Easyjet brexit
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Milton Keynes
Posts: 1,070
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think that in or out of the EU it will make sense for the UK to remain part of EASA- overcomes a lot of potential FCL problems.
But don't expect a say in what it does.
Same in my field with the EMA (European Medicines Agency although as that is based in London now, would expect it to move.
That may not be the what Gove-Johnson see however
But don't expect a say in what it does.
Same in my field with the EMA (European Medicines Agency although as that is based in London now, would expect it to move.
That may not be the what Gove-Johnson see however
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Eu
Posts: 950
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sheba, you have erroneously assumed that I was suggesting the UK operation would shut down. There is zero danger of that happening. The establishment of another EU AOC would simply be a way around the trading restrictions that many around here think we'd be faced with. EasyJet already have establishments in Potugal, Spain, Germany, France and Italy. The Swiss AOC has been totally harmonized with the UK. Any new AOC would dovetail into that. The company may have other ideas but you can bet this is already on the table as an option if necessary.
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Centre of Universe
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thad -
UK airlines have been after the level playing field for years. Many of the more mature airlines are being very responsible under the new regs. Few moans and groans on the new longer FDP in the morning and lack of early / late regs which has meant more common sense rostering.
Most of the mature airlines are also protected by scheduling agreements.
Plenty of science also being used, airlines with CAA approved frms having commuting protocols to manage commuting. I suspect also UK AOC's will be leading by example for where the new regs are not so good.
Yeah there will be rogues unfortunately so I agree with your concerns but don't tar all the UK AOC with the same breath
UK airlines have been after the level playing field for years. Many of the more mature airlines are being very responsible under the new regs. Few moans and groans on the new longer FDP in the morning and lack of early / late regs which has meant more common sense rostering.
Most of the mature airlines are also protected by scheduling agreements.
Plenty of science also being used, airlines with CAA approved frms having commuting protocols to manage commuting. I suspect also UK AOC's will be leading by example for where the new regs are not so good.
Yeah there will be rogues unfortunately so I agree with your concerns but don't tar all the UK AOC with the same breath
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: at the edge of the alps
Posts: 447
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
EASA is an EU agency. Look it up on their homepage. EASA rules are applied by non-EASA members as well but they don't get a say when rules are made.
For those hailing the Swiss as a model, they have to copy a lot of (technical) EU Standards without having a say when those standards are set.
As for UK based companies setting up subsidiaries within the EU, depending on the agreements made after a Brexit they might be subject to ownership and Control rules requiring 50%+ EU ownership to have EU traffic rights.
If the UK (or at least parts of it) decide to leave the EU, it would most probably happen for the wrong reasons. I am not a UK citizen but I suspect that much of what has been written here and elsewhere about media influence is unfortunately true.
There are too many people all across the EU who try to make other people believe that the passing of the golden past is the EU's fault and that leaving the EU will allow a return to that (as was very fittingly written here mostly imaginary) past. That even works for countries with a communist past. The world has changed during the last 50 years and we take for granted that the EU has given us three quarters of a century of peace by making it economically unattractive to attack countries you're better off doing business with. If we leave that path by retreating to our own countries, "buying national", valueing locals more than foreigners, there might be a day when we perceive force to be a legitimate or even the only means to pursue our own interests. Look to Ukraine/Russia or back to the Balkan wars to see how it works. Living memory of wars within Europe is dying out rapidly but those people who witnessed it were the most enthusiastic supporters of European Union.
I'd be sorry to see you go but I'd still be against cutting you a "leave but keep all the benefits" deal....
For those hailing the Swiss as a model, they have to copy a lot of (technical) EU Standards without having a say when those standards are set.
As for UK based companies setting up subsidiaries within the EU, depending on the agreements made after a Brexit they might be subject to ownership and Control rules requiring 50%+ EU ownership to have EU traffic rights.
If the UK (or at least parts of it) decide to leave the EU, it would most probably happen for the wrong reasons. I am not a UK citizen but I suspect that much of what has been written here and elsewhere about media influence is unfortunately true.
There are too many people all across the EU who try to make other people believe that the passing of the golden past is the EU's fault and that leaving the EU will allow a return to that (as was very fittingly written here mostly imaginary) past. That even works for countries with a communist past. The world has changed during the last 50 years and we take for granted that the EU has given us three quarters of a century of peace by making it economically unattractive to attack countries you're better off doing business with. If we leave that path by retreating to our own countries, "buying national", valueing locals more than foreigners, there might be a day when we perceive force to be a legitimate or even the only means to pursue our own interests. Look to Ukraine/Russia or back to the Balkan wars to see how it works. Living memory of wars within Europe is dying out rapidly but those people who witnessed it were the most enthusiastic supporters of European Union.
I'd be sorry to see you go but I'd still be against cutting you a "leave but keep all the benefits" deal....
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: california
Age: 66
Posts: 345
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
polax52 - "Well talking of Stupid and unintelligent, that statement is an assumption and not based on knowledge.
We don't know what happens after the vote to Brexit, its the classic law of unintended consequences. "
Yes we do know that to exit EU, it would be over a 2 year period. Again just shows some of the stupidity on these forums, some are just playing guessing games, and don't have a clue. This has been documented multiple places in the media, so yes we do know. UK even if vote out of EU, it would still need to be member for another 2 years before exiting.
The government could even ignore the result of the vote if they wished to. But we know status quo will exist for at least 2 years after request to leave the EU, this is NOT the date of the vote. 49.
We don't know what happens after the vote to Brexit, its the classic law of unintended consequences. "
Yes we do know that to exit EU, it would be over a 2 year period. Again just shows some of the stupidity on these forums, some are just playing guessing games, and don't have a clue. This has been documented multiple places in the media, so yes we do know. UK even if vote out of EU, it would still need to be member for another 2 years before exiting.
The government could even ignore the result of the vote if they wished to. But we know status quo will exist for at least 2 years after request to leave the EU, this is NOT the date of the vote. 49.
Two years should be enough time to give notice to the thousands of British Pilots currently working in European bases and train EU passport holders to replace them.
Do you believe that a Brexit would be good for UK passport holding Pilots?
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: california
Age: 66
Posts: 345
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi Syntax.
Go back and read post number 45...... It is a very good article and clearly explains why we may not be able to join the EEA and also why we may not want to.
Whilst Britain, having voted for an out, would be obliged to provide work permits to EU citizens currently working in the UK, no EU nation would be obliged to reciprocate. It may well be a one way situation where foreign passport holders continue to work in the UK whilst British passport holders are forced to return to the UK.
What I seem to read in what most Outers argue is that nothing would change, well if that is what they want then why vote "out". Unfortunately things for British pilots would change dramatically for the worse.
I am a British/American but in my career 90% of the best work has come from having an EU passport.
Go back and read post number 45...... It is a very good article and clearly explains why we may not be able to join the EEA and also why we may not want to.
Whilst Britain, having voted for an out, would be obliged to provide work permits to EU citizens currently working in the UK, no EU nation would be obliged to reciprocate. It may well be a one way situation where foreign passport holders continue to work in the UK whilst British passport holders are forced to return to the UK.
What I seem to read in what most Outers argue is that nothing would change, well if that is what they want then why vote "out". Unfortunately things for British pilots would change dramatically for the worse.
I am a British/American but in my career 90% of the best work has come from having an EU passport.
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: South of the Watford Gap, East of Portland
Posts: 255
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nothing would change......apart from the inexorable march towards a centrally controlled unification of European states run by a democratically deficient oligarchy at its centre.
It would appear from your post viz Anglo American and worked in Europe that you have no particular loyalty to either side. That, of course, is your right but for those of us that see the EU experiment, albeit noble in its foundation but now an anachronism that faces financial decline and social unrest in the globalised world, there is only one way to restore that ability of the UK to determine, for better or worst, its own future and destiny.
It would appear from your post viz Anglo American and worked in Europe that you have no particular loyalty to either side. That, of course, is your right but for those of us that see the EU experiment, albeit noble in its foundation but now an anachronism that faces financial decline and social unrest in the globalised world, there is only one way to restore that ability of the UK to determine, for better or worst, its own future and destiny.
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: where I lay my hat
Posts: 151
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Even now, several operators are favoring hiring UK pilots because it is cheaper and less burdensome to do so; I expect that factor would be even greater if the EU employment regulations, obligations and costs were removed.
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Dubai
Age: 43
Posts: 415
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Plastic 787- I am just making a request that we keep this thread Pilot related and not political. Jet Blast is perfectly adequate for political comments.
Midnight cruiser- in the disastrous event of a leave vote, British Airlines will be firing not hiring, for all of the previously explained reasons, read post 45. Also because, short term certainly, the value of the pound will go down discouraging travel.
Midnight cruiser- in the disastrous event of a leave vote, British Airlines will be firing not hiring, for all of the previously explained reasons, read post 45. Also because, short term certainly, the value of the pound will go down discouraging travel.
Of all the airlines to be exposed to this, BA are probably the least affected of all. In any case the overwhelming odds are that practically absolutely nothing will change and that, as per usual, this is a load of hot air. Are you old enough to remember fully the scare stories surrounding the Y2K bug when apparently the sky was about to fall in because a digit was going to reset to zero?
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Dubai
Age: 43
Posts: 415
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Plastic787- "Probably nothing will change".....OK, so that sounds like you don't want anything to change so then why vote for change?
One change is that you would lose your EU passport which includes your right to apply for the many Pilot jobs in the EU, or jobs that require the right to live, work, travel freely within the EU.
Read post 45. BA could be severely effected, depending on the merciful US government, Airlines and Unions.
One change is that you would lose your EU passport which includes your right to apply for the many Pilot jobs in the EU, or jobs that require the right to live, work, travel freely within the EU.
Read post 45. BA could be severely effected, depending on the merciful US government, Airlines and Unions.
Kungfu Panda we get it, the sky is about to fall in. Just like it has with Anthropegenic Global Warming, Y2K, AIDS, BSE, Bird Flu, Swine Flu, Ebola to name just a few scenarios that have been blown out of all proportion by the doomsday brigade in my lifetime. The fact of the matter is that the extreme worse case almost never occurs, ditto for the extreme best case. The truth lies somewhere in between.
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Dubai
Age: 43
Posts: 415
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
plastic787- Maybe but why would you unnecessarily take the risk? A lot of British Pilot jobs could be on the line and British Pilots could be seriously devalued. Why do we have to risk it? please justify.
Why do I have to lose my EU passport?
Why do I have to lose my EU passport?
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Dubai
Age: 43
Posts: 415
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Syntax: Things will change if for example: I come back from China without an EU passport and I wish to apply for Easyjet Portugal, lets say. That door will be closed because I don't have an EU passport.
All this because rather than campaigning to change the EU, you wish to have a total reset. You are clearly willing to sc... many of your colleagues in order to have your political whims come true.
All this because rather than campaigning to change the EU, you wish to have a total reset. You are clearly willing to sc... many of your colleagues in order to have your political whims come true.
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Hyeres, France
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A nice comment, yesterday, by Jeremy Paxman, ex-BBC journalist when discussing the likely outcome of the referendum -
If you think your national destiny should be determined by where easyJet can land, well, good luck to you
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: London
Posts: 611
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
kungFu panda said
"It'll be great for European Pilots as the British Pilots are no longer able to apply. Rising wages in Europe, collapsing wages in the UK."
and
"A lot of British Pilot jobs could be on the line and British Pilots could be seriously devalued"
Presumably all of the many non-British EU pilots currently employed by British operators and based in the UK will be required to return home and could potentially replace all those British pilots that you say will no longer have the right to work there? That's a good thing if you feel there are really that many British pilots flying for non-British EU employers, because there are a lot of non-British EU pilots employed by UK operators. Job protectionism across most of the EU is absolutely rife - in my view the UK is the only state that has adequately embraced the principal of free movement of workers within the EU with respect to aircrew employment. On the contrary, this could be a very good thing for British pilots.
"It'll be great for European Pilots as the British Pilots are no longer able to apply. Rising wages in Europe, collapsing wages in the UK."
and
"A lot of British Pilot jobs could be on the line and British Pilots could be seriously devalued"
Presumably all of the many non-British EU pilots currently employed by British operators and based in the UK will be required to return home and could potentially replace all those British pilots that you say will no longer have the right to work there? That's a good thing if you feel there are really that many British pilots flying for non-British EU employers, because there are a lot of non-British EU pilots employed by UK operators. Job protectionism across most of the EU is absolutely rife - in my view the UK is the only state that has adequately embraced the principal of free movement of workers within the EU with respect to aircrew employment. On the contrary, this could be a very good thing for British pilots.
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Dubai
Age: 43
Posts: 415
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Reverserbucket_ Read post 45 to start.
Britain will be obligated to grandfather the rights of Foreign EU employees currently working in the UK. It'll be the opposite with other EU nations who will not have and will not choose to have a work permit infrastructure set up to grandfather the rights of British employees and particularly British Pilots (remember after a Brexit there will be a punitive response to Britain). British Pilots working throughout Europe at bases such as Leipzig, Bergamo, Hahn etc etc etc would\could be sent home on a nation by nation basis to swamp the UK with Pilots. Don't forget the UK is a significant net exporter of Pilots. At Leipzig there must be 200-300 British Pilots.
The only sensible conclusion is that a leave vote would be suicidal for British Pilots.
Britain will be obligated to grandfather the rights of Foreign EU employees currently working in the UK. It'll be the opposite with other EU nations who will not have and will not choose to have a work permit infrastructure set up to grandfather the rights of British employees and particularly British Pilots (remember after a Brexit there will be a punitive response to Britain). British Pilots working throughout Europe at bases such as Leipzig, Bergamo, Hahn etc etc etc would\could be sent home on a nation by nation basis to swamp the UK with Pilots. Don't forget the UK is a significant net exporter of Pilots. At Leipzig there must be 200-300 British Pilots.
The only sensible conclusion is that a leave vote would be suicidal for British Pilots.