BA Direct Entry Pilot.
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
From: London
The worst short haul job? Do 5 years and you’ll barely work a weekend ever again with your choice of earlies / lates / daytrips / tours.
The days at work are so much easier compared to low cost, you just need to figure out how to not be bothered by the BA machine. I really enjoy it!
The days at work are so much easier compared to low cost, you just need to figure out how to not be bothered by the BA machine. I really enjoy it!
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
From: Uk
In-between is slightly difficult because you are limited to the outer edges of the southern M25. So places like Epsom, Weybridge, Chertsey, Guildford! All very expensive. Once you know your base you can draw a 30 miles ring and almost pick anywhere. I can’t really talk about LGW but I live just west of LHR in Buckinghamshire, lots of lovely places out that way. Henley, Marlow, Amersham. Oxfordshire even Chinnor, Thame, Oxford. Basically follow the M40 or M4 out of London and most places are nice and a lot cheaper than the city.
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 187
Likes: 0
From: Under the table
Cool. I live in a lovely house in the Sussex countryside, near a lovely school, spend every night in my own bed and I leave the house 25 mins before report time. I know which I'd prefer!
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 66
Likes: 25
From: UK
The worst short haul job? Do 5 years and you’ll barely work a weekend ever again with your choice of earlies / lates / daytrips / tours.
The days at work are so much easier compared to low cost, you just need to figure out how to not be bothered by the BA machine. I really enjoy it!
The days at work are so much easier compared to low cost, you just need to figure out how to not be bothered by the BA machine. I really enjoy it!
If if you want to stay in the RHS then you’ll probably do ok, but the people that choose to do that rather than move on to other fleets and seats are few and far between.
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 995
Likes: 103
From: Botswana
Have you seen a junior LH roster nowadays? At least in the days of Bidline you had Seeded Blindlines and you could go somewhere decent and not work too too hard. Nowadays you can expect to pick up all the crap, with six trips with minimum days off in between. There’s guys now actively bidding for reserve because it gives them a better work/life balance, that’s saying something! Virgin fly 750 hours a year on a full time roster to our 900. That alone disproves your point. The case of the DEP who did a couple of months on the 787, took the type rating then buggered off to Virgin tells its own story.
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 314
Likes: 0
From: Button Moon
Have you seen a junior LH roster nowadays? At least in the days of Bidline you had Seeded Blindlines and you could go somewhere decent and not work too too hard. Nowadays you can expect to pick up all the crap, with six trips with minimum days off in between. There’s guys now actively bidding for reserve because it gives them a better work/life balance, that’s saying something! Virgin fly 750 hours a year on a full time roster to our 900. That alone disproves your point. The case of the DEP who did a couple of months on the 787, took the type rating then buggered off to Virgin tells its own story.
Just for completeness, Seeded Blindlines were ONLY on the 747.....the other long haul fleets weren't so lucky. However when I joined on a LH Fleet Blindlines were pretty good and trading with EOT was very easy allowing me to totally rewrite my roster some months.
I'm currently about 2/3 down the P2 list on the 777.....rosters are manageable but under JSS I'm very realistic about what I can expect so bid accordingly. My real gripe at the moment is the number of weekends worked per annum which is ridiculous. In fact it's having a very serious impact on my family life. That said, I met a lovely bloke on my last trip who's just vacated the LHS of the Bus to return to the RHS on the triple. So short of moving to the RHS of the SH Bus and gaining a huge chunk of relative seniority I'm stuck with it. Hopefully the efforts towards getting a fairer balance of weekends off can be achieved soon!
As you say, stories of DEP's joining then swiftly leaving (I know of at least 2 other guys who've done the same) and people giving up a BA Short Haul Command to return to the RHS on a Long Haul fleet to regain some sort of life out of work says a lot!!! Pretty sad really isn't it.
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
From: London
Not true. These days 5yrs will likely give you the seniority for the LHS on short haul, where you will be as junior as it gets and staring down the barrel of some really grim rosters for a very long time.
If if you want to stay in the RHS then you’ll probably do ok, but the people that choose to do that rather than move on to other fleets and seats are few and far between.
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 314
Likes: 0
From: Button Moon
Are they? Bugger! I'd heard it was getting more difficult to achieve Part Time. I've been giving it very serious consideration. As eluded to above, people clambering for part time, leaving the company soon after joining and giving up short haul command all paints a grim picture of life in the bottom half of the list.
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
From: UK
Have you seen a junior LH roster nowadays? At least in the days of Bidline you had Seeded Blindlines and you could go somewhere decent and not work too too hard. Nowadays you can expect to pick up all the crap, with six trips with minimum days off in between. There’s guys now actively bidding for reserve because it gives them a better work/life balance, that’s saying something! Virgin fly 750 hours a year on a full time roster to our 900. That alone disproves your point. The case of the DEP who did a couple of months on the 787, took the type rating then buggered off to Virgin tells its own story.
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
From: London
And the people who have moved from Virgin to BA on the 787? What’s their reasoning? As always you need to take a long-term view to a career at BA. In terms of variety and career options it’s hard to beat. I have flown 700 hours full time (including positioning) in the last 12 months so the thought of an extra 50 elsewhere is frightening! Point re-proven.
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 898
Likes: 74
From: UK
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 54
Likes: 1
From: UK
I’m guessing you mean it’s unlikely anyone’s done less that 700 hours on LH?
If not in the last few years I’ve done no more than 650-700 full time LGW, with no long term absence. I do work every weekend though
If not in the last few years I’ve done no more than 650-700 full time LGW, with no long term absence. I do work every weekend though
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 276
Likes: 1
From: South of the North pole
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 387
Likes: 1
From: Centre of Universe
Just for completeness, Seeded Blindlines were ONLY on the 747.....the other long haul fleets weren't so lucky. However when I joined on a LH Fleet Blindlines were pretty good and trading with EOT was very easy allowing me to totally rewrite my roster some months.
I'm currently about 2/3 down the P2 list on the 777.....rosters are manageable but under JSS I'm very realistic about what I can expect so bid accordingly. My real gripe at the moment is the number of weekends worked per annum which is ridiculous. In fact it's having a very serious impact on my family life. That said, I met a lovely bloke on my last trip who's just vacated the LHS of the Bus to return to the RHS on the triple. So short of moving to the RHS of the SH Bus and gaining a huge chunk of relative seniority I'm stuck with it. Hopefully the efforts towards getting a fairer balance of weekends off can be achieved soon!
As you say, stories of DEP's joining then swiftly leaving (I know of at least 2 other guys who've done the same) and people giving up a BA Short Haul Command to return to the RHS on a Long Haul fleet to regain some sort of life out of work says a lot!!! Pretty sad really isn't it.
I'm currently about 2/3 down the P2 list on the 777.....rosters are manageable but under JSS I'm very realistic about what I can expect so bid accordingly. My real gripe at the moment is the number of weekends worked per annum which is ridiculous. In fact it's having a very serious impact on my family life. That said, I met a lovely bloke on my last trip who's just vacated the LHS of the Bus to return to the RHS on the triple. So short of moving to the RHS of the SH Bus and gaining a huge chunk of relative seniority I'm stuck with it. Hopefully the efforts towards getting a fairer balance of weekends off can be achieved soon!
As you say, stories of DEP's joining then swiftly leaving (I know of at least 2 other guys who've done the same) and people giving up a BA Short Haul Command to return to the RHS on a Long Haul fleet to regain some sort of life out of work says a lot!!! Pretty sad really isn't it.
Back in the good ole days there was no such thing as part time. Now days there is one UK AOC (big red and yellow machine) that's see's part time as a positive way of keeping its crews,(probably 20% are P/T) This ensures their loyalty (most of the time), offering fixed roster pattern for a large amount of crew and has agreements for days off in a year (never enough for Nigel's but a good amount) and has an agreement on weekends off also.
The problem for BALPA is getting their members to think collectively rather than just for themselves - Good luck with that. If BA are to offer more weekends they will want something back e.g. no payrise, 1000 hours etc etc
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 724
Likes: 24
From: UK
If BA are to offer more weekends they will want something back e.g. no payrise, 1000 hours etc etc
Weekends off come more frequently with seniority in a seniority driven system. It’s really as simple as that. All the collective Nigelism in the world won’t stop the need for Saturday-Sunday reports.
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
Agreed..the company could reduce exposure to weekends by reducing CAP, which would mean either reducing the flying programme or employing a lot more pilots..what are the chances
Wanting weekends off isn't something new but there isn't a complete fix and even those of us on senior long haul rosters will see work touch or completely cover the majority of weekends in a month ( though you do bump into the irritating outliers who like to claim they never work weekends..).
Re Part Time and Aiminghigh's question:
..I don't have the numbers to hand but:
I gather getting an Aspirational Part Time Contract ( as in I'd like Part Time) is rather problematic.
Some folks are getting a "no" to " to asks for "Right to Request" contracts.
So yes, the observation that people are having difficulty getting a part time contracts is true.
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 1,174
Likes: 123
From: uk
BMRR. Not wanting to distract from what is a BA thread but comparisons can be useful and the point made was that the red and yellow machine has weekends off as part of a scheduling agreement rather than being miserable for a number of years until seniority becomes your friend.
Freight does move at weekends and plenty of crews have weekends away from home in all sorts of places. Also getting home am sat after a string of nights doesn’t really count as a weekend off, neither does reporting sun pm.
Out of interest does BA have a contractual annual Days free of Duty total? (Leave plus OFF days). How far in advance is the roster published? Once published can the days worked be adjusted without consent?
just curious.
Freight does move at weekends and plenty of crews have weekends away from home in all sorts of places. Also getting home am sat after a string of nights doesn’t really count as a weekend off, neither does reporting sun pm.
Out of interest does BA have a contractual annual Days free of Duty total? (Leave plus OFF days). How far in advance is the roster published? Once published can the days worked be adjusted without consent?
just curious.
Last edited by deltahotel; 5th July 2019 at 10:34.
