flybe is also offering captains salaries as low as £50,000 a year, with first officers starting on as little as £24,000. Captains at other low-cost airlines would typically command a salary of around £100,000.
Cabin crew at Ryanair are paid up to £40,000-a-year, chief executive Michael O'Leary said last week.
Many pilots lost their jobs during the pandemic, as airlines cut their workforce in response to travel restrictions.
In recent weeks airline bosses have admitted to struggling to hire cabin crew. But finding pilots has not proven problematic, they said.
Martin Chalk, general secretary of the pilots union Balpa, said: “Pilots are key safety professionals who spend their entire careers seeking to turn the complex process of flying passengers, freight and mail to their destinations safely and efficiently.
“Over decades, by sharing information and collaborating with other aviation system professionals, pilots have contributed to the creation of the safest form of travel ever. Any airline who offers such restrictions as part of the employment of professional pilots has clearly failed to understand this, and will not go far in our industry.”
Flybe declined to comment.
Mayfair financier Lucien Farrell bought the assets of the collapsed airline from administrators two years ago.
His hedge fund was one of Flybe’s owners alongside Sir Richard Branson’s Virgin Atlantic when it collapsed in March 2020 after talks over a state-backed loan fell through.
While airlines are struggling to hire cabin crew as they step up operations, bosses have said that there are plenty of pilots available, giving them the upper hand in salary negotiations.
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Cabin crew at Ryanair are paid up to £40,000-a-year, chief executive Michael O'Leary said last week.
...
Mixed up ? Naaah ....... He meant - 'Between the three of them.'
LFH
Cabin crew at Ryanair are paid up to £40,000-a-year, chief executive Michael O'Leary said last week.
I'm guessing he may have mixed that up with a Lauda or Buzz Captain salary 😅
LFH
I don’t know what the salaries for Flybe Q400 pilots were at the time when it went under, but when I left in 2006 the pay for a Captain was starting at about 50k, and F/Os in the low 20k’s, so on that basis the salaries are definitely low. However, you can’t really compare to other LCCs (presumably easyJet and Ryanair) as they are operating larger aircraft carrying potentially twice as many passengers per sector from which to earn the money to pay the pilots. Realistically, although it might not be what people want to hear, the comparison should be with with the likes of Logan air or Eastern on similar aircraft.
The good thing in the long term for some of the pilot community as a whole is that if Flybe2 do pay such appalling salaries then if the job market recovers they will once again become a “training airline”, wasting huge amounts of money on training pilots to replace those that move on to fly any sort of jet, but providing jobs and a stepping stone for those who for whatever reason don’t have the opportunity to go straight to the right seat of a 737/Airbus. When I was there they had a wide mix of pilots from ex airforce, self improver, integrated and modular, far more so than at other places I have worked for since; and I believe the working environment was sometimes richer as a result.
The people that isn’t good for are those who want a regional base and don’t want to or can’t relocate, as they will end up flying a turbo-prop forever, not a bad thing in itself except for the salary issue, of course.
The good thing in the long term for some of the pilot community as a whole is that if Flybe2 do pay such appalling salaries then if the job market recovers they will once again become a “training airline”, wasting huge amounts of money on training pilots to replace those that move on to fly any sort of jet, but providing jobs and a stepping stone for those who for whatever reason don’t have the opportunity to go straight to the right seat of a 737/Airbus. When I was there they had a wide mix of pilots from ex airforce, self improver, integrated and modular, far more so than at other places I have worked for since; and I believe the working environment was sometimes richer as a result.
The people that isn’t good for are those who want a regional base and don’t want to or can’t relocate, as they will end up flying a turbo-prop forever, not a bad thing in itself except for the salary issue, of course.
Last edited by excrab; 7th Feb 2022 at 10:23.
Non Disclosure Agreements ?
...
Thanks for posting that Tubby.
No agree .... No job .... Simples.
That sort of all encompassing NDA would presumably include (whether specified or not) ...
a) Posting 'anonymously' on PPRune - "We can find out where you live ... "
b) Discussing T&C .... "Directly with your union ..." or "on a union forum."
c) "What union ... ?" = "No Union"
d) That'll apply to all potential employees.
No agree .... No job .... Simples.
LFH
...
' ... confidentiality agreements that do not allow discussions of the t&c.'
' ... being asked to agree to unusually aggressive confidentiality rules as a condition of their employment ...... to prevent them from sharing information about working conditions with external parties ...'
No agree .... No job .... Simples.
That sort of all encompassing NDA would presumably include (whether specified or not) ...
a) Posting 'anonymously' on PPRune - "We can find out where you live ... "
b) Discussing T&C .... "Directly with your union ..." or "on a union forum."
c) "What union ... ?" = "No Union"
d) That'll apply to all potential employees.
No agree .... No job .... Simples.
LFH
...
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The Captains had quite a bump up in Flybe 1 I think around 2017/18?
£70kish starting plus flight pay etc would take you to £80kish.
FO
£29k starting with extras £39k.
SFO after couple of years
£45k extras £55k
You could also bump these up quite a bit more with working days off. In some cases another £10k+ on top.
I have also heard rumours of Flybe 2 salaries being in ballpark of posted earlier.
I know FOs at Logan after 2 years earning mid £30k so yes Flybe are going in low.
Tough times out there. Take it or leave it.
£70kish starting plus flight pay etc would take you to £80kish.
FO
£29k starting with extras £39k.
SFO after couple of years
£45k extras £55k
You could also bump these up quite a bit more with working days off. In some cases another £10k+ on top.
I have also heard rumours of Flybe 2 salaries being in ballpark of posted earlier.
I know FOs at Logan after 2 years earning mid £30k so yes Flybe are going in low.
Tough times out there. Take it or leave it.
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...
Thanks for posting that Tubby.
No agree .... No job .... Simples.
That sort of all encompassing NDA would presumably include (whether specified or not) ...
a) Posting 'anonymously' on PPRune - "We can find out where you live ... "
b) Discussing T&C .... "Directly with your union ..." or "on a union forum."
c) "What union ... ?" = "No Union"
d) That'll apply to all potential employees.
No agree .... No job .... Simples.
LFH
...
Thanks for posting that Tubby.
No agree .... No job .... Simples.
That sort of all encompassing NDA would presumably include (whether specified or not) ...
a) Posting 'anonymously' on PPRune - "We can find out where you live ... "
b) Discussing T&C .... "Directly with your union ..." or "on a union forum."
c) "What union ... ?" = "No Union"
d) That'll apply to all potential employees.
No agree .... No job .... Simples.
LFH
...
I'm sure this country used to have laws protecting citizens against this sort of practice.
Ah well, you get the politicians and laws you deserve. Well done everyone who voted Conservative since 1979 and most recently to leave the EU.
Ah well, you get the politicians and laws you deserve. Well done everyone who voted Conservative since 1979 and most recently to leave the EU.
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Hey,
Does anybody know how to apply to them? According to Pilot Career Center you can send a cv through the mail. Surly that can't be right??
Thanks
Does anybody know how to apply to them? According to Pilot Career Center you can send a cv through the mail. Surly that can't be right??
Thanks
Hey,
Does anybody know how to apply to them? According to Pilot Career Center you can send a cv through the mail. Surly that can't be right??
Thanks
Does anybody know how to apply to them? According to Pilot Career Center you can send a cv through the mail. Surly that can't be right??
Thanks
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I am on a 2 year dry spell and need something haha
