Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Terms and Endearment
Reload this Page >

Ryanair let cabin crew sleep on the floor.

Terms and Endearment The forum the bean counters hoped would never happen. Your news on pay, rostering, allowances, extras and negotiations where you work - scheduled, charter or contract.

Ryanair let cabin crew sleep on the floor.

Old 16th Oct 2018, 16:54
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: 60 north
Age: 56
Posts: 19
Many a Commuting pilot has used the Crew room as a hotel.
I even found the Base captain sleeping in the office one morning , before an early duty.
Some years ago mind you.
BluSdUp is offline  
Old 16th Oct 2018, 17:14
  #22 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 14
What's stopping the captain of the flight crew from booking a hotel and taking his crew along with him for a proper rest? Not the best solution, I know, but just curious?
Nurse2Pilot is offline  
Old 16th Oct 2018, 22:48
  #23 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Brasil
Age: 38
Posts: 135
Not even the captain alone...

35 seconds on Booking dot com.. similar deals on other sites, tripadvisor etc and I can find 193 properties within ten kms of the airport in Malaga, beds in hostels starting from 12 euros, hotel rooms starting from 35 euros. If you know you need to overnight, grow up, find it yourself and get back to the airport in time for your flight home. Then invoice.

Just to quash any other rumours here... the crew did not operted the next day.
JumpJumpJump is offline  
Old 16th Oct 2018, 22:55
  #24 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: at the edge of the alps
Posts: 382
If the crew had a layover - planned or unplanned - in Malaga, it was Ryanair's duty to provide them with suitable accommodation. Unless they got it, they cannot be considered "rested" for the return flight.

Unfortunately it is a design error of EU aviation rules, that they apply to everyone in principle but how they are actually applied is decided by national authorities which may or may not have an agenda of their own, rather than a common European aviation authority which could enforce a single way of reading those rules.
Alpine Flyer is offline  
Old 16th Oct 2018, 23:15
  #25 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Brasil
Age: 38
Posts: 135
I get that it is the airlines responsibility. I personally would have elected a hostel or hotel over the crew room and then argued the toss after.
JumpJumpJump is offline  
Old 16th Oct 2018, 23:21
  #26 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Brasil
Age: 38
Posts: 135
I also want to make it known that I understand and backthe crew in choosing to bring this to public attention
JumpJumpJump is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 00:21
  #27 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 14
What if the crew picked up their stuff, found themselves a hotel room, got proper rest on a proper bed.... but did all this from their own pocket, are they considered "rested" and can they then work on the return flight?
Nurse2Pilot is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 02:20
  #28 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 185
Originally Posted by Nurse2Pilot View Post
What's stopping the captain of the flight crew from booking a hotel and taking his crew along with him for a proper rest? Not the best solution, I know, but just curious?
If you start down that route you are quickly expected to do that for every layover. Cheap upfront financing for FR. And invoicing after the fact is a slow process there, where you are likely to only see maybe halve the money again due to some limit rule they will drag out. Crew fought hard for company supplied overnighting but there will be some run-in problems until control is up to scratch with a full sized for all eventualitiest list of pre-agreed and contracted suppliers around every airport.
vikingivesterled is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 06:21
  #29 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Uk
Posts: 0
I’m hoping they didn’t report for duty after that ( if true ). In no way can that be adequate rest.

Meester proach is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 07:37
  #30 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Europe
Posts: 1,679
Not even the captain alone...

35 seconds on Booking dot com.. similar deals on other sites, tripadvisor etc and I can find 193 properties within ten kms of the airport in Malaga, beds in hostels starting from 12 euros, hotel rooms starting from 35 euros. If you know you need to overnight, grow up, find it yourself and get back to the airport in time for your flight home. Then invoice.
This is the point where self respect ought kick in.
Recently in Sydney, a rather large thunderstorm stranded many thousands of passengers.

The crews including pilots, totaling some 60 odd staff were told the same crap regarding hotel 'availability'
Of course it is true that there were no hotels that night at $35 per night, there were hotels.
Any pilot, particularly a Captain, knows he or she would find it incredibly difficult to defend him or herself the next day were an incident to occur. Sleeping in a terminal is not "accommodation of a suitable standard". Yet sleep in the terminal they did and operate the next day.

1. Turn on ipad
2. Book room
3. Proceed to hotel and sleep.
4. Turn phone on the next day when sufficient rest obtained.
5. Send invoice to company.
6. Passenger home.

They did get a nice group email thanking them for their service from their 'manager' who reports suggest enjoyed the storm from the comfort of her own bed.
Rated De is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 09:19
  #31 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 14
Originally Posted by vikingivesterled View Post
If you start down that route you are quickly expected to do that for every layover. Cheap upfront financing for FR. And invoicing after the fact is a slow process there, where you are likely to only see maybe halve the money again due to some limit rule they will drag out. Crew fought hard for company supplied overnighting but there will be some run-in problems until control is up to scratch with a full sized for all eventualitiest list of pre-agreed and contracted suppliers around every airport.
As opposed to the more immediate danger of fatigued crew doing their duties? Would it not be more evidence of FR's shortcomings if captains were able to produce memos or emails of "no hotels available" and then receipts of him booking accomodations for his crew for that same night? Even if FR would eventually only reimburse 50% or even 0% of the cost, would these captains not be able to use this situation to their advantage within FR or even when applying to another airline?
Nurse2Pilot is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 10:52
  #32 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Europe
Posts: 1,679
Originally Posted by Nurse2Pilot View Post
As opposed to the more immediate danger of fatigued crew doing their duties? Would it not be more evidence of FR's shortcomings if captains were able to produce memos or emails of "no hotels available" and then receipts of him booking accomodations for his crew for that same night? Even if FR would eventually only reimburse 50% or even 0% of the cost, would these captains not be able to use this situation to their advantage within FR or even when applying to another airline?
That is a pertinent point.
The regulatory environment provides all the protection from an employer, even one as adversarial as O'Leary with an IR posture the envy of most airline management.
Using the regulatory protection available requires:

1. Knowledge of the regulations
2. When to apply them necessitating the PIC have cojones (non-gender specific)

In the modern day adversarial airline IR model, many pilots adhere to the company documents which whilst oftentimes incorporate the statute, gloss over things like strict liability and instead offer 'company pleasing' alternatives.
Sadly with big mortgages and little knowledge of the statutory protection, many pilots surrender point two when signing on.
Rated De is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 14:45
  #33 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,913
Just as a general point whilst it’s often possible to whistle up hotel room, perhaps with a bit of effort, I’ve seen at one instance of Force Majure where the only sensible choice was for crew to sleep in offices and briefing rooms.... LHR, snow and several thousand stranded pax being dispersed to on and off airport hotels .... and public transport going to hell in a handcart before crew were stood down.

However there was never any question of any of those crewmembers being required to operate the next day.
wiggy is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 15:19
  #34 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: World
Posts: 0
aviationfanatic is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 15:45
  #35 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 898
Originally Posted by aviationfanatic View Post
Oops. That camera looks very sneaky though, are they being filmed without their knowledge? Will certainly be checking my (non RYR) crew room later this evening!
giggitygiggity is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 15:52
  #36 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Milton Keynes
Posts: 48
Originally Posted by giggitygiggity View Post
Oops. That camera looks very sneaky though, are they being filmed without their knowledge? Will certainly be checking my (non RYR) crew room later this evening!
its common practice, loads of cash in those crew rooms, never bothered me when i was there
jonesyinthesky is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 17:10
  #37 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Amantido
Posts: 555
It might have been scripted, but their action still has a meaning: they were left there with nobody reachable.
Banana Joe is online now  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 17:11
  #38 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: World
Posts: 0
Originally Posted by Banana Joe View Post
It might have been scripted, but their action still has a meaning: they were left there with nobody reachable.
Sorry Banana Joe, just wondering, how do you know that nobody was reachable? thanks
aviationfanatic is offline  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 18:14
  #39 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Switzerland ... oh wait: Swaziland
Posts: 584
Classis case of 'you pay peanuts...'
Cunning plan, top notch execution.
TBSC is online now  
Old 17th Oct 2018, 21:15
  #40 (permalink)  

Avoid imitations
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Posts: 12,987
Originally Posted by Nurse2Pilot View Post
What if the crew picked up their stuff, found themselves a hotel room, got proper rest on a proper bed.... but did all this from their own pocket, are they considered "rested" and can they then work on the return flight?
This isn't unusual - speaking as one expected to do this for every night stop. I keep the receipts then claim back expenses necessarily spent on behalf of the company.

Seems the point here is how much effort the company in question will put in on behalf of their employees' well being.
ShyTorque is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.