Captain shortage or poor conditions?
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2016
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From: Earth
Captain shortage or poor conditions?
I had never seen so many ads for quick upgrade jobs, is this a sign of a shortage or just the usual failure to attract qualified capts due to poor conditions? Why they don't increase the terms instead? Ther's even 2 chineese airlines, the package doesn't look too bad...
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1
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From: Worldwide
Obviously captains or senior FO Shortage due to poor conditions. If they want to contract all the pilots that takes their families and went to ME or Asia they will have to increase considerably the conditions. All the LCC in Europe are watching each other for delaying as much as posible but the fact is that there is not a magic way and the economical crisis has passed so not to many birds in the air flying for peanuts at this time.
Things are things.
Things are things.
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,777
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From: Blighty
It's a bit of everything. There are more pilots required, but less available. Several experienced pilots have recently left my company to quite flying altogether. The working conditions are worse than before, they've just had enough. And I know how they feel!
I get the same e-mails - same old companies. Lots in China, where the working conditions as so poor that not even the big $ will attract the pilots - and new low cost hopefuls like small planet where the remuneration is pants.
Were now at a place where the constantly decreasing terms and conditions have made this job much less attractive and there are not enough pilots. The industry has driven this in the race for more profits and have painted themselves into a corner.
I get the same e-mails - same old companies. Lots in China, where the working conditions as so poor that not even the big $ will attract the pilots - and new low cost hopefuls like small planet where the remuneration is pants.
Were now at a place where the constantly decreasing terms and conditions have made this job much less attractive and there are not enough pilots. The industry has driven this in the race for more profits and have painted themselves into a corner.
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 14
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From: Earth
I agree it's probably a bit of everything. Some of those offers (links removed now) were from lowcost airlines which notoriously offer low salaries, but there are even 3 chineese airlines offering packages in the region of 20000$ and above with commuting and one was even for long haul, how come they don't get enough applicants?
Another thing that I find surprising is that 2 of those offer are from lufthansa group airlines, I thought the union was very strong there and would prevent things like this...
Another thing that I find surprising is that 2 of those offer are from lufthansa group airlines, I thought the union was very strong there and would prevent things like this...
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,563
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From: I wouldn't know.
Eurowings Europe (not to be confused with Eurowings germany which isn't hiring) is basically the union buster airline within the lufthansa group, built specifically for that purpose by the management within union. As it is based in Austria the german unions do not have any reach there.
Pretty much the same holds true for Sunexpress germany which is actually a joint venture with turkish airlines and not unionised.
Pretty much the same holds true for Sunexpress germany which is actually a joint venture with turkish airlines and not unionised.
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 911
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From: FL510
People complain a lot about Norwegian Air International paying low salaries. As far as I know a captain on 787 get get 9000 Euro net.
An Airbus A330 captain with SunExpress Germany (Eurowings livery) has about 6800 euros, before German tax!
An Airbus A330 captain with SunExpress Germany (Eurowings livery) has about 6800 euros, before German tax!
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 145
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From: Mediterranean
I agree it's probably a bit of everything. Some of those offers (links removed now) were from lowcost airlines which notoriously offer low salaries, but there are even 3 chineese airlines offering packages in the region of 20000$ and above with commuting and one was even for long haul, how come they don't get enough applicants?
The medical, bureaucracy, hygiene, pollution, culture, safety, CRM, contracts not being respected, language barrier, distance to go home etc.
Joined: Jun 2016
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From: Austria
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 145
Likes: 0
From: Mediterranean
People complain a lot about Norwegian Air International paying low salaries. As far as I know a captain on 787 get get 9000 Euro net.
An Airbus A330 captain with SunExpress Germany (Eurowings livery) has about 6800 euros, before German tax!
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 532
Likes: 2
From: UK
Some companies quote the usual tripe of "the reason for our crew shortage is that there aren't enough qualified candidates out there." Nonsense, it's just that your Ts & Cs are crap and therefore the crew you're trying to attract aren't interested. They don't want to work like dogs for poor salaries and no home life just so you can pay the ridiculous salaries of the greedy fat cats at the top. Forward-thinking airlines (a rare breed I know) who take a genuine interest in the welfare of their staff (again rare) generally have no problem recruiting.
You can have the best managers in the world running your airline but without crew your aircraft aren't going anywhere, and you need to realise that!
You can have the best managers in the world running your airline but without crew your aircraft aren't going anywhere, and you need to realise that!
Last edited by RAFAT; 7th January 2017 at 18:16.
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 506
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From: U.S.A
The key to recruiting WB skippers is local bases. No one wants to spend 6 weeks on time in Chengdu followed by just 2-3 weeks off.
Offer more local bases in western countries and all sorts of PIC's will come out of the woodwork.
I have quit the longhaul/contract/WB game to return to the RHS of a locally based narrow body.
AND LOVING IT!!!!
Offer more local bases in western countries and all sorts of PIC's will come out of the woodwork.
I have quit the longhaul/contract/WB game to return to the RHS of a locally based narrow body.
AND LOVING IT!!!!
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 662
Likes: 3
From: Somewhere in time
Norwegean pay about 10.5K € and that is before tax and only if you get a Euro base otherwise its about 8500GBP on a LGW base and you are struggling with the exchange rate.
Eurowings does not have a CGN base, its VIE and PMI and it attracts people from other low Budget companies or guys who want a fast command.
@Denti you can't compare a 12 year AB FO with a 2 year Cpt at any other company.
Eurowings does not have a CGN base, its VIE and PMI and it attracts people from other low Budget companies or guys who want a fast command.
@Denti you can't compare a 12 year AB FO with a 2 year Cpt at any other company.
