BA Direct Entry Pilot.
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
From: UK
Speaking from my own personal experience, the T’s & C’s on offer at BA, along with the ‘fringe benefits’ far outweigh that of my previous employer.
So for some of us, the move is definitely a positive.
Just my two cents though.
So for some of us, the move is definitely a positive.
Just my two cents though.
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 995
Likes: 103
From: Botswana
Struggling with the accuracy description of a “mediocre” pension too, tell me where you’re going to find better in the UK now given that pretty much all final salary schemes are now closed in all industries, not just ours? In that context, it’s actually pretty decent.
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
From: UK
I do take your point, “mediocre” is perhaps a little flippant but for somebody leaving either of the above, as but two examples, it’s a definite backward step and probably not industry leading if you already have your feet under the table elsewhere. But yes, I would agree fairly decent in this day and age in the context of UK airlines.
Last edited by FRYVA; 15th March 2019 at 19:42.
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 995
Likes: 103
From: Botswana
Virgin has exactly the same company contribution as the new BA scheme so its on par not better. Not only that but they (VS) want to remove this benefit to new joiners. Thomas Cook as you said not available any more either, so whatever you think of the BA pension, you’re not going to find anything better as a new joiner anywhere nowadays. I do take your other points though, BA isn’t for everyone, I’ve wrestled with the decision whether to leave myself over the last few months, I’m staying put and the only reason for that is Long Haul. Short Haul (whilst I’ve already said it’s not as bad as many make out on here) there are better options out there nowadays.
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
From: Inglaterra
What sort of fringe benefits are there exactly?
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
From: United Kingdom
Sorry if this is not strictly on the topic but has anyone any idea how long the swim is in the BACF hold pool? Any chaps or chapesses on here in this pool? The recruitment process was the exact same as the DEP and done at waterside, just thought i'd ask here...
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,729
Likes: 104
From: The Winchester
Hi everyone. Managed to work my way through the last two years of this thread and got a lot of answers but if someone could help me out with just a couple of questions I would be very grateful.....
Commuter Specific:
Commuter Specific:
- Do people literally set up shop in London for 21 days of reserve?
- Any hope of getting home between trips while on reserve if on LH?
- Given the apparent crack down, are commuters still finding they can commute and still maintain a sustainable lifestyle?
- Is there a minimum number of days off between trips?
- In terms of practicality, can staff travel be used for commuting?
- Is it still possible to swap duties to get some sort of favourable roster?
- As a commuter would you stand any chance of binning your standbys for a flying duty to save a possible wasted trip?
Firstly for those that are wondering about the specifics - Reserve period (Long Haul) is a 28 day block, first 7 days clear of work then 21 available days during which you can be assigned a duty, either flying or a "Home Standby" (HSB). You normally get notified of a trip or HSB the evening before the duty and when on HSB the requirement is to be able to get to the Crew car Park at LHR in two hours or less. You can be assigned HSB's on multiple consecutive days...FWIW first 6 days of the period HSB on the trot for me last time around, then, finally, some trips...
Whether you have to live at LHR for the reserve block depends on timings and frequency of commuting flights. The reason for the "depends" is that on Longhaul reserve the general rule is (with the exception of the day of return from a trip) you are "contactable" in an evening for duties the next day ( e.g. flights or a stand-by block)...So you can get a phone call as late as 2000 UK LT informing you of a trip/ standby period the next AM and because of that many Longhaul commuters I know of plan on living around LHR/LGW for the 21 days and grab days off at home as a bonus.
Getting home after a trip on reserve? You are free on the day of arrival back into London (day 1) so you could nip home, but (FTLs allowing) you are then "contactable" the next evening (of day 2) for a duty AM next day (day 3).....it's a personal preference thing.
Plenty still commuting, but the company will still audit. Lifetsyle probably depends on number of trips per-month, gap between trips.
Min time between trips? Driven by bidding and FTLs now, whether you are willing to waive Industrial agreements to pack the work in/get enough work on your line to reach the hours target...You could probably plan on 2 days (3 local nights, longer for some trips with big time zone change elements) but it might suit you to reduce when bidding...
Can staff travel be used for commuting? ATM yes, but watch out trying to commute from somewhere with lots of more senior commuters and not many flights. Other option is slightly (and I means slightly) discounted commercial tickets ("hotlines").
Swapping trips in the general scheme of things when not on reserve is still possible when legal.
Swapping standbys ( when on reserve) with a trip is v tricky...You can tell "crewing" perhaps at the start of the Reserve period that you would prefer trips to standby's, but they are meant to equalise trips and standbys across all those on reserve. Once you actually get nobbled (the evening before) with a standby period for the next day crewing will have run their plan and are unlikely to want to change it...and they do like to keep their standby's intact "just in case".
General Lifestyle on LH fleet:
- Do BA have a sensible approach to 3 and 4 person crews on long sectors to at least mitigate some fatigue?
HTH
Last edited by wiggy; 17th March 2019 at 13:45.
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 187
Likes: 0
From: Under the table
It is marginally better because it includes Flying Pay in the 15% calculation. The reduction in joining pension was suggested but soundly rejected by the current workforce, something which would definitely not happen in BA!
I'd suggest that the current BA workforce are pretty united at the moment though, given the most recent ballot!
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 156
Likes: 42
From: UK
The fact that there are 3 different pension schemes and 2 different salary scales in the company suggests something other than a united workforce. That’s before we start talking about JSS and the differences that’s created between the most junior and the most senior.
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 187
Likes: 0
From: Under the table
Good for Virgin. I still won't be applying to join.
For every year after PP1, it;s higher than the basic pay, all the way up to £40k more on the P1 payscale.
BARP doesn't exist any more, and only one pension scheme now for us all. In fact the only differing thing for us now is PP24 vs PP34 but that's hardly going to affect new joiners is it?
For every year after PP1, it;s higher than the basic pay, all the way up to £40k more on the P1 payscale.
BARP doesn't exist any more, and only one pension scheme now for us all. In fact the only differing thing for us now is PP24 vs PP34 but that's hardly going to affect new joiners is it?
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 156
Likes: 42
From: UK
Good for Virgin. I still won't be applying to join.
For every year after PP1, it;s higher than the basic pay, all the way up to £40k more on the P1 payscale.
BARP doesn't exist any more, and only one pension scheme now for us all. In fact the only differing thing for us now is PP24 vs PP34 but that's hardly going to affect new joiners is it?
For every year after PP1, it;s higher than the basic pay, all the way up to £40k more on the P1 payscale.
BARP doesn't exist any more, and only one pension scheme now for us all. In fact the only differing thing for us now is PP24 vs PP34 but that's hardly going to affect new joiners is it?
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
From: Approaching TOMBI
Thank you for taking the time to reply.
A friend sent me a chunk of sample rosters of junior FO rosters off a cross section of long haul fleets fleets. From some very rough calculations it seems like weekend days off are going to be at a premium.
Percentage of weekends with either a Saturdays or Sundays clear of any duty: 24% (35% Including leave)
Percentage of weekends with either a Saturdays or Sundays was partially off (Allowing for approximately 8 hours of leisure time after a duty) : 16%
Percentage of weekends where both Saturdays and Sundays where spent on duty or away in trip: 59%
Percentage of weekends when the whole weekend was clear of duty: 17% (30% including leave)
Is there anyone who can tell me if these figures are realistic?
Thanks again for any input.
A friend sent me a chunk of sample rosters of junior FO rosters off a cross section of long haul fleets fleets. From some very rough calculations it seems like weekend days off are going to be at a premium.
Percentage of weekends with either a Saturdays or Sundays clear of any duty: 24% (35% Including leave)
Percentage of weekends with either a Saturdays or Sundays was partially off (Allowing for approximately 8 hours of leisure time after a duty) : 16%
Percentage of weekends where both Saturdays and Sundays where spent on duty or away in trip: 59%
Percentage of weekends when the whole weekend was clear of duty: 17% (30% including leave)
Is there anyone who can tell me if these figures are realistic?
Thanks again for any input.
Last edited by Justanothervoice; 18th March 2019 at 14:10. Reason: Clarity and grammar
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
From: Approaching TOMBI
Your reply does seem to tie into what I was which was an awful lot of people could go through a whole month without having even one Saturday or Sunday off.